If the season continues to play out like this, is missing the playoffs acceptable?

Is barely missing the playoffs acceptable at this point?


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Sabresfansince1980

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And those draft picks were used to acquire cost controlled and young assets to place on the main roster in roles to allow our team to draft and develop properly for the future draft picks. We had the assets to do so, and we had a very small window to use those assets to fill those roles.

Over statement. TM didn't have to go the major trade route for a winger, 2nd pairing D-man, goalie that was in the worst stretch of his career, and even O'Reilly for development. Those holes could've been filled with lesser players that didn't cost as much. TM was swinging for the fences though, not just looking for placeholders to buy development time. You know this.
 

missingmika

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Dec 9, 2006
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Over statement. TM didn't have to go the major trade route for a winger, 2nd pairing D-man, goalie that was in the worst stretch of his career, and even O'Reilly for development. Those holes could've been filled with lesser players that didn't cost as much. TM was swinging for the fences though, not just looking for placeholders to buy development time. You know this.

Eh, TM took a swing and missed. Sometimes in your career you got to take a chance. He did. It just didn't work.
 
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Beerz

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Jun 28, 2011
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How long players have been here is irrelevant, they're still collecting a paycheck. I have no interest in handicapping the future of the organization for another 3-5 years by doing exactly what Tim Murray did again. I'm surprised at the number of people that learned absolutely **** all from his time here as a GM, this "win now at all costs" mentality is exactly what got us here in the first place. Make some callups sure, only 2 guys are ready for it now and even that's up to debate. Trading for a rental that's gonna stay here for a year or two and leave just so we can make the playoffs for a year is counter intuitive. You need a center that has at least some term, and is within the same age range as the rest of our core. That's not gonna come cheap, so it better be a damn good deal.

The 10 game win streak seriously ruined everyone's outlook on this season and it's infuriating.


And on the flip side the people crying over Tim Murrays spilled milk can take a look at all the prospects that Murray traded that havent amounted to much more than meh.... Remember when we had the best prospect pool.... and here we are still waiting on the likes of Baptiste, Bailey, Guhle, Fasching, Compher, Lemiuex, ..oh remember Justin Kea... we had high hopes for him too. To simply cry Tim MuRRAY to try and shoot down anyone wanting to improve the roster currently is totally infuriating.
 

Gordo21

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Feb 9, 2017
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Missing the playoffs is perfectly acceptable if you ask me.

They're not that good.

Please get Reinhart away from Eichel and Skinner and try to get a second line going and then we'll talk.
 

Gordo21

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Feb 9, 2017
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And when I say that I mean they're mostly too young and experiencing pitfalls of a young team.

See Dahlin and Mittlestadt
 

sabremike

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Aug 30, 2010
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Wouldn't playing in NHL playoff games be the type of learning experience and teaching tool for our kids that would be worth it's weight in gold? That's honestly the biggest reason qualifying this season is so important: to get that vital experience.
 
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OkimLom

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Over statement. TM didn't have to go the major trade route for a winger, 2nd pairing D-man, goalie that was in the worst stretch of his career, and even O'Reilly for development. Those holes could've been filled with lesser players that didn't cost as much. TM was swinging for the fences though, not just looking for placeholders to buy development time. You know this.

Well I guess Tim Murray is a fool for trying to improve the team as quickly as possible by bringing in talented players then. Surely everybody would've rejoiced over him keeping the draft picks and using them. I mean we had perennial 20 goal scorer Tyler Ennis, what more do you need. He should've just punted the next __________ years while our guys developed, and our fanbase wished for any number of the young guys that could've came available at the time.
 

Chainshot

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I'm going to ramble on again. :laugh:

A month after scoring 49 November GF, the Sabres reverted back to their 31 October GF clip and have only 29 December GF. Skinner was second in goals for November and same with Eichel now for December. To illustrate, Skinner-Eichel-Reinhart have combined for 18 GF this December with one game left to play. They contributed assists on each of the 4 GF gotten from the defense too. Further, Eichel-Reinhart assisted on Sheary's lone ENG contribution in a 3-0 ANA win. Quick math, that's 23 of 29 December GF, or 79.3%, purely coming from top line offense. The fourth line of Girgensons-Larsson-ERod have chipped in an admirable 5 December GF, or 17.2%, scoring three counter goals and two more at the backdoor, while also regularly contributing to the top PK unit [3 PPGA (1st), 34 TS (7th), 91.2 PK% (1st)] of the NHL month. Again, some quick math leaves just 1 December GF, or 3.4%, unaccounted for and that's your lone middle-six contribution for the month among Sheary-Mittelstadt-Okposo and Thompson-Sobotka-Pommer: one Mittelstadt goal vs ARZ, assisted by Sheary. Their only other "middle-six" points came from Sheary's previously mentioned ENG and Thompson playing with the two mainstay fourth-liners vs WSH, where Oshie deflected Thompson's shot to Larsson at the backdoor for a tap-in. Elie has contributed nothing to the cause when rotated in either. This is all pitiful and redundant news to most, but somehow they're still riding this depth as if an Amerks winger couldn't possibly be any worse at scoring. Even if Smith and Olofsson only spark PP2 into contributing a few goals, that's something, not nothing. This is why I'll kindly tune out anyone who thinks an Amerks winger could possibly contribute less because, rather than a 4-5-3 December, it could have been better with just one more goal in any of these games swinging some points your way. It definitely won't matter in March and April if you piss away points now because you want to ride out major slumps, right? It's definitely rewarding players of deserving TOI, right?

The improvement or exceeding expectation season narratives shouldn't ignore that each of these points are seemingly required for them to consistently win: that the top-line creates 2+ GF every game; that the improved healthy defense, top PK, and stable goalies be flawless and can't possibly falter after normal game/growing pains like PIM, mistakes, bad bounces, etc.; or that the defense and fourth line have to provide all the depth scoring. Instead, it should continually be asked where the heck in this roster construction is there any semblance of consistent scoring/center/wing depth to make up for the nights when any of those aspects are absent and when is it going to be addressed before they piss away more points likely needed in the wildcard race. That includes the PP2 going dead quiet, because if you didn't already know, Skinner, Eichel, and Dahlin have 11 of the last 13 PPG scored since Nov.1 and all six in December. Those Amerks wingers don't create goals on their AHL PP opps, right, right?

***

Also, below are some monthly stat capsules (with poor notes) that I didn't feel like formatting or delving into further. Just play around with the calendar parameters on NHL.com if anyone's curious to look at them further.
  • October: 12GP, 6-4-2, 14pts (t-11th); 31 GF (t-25th), 35 GA (18th); 0 SOW, 0 SOL; 364 SF (15th), 386 SA (21st); 9 PPG (t-9th), 45 PP (t-3rd), 20.0 PP% (17th); 8 PPGA (t-15th), 38 TS (t-14th), 78.9 PK% (15th); 49.0 FOW% (19th).
    • Sheary, Okposo, Mittelstadt, Pommer combine to score 7 of the 9 PPG
    • Risto 1+3 -10, Okposo 3+4 -6, Sheary 3+2 -7, Reinhart 1+3 -7
  • November: 14GP, 11-3-0, 22pts (1st); 49 GF (t-6th), 38 GA (t-10th); 3 SOW (1st), 0 SOL; 466 SF (10th), 464 SA (t-24th); 7 PPG (t-21st), 38 PP (t-19th), 18.4 PP% (19th); 7 PPGA (t-4th), 39 TS (t-11th), 84.6 PK% (6th); 46.0 FOW% (30th).
    • Eichel one goal
    • Bogo 4+ TOI/GP bump
    • Tage, ERod score 2 of 7 PPG; Skinner scores rest
    • Dahlin +9, Okposo +8
  • December: 12/13GP, 4-5-3, 11pts (t-24th); 29 GF (28th), 35 GA (t-8th); 0 SOW, 1 SOL; 390 SF (21st), 400 SA (t-14th); 6 PPG (t-19th), 36 PP (t-21st), 16.7 PP% (19th); 3 PPGA (1st), 34 TS (7th), 91.2 PK% (1st); 49.2 FOW% (17th).
    • Eichel ten goals
    • Dahlin 3+ TOI/GP bump
    • Bogo another 1+ TOI/GP bump
    • Up to three injured defense, recalls rotated in
    • Eichel, Dahlin, Skinner combine for the 6 PPG
    • Sobotka, Okposo each 0+0 -7

There is no mic drop emoji, but there should be.
 

Sabresfansince1980

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Wouldn't playing in NHL playoff games be the type of learning experience and teaching tool for our kids that would be worth it's weight in gold? That's honestly the biggest reason qualifying this season is so important: to get that vital experience.

The 2004-05 Amerks didn't need NHL playoffs. They learned how to win together in Rochester. I'll say it again since I was very famously quoted (sarcasm) a month or so ago...this team is the 2004-05 Sabres if they had an NHL season that year. They're about to turn a corner, but the biggest improvements include what Botterill can't do anything about, time and development. He doesn't have a time machine.
 
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Gordo21

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Feb 9, 2017
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Well I guess Tim Murray is a fool for trying to improve the team as quickly as possible by bringing in talented players then. Surely everybody would've rejoiced over him keeping the draft picks and using them. I mean we had perennial 20 goal scorer Tyler Ennis, what more do you need. He should've just punted the next __________ years while our guys developed, and our fanbase wished for any number of the young guys that could've came available at the time.
I said do something, I didn't say give away the kitchen sink.
 

Sabresfansince1980

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Well I guess Tim Murray is a fool for trying to improve the team as quickly as possible by bringing in talented players then. Surely everybody would've rejoiced over him keeping the draft picks and using them. I mean we had perennial 20 goal scorer Tyler Ennis, what more do you need. He should've just punted the next __________ years while our guys developed, and our fanbase wished for any number of the young guys that could've came available at the time.

You're being sarcastic, but that's exactly what I wanted, and why I criticized TM and his major trades. When you say "next ________ years" it really only came down to 2 years of development from the picks and prospects he wasted. If he knew what he was doing JT Compher and Colin White would be providing secondary scoring and this team would be a legit playoff threat right now...right now. There would be more assets in some form counting Myers value (and other wasted assets). Botterill had to clean up the mess he made and reset the re-build. Patience then means having shiny stuff now, but now we have to be patient again because he did it wrong.
 

CatsforReinhart

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Jul 27, 2014
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But if we're in contention at deadline, why wouldn't he do something?
That would be strange not to do anything. Who would do such a thing right?
hmmmm....Maybe you should ask Regier why he did nothing
You make it sound like it would be absurd for Botts not to want to pay inflated prices at the TDL.
 

Gordo21

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Feb 9, 2017
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Regier was 10 times the gm Murray was.

You do remember that Regier only had Pegula for a little while don't you .

And the free agent class sucked that one year. Ville leino anyone?

Oh but just a warning, they don't like you talking about past gms around here for some reason.
 

sabremike

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Aug 30, 2010
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The 2004-05 Amerks didn't need NHL playoffs. They learned how to win together in Rochester. I'll say it again since I was very famously quoted (sarcasm) a month or so ago...this team is the 2004-05 Sabres if they had an NHL season that year. They're about to turn a corner, but the biggest improvements include what Botterill can't do anything about, time and development. He doesn't have a time machine.
That's a valid point but my only caveat is that the post lockout NHL saw a total paradigm shift that created the conditions (crackdown on obstruction, making skill more important than brutality ect.) that allowed that team to thrive.
 
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Gordo21

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Feb 9, 2017
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I'm watching the Russians right now hoping that Botterill might actually select one before the 7th round.

Although probably most have been drafted already from world juniors
 

Yatzhee

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Aug 5, 2010
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Uh what? Tavares' contract ended and he left right when he turned 28. Eichel is under contract until he's 29, and I clearly discussed a window of contention for when he's 24-26, 2-4 years from now. I mean, did you just not bother to count?
Eichel doesn't have to be a UFA to go to the Sabres GM and say he's had enough, he wants out.
And that 24-26 age range.......yea, I can see that being YOUR window, I highly doubt its Eichel's, or other players on the Sabres.
I mean do you honestly believe these players think: "we'll compete when I'm 24 to 26 for cup contention"?

If you do my apologies.
I don't think they do.
 

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