International Ice at International events

Discussion in 'International Tournaments' started by Bure, Jan 4, 2011.

  1. Bure

    Bure Registered User

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    Is it not fair that most of the time big hockey events are played on north american ice. Being a large advantage for Canada and USA, and a large disadvantage for all european teams. Is it because Canada and USA don't perform as well on International ice there for worse Television ratings? Shouldn't they have a certain rink size that all countries have to follow for all international events, maybe a rink size inbetween North American and International.
     
  2. Roughneck

    Roughneck Registered User

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    Its because the large arenas are built for North American ice. Not too many arenas (maybe none beyond the Saddledome) can actually fit an international rink without major renovations. And the only reason the Dome can do it is because it was built for the Olympics.

    The rink size they should use should be what the host cities have. They should scrap the international monicker and just call it European, save this trouble. With all the international events in North America it something of a dead label, no?
     
  3. JVR

    JVR HeadHitsAreNotIllega

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    I still hope we change to smaller ice in Germany but it's probably way to expensive to change all the arenas.
    I read that Norway is actually building new rinks and arenas with NHL-size rinks.
    I'm officially jealous.
     
  4. Bure

    Bure Registered User

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    I'm just wondering if they should have a certain sized rink for all international events, you don't see soccer having different sized fields at different events, but i think its because of the money, not enough moeny to build an international specialized arena, i wish the euro teams played on small ice it would make things alot easier.
     
  5. Roughneck

    Roughneck Registered User

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    Actually, soccer does have different sized fields. Rugby too. They all fit within certain dimensions but can vary by 10 yards or so in length and width.

    Money is the reason, but Hockey Canada's new home will be an international sized rink.
     
  6. v-man

    v-man Registered User

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    I remember reading that the KHL was looking into switching to NHL size rinks within the next few years, but then again, they say a lot of things that never materialize. As for the ice size in international tournaments, I agree that it is an inconvenience and adjustment to the majority of teams at the WJC, since they play on bigger rinks at home, but it's simply not worth the investment to expand the ice surface at these arenas for two weeks worth of hockey, there's simply no demand for it afterwords. I know in Toronto, the only readily available ice at the Maple Leafs new practice pad is the international rink.
     
  7. BlackAces*

    BlackAces* Guest

    Outside of the World Juniors I have no idea what the hell you are talking/whining about?
     
  8. Street Hawk

    Street Hawk Registered User

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    2 Standards. NHL has the 85 feet width, International has 100 feet.
    Rinks are built to accommodate 1 size, for financial reasons.

    Kind of like NFL vs CFL sized field.

    Sochi is determining which size to use for their rinks.

    I heard in the past that in Finland, they started to use a 92 foot wide rink to help combine the best parts of each rink. 85 might be a tad too small with the increasing size of players. 100 feet is too big and limits physical contact.

    So, going to 92 cuts that difference in half and should open up the ice with only a slight loss of physical contact.
     
  9. Statsy

    Statsy Registered User

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    A standardized size rink would be the best way to make things more fair for everybody, but as many posters have mentioned, it's logistics that hold this back. I also think that both North American and European fans have gotten quite used to their own rink size and would be unwilling to accept the change even if it were possible.

    At least it adds a level of intrigue to a tournament as to whether certain teams can make the adjustments.

    The interesting question that pops into mind is how did we get these two different size standards to begin with? Any hockey historians out there with an idea on that?
     
  10. youngster

    youngster Registered User

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    From 1990 to 2010 the tournament has been played outside of Europe 9 times out of 21. Canada won the gold 12 times. 7 of those were on European ice. Russia has won on N.A. ice twice in that time (both in Canada). The finals of the Olympics, held on international ice, were the U.S. and Canada. I fail to see any validity to your question above.

    As for the option for a consistent rink size, I think you are correct. There should have been a standard set many years ago. But the simple fact is that a common rink size will not happen any time soon. It would cost a fortune to change rinks these days. One could just as easily say that it is a disadvantage for N.A. players to play on the larger ice surface. It is what it is and teams on both side of the Atlantic know well in advance of where the tournament is being held so they just have to make the proper adjustments for it.
     
  11. Street Hawk

    Street Hawk Registered User

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    Olympics in Vancouver was on NHL ice. Nagano, Turin, and SLC were on International Ice.

    It would be ideal to see a set standard. Again, something in between the 2 sizes, 90-92 feet makes the most sense. But, in North America, NHL rinks have been built to hold 18K based on the 85 feet width. To just get to 92 feet wide, you're looking at taking out the 1st two rows on each side of the ice. That's a lot.

    Canada for example, adjusts their selection for the WJHC, based on the ice size. They wouldn't take a big bruising lineup to play on International Ice. That's one of the mistakes Gretzky made in 2006, he opted for too much size and not enough speed.

    That's what makes the ice size selection in Sochi very interesting for Canada.
     
  12. youngster

    youngster Registered User

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    Yes, it was the SLC Olympics that i was referring to. Sorry for not being clear. Also, I slightly miscalculated the wins for Canada. It was 6 on N.A. ice and 6 on European ice. Still, I don't think it is fair to say we don't perform well on larger ice surfaces.

    It's been a long day.

    Cheers.
     
  13. dystemper

    dystemper Registered User

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    you do realise that the vast majority of international tournaments are played on the larger international ice surface, right?

    but you said "most big time events", so obviously you didn't know this.
     
  14. BlackAces*

    BlackAces* Guest

    I am not sure why more people don't realize the flaw in the initial premise of this thread?

    Outside of the Juniors, Internationally hockey tournaments are overwhelmingly played on International ice dimensions.

    I think the better question is why that is? Is it because European countries don't perform as well on North American sized ice?:sarcasm:
     
  15. Mr Kanadensisk

    Mr Kanadensisk Registered User

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    By forcing all international tournaments to be played on European sized ice the IIHF intentionally gave the European teams a hand to help them be more competitive. When you think about it it is kind of crazy that for years North Americans had to build European sized arenas in order to be able to host IIHF events.

    Even today at the mens level the North Americans are at a much larger disavantage playing on European sized ice than the Europeans are playing on NA sized ice. Almost all of the top European players have played in a North American league, where hardly any of the top NA players have played in a Euro league.
     
  16. Alessandro Seren Rosso

    Alessandro Seren Rosso Registered User

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    LOL. 1 person said that, and no one wanted it. That's all.
     
  17. Night_Vole

    Night_Vole Registered User

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    I'm adament about this myself, I dunno why its not more of an issue it seems many ppl seem to be resigned to this. There's nothing wrong with N.A. holding more tournaments as there is $ motivation, however if this is the case than they should be able to meet the ice expectations for international tournaments.
     
  18. Davebo*

    Davebo* Guest

    Europeans aren't willing to host this tournament, yet they want to apply their standards to our rinks? No. Hell no!

    You want big goofy ice surfaces, then man up and host the tournament. Big ice or small, we're comfortable winning on either.
     
  19. Jussi

    Jussi Registered User

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    Some teams have a smaller than international size rink but the reason for it was more with the team's playing style more suited for a smaller rink. Majority of teams play in a bigger rink and the most the titles in the past decade were won by teams playing in a large rink.

    In my opinion, if the WJC is going to be held so often NA, as a compromise, the rinks should be a compromise size as well. Not NHL size but as big as the arena permits (but not quite international size).
     
  20. Jussi

    Jussi Registered User

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    I think it was said somewhere that NHL wants NHL size rinks in Sochi if it's going to participate there.
     
  21. Frank the Tank

    Frank the Tank Blue, you're my boy!

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    Owing the long history of the two main ice dimensions used currently across the globe, I think IIHF ice sheet specifications should be redefined officially to allow for a range of ice sheet dimensions with the two extremes being the NHL and current international dimensions. Let the host determine the specific dimensions to maximize profit, number of fans in attendance, etc... with them only ensuring that each rink used in the tournament is the same ice dimension.
     
  22. Trotzig

    Trotzig Registered User

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    Apart from the perhaps the Russians, I think most Europeans would wan't NHL-sized rinks. Atleast the Europeans that watch and follow the NHL.

    By NHL, you mean Bettman, right? - either way, that makes no sense at all.
     
  23. JVR

    JVR HeadHitsAreNotIllega

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    Yep, most Germans I know would definitely prefer smaller rinks.
     
  24. LeftCoast

    LeftCoast Registered User

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    Personally, as a viewer, I find the game is more intense, faster paced and more entertaining on the smaller rink.
     
  25. MXD

    MXD Original #4

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    Considering that hockey has two poles (N.America and Europe+Russia), calling european rinks "international" is misleading...

    IT's NA rinks and Euro rinks, that's lit.
     

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