I think Marner is going to have a better year than Matthews

[Sypher04]

Agreed. I will be shocked if Matthews, Tavares and Kadri play more than 5 minutes combined on the PK all season. Kadri played 42 seconds last season. Marleau played more than 33 minutes. Babs likes players with Marleau's or Kapanen's speed on the PK. Kadri playing the shutdown role at ES has no relation to what Babs is looking for on the PK.

Kadri I'm less clear on. Babcock has commented in the past about potentially making him a penalty killer, so I could either way on that.

 

[Sypher04]

Babs is not going to stack a PP. It makes little sense to split up Matthews and Nylander on the PP as they play together at ES.

Stacked powerplay doesn't have to mean Nylander gets split from Matthews.
I believe most people regard the stacked powerplay 5 to be:

Matthews, Tavares, Marner, Nylander and Rielly (plays ~1:20/pp)

Kadri, Marleau, Johnsson, Kapanen and Gardiner would become powerplay #2. (plays ~0:40/pp)

 

[biotk]

Kadri is one of the best goal scoring PP threats in the league and generates a ton of high danger chances/60min, I really don't think he's going to lose his spot.

Of course he is not. It would be absurd.

Also, Tavares is one of the best PK'ers in the league, that is one of his largest strengths. I'd be hugely disappointed and surprised if he doesn't log heavy PK time this season.

I'd run:

Tavares-Kapanen
Hainsey-Dermott

and

Matthews-Brown
Rielly-Holl

The bolded players are not going to be near the PK this year.

 

[Liminality]

Stacked powerplay doesn't have to mean Nylander gets split from Matthews.
I believe most people regard the stacked powerplay 5 to be:

Matthews, Tavares, Marner, Nylander and Rielly (plays ~1:20/pp)

Kadri, Marleau, Johnsson, Kapanen and Gardiner would become powerplay #2. (plays ~0:40/pp)

I'm not entirely sure how that'll work out position wise but maybe Nylander can take that center ice spot.

Tavares
Matthews-Nylander-Marner
Rielly

One timer is still open from Marner to Nylander and royal road passes from Marner to Matthews are open. I don't really see a reason why they can't try that lol.
Would leave us with this for the 2nd unit.

Marleau
Johnsson-Kadri-Leivo
Gardiner

Leivo's got a right handed shot to keep the same setup. Maybe put Kap there instead if that doesn't work.

 

[Liminality]

The bolded players are not going to be near the PK this year.

Tavares is at least an option that Babcock can use as he's had PK experience the last two years. Matthews might get some PK time in the near future imo. He's big, can win faceoffs, good hands and good board work to take pucks away. Holl was PKing for the AHL and he seemed to be pretty good at that.

I think it's at least worth experimenting. Saying that, we do have capable PKer's in Hyman, Brown, Kapanen and Johnsson.

 

[Sypher04]

Of course he is not. It would be absurd.

The bolded players are not going to be near the PK this year.

I don't think it's absurd at all.

Over the past 2 years:
Tavares (0.300 ppp/g)
Marner (0.300 ppp/g)
Matthews (0.236 ppp/g)
Nylander (0.233 ppp/g)
Kadri (0.222 ppp/g)
Rielly (0.197 ppp/g)

I realize Kadri has 24 power play goals in 2 season, and yeah that's a lot, but it's also a huge spike over his previous production so how much of that is attributable to a guy like Marner is hard to gauge (as much as I love Naz). Also, there's only so much room in front of the net.

I see potential value in having Kadri anchor PP2. I understand his point totals inevitably decrease in this role, but I think ~25g, 45 point Kadri is still just as valuable in 3C as 32g, 55 point Kadri is. And the drop may not even be that pronounced if he gets PK time & somewhat lightened 5v5 matchups.

 

[biotk]

Tavares is at least an option that Babcock can use as he's had PK experience the last two years. Matthews might get some PK time in the near future imo. He's big, can win faceoffs, good hands and good board work to take pucks away. Holl was PKing for the AHL and he seemed to be pretty good at that.

I think it's at least worth experimenting. Saying that, we do have capable PKer's in Hyman, Brown, Kapanen and Johnsson.

I watched Holl PK in the AHL and I don't doubt that he can do it. He PKed a bit in his two games for the Leafs - although Hainsey was out those 2 games. I don't see Holl being a regular in the line-up. Probably the extra D, and will pay 15 or so games this year. Hainsey and Zaitsev will play most of the PK minutes. Rielly will play some. Babs will complain about his need for a Polak like player.

Babcock doesn't generally like to use the same players on the PP and on the PK. Tavares did PK on the Islanders, but I think a lot of that was the Islanders' desire to have him out there for faceoffs. The Leafs have shown that faceoffs are of little concern on the PK. What matters is the actual killing of the penalty. They will continue to put out a lefty and righty on the PK and have the strong side take the draw. Their wingers took 79% of their PK faceoffs last year and had the exact same winning % as their centres taking the other 21% (one of the best winning percentages in the league by the way).

 

[biotk]

I don't think it's absurd at all.

Over the past 2 years:
Tavares (0.300 ppp/g)
Marner (0.300 ppp/g)
Matthews (0.236 ppp/g)
Nylander (0.233 ppp/g)
Kadri (0.222 ppp/g)
Rielly (0.197 ppp/g)

I realize Kadri has 24 power play goals in 2 season, and yeah that's a lot, but it's also a huge spike over his previous production so how much of that is attributable to a guy like Marner is hard to gauge (as much as I love Naz). Also, there's only so much room in front of the net.

I see potential value in having Kadri anchor PP2. I understand his point totals inevitably decrease in this role, but I think ~25g, 45 point Kadri is still just as valuable in 3C as 32g, 55 point Kadri is. And the drop may not even be that pronounced if he gets PK time & somewhat lightened 5v5 matchups.

It seemed as though the posts were implying Kadri not being on the PP at all. If I read that wrong I apologize.

However, I do feel that Kadri is almost guaranteed to remain on the PP unit with Marner and Tavares. Tavares is likely taking JVRs role. The whole set up of the PP is for Marner or Rielly to create a rebound and complete chaos occurring in front of the net with a massive number of chances. Having both JVR and Kadri in front of the net was essential for that last year. I think that Kadri and Tavares will play the same role this year.

 

[Walshy7]

Stacked powerplay doesn't have to mean Nylander gets split from Matthews.
I believe most people regard the stacked powerplay 5 to be:

Matthews, Tavares, Marner, Nylander and Rielly (plays ~1:20/pp)

Kadri, Marleau, Johnsson, Kapanen and Gardiner would become powerplay #2. (plays ~0:40/pp)

the only catch there is if Gardiner is being shopped, taking away pp time from him will lower his point totals and therefore his value

 

[Liminality]

I watched Holl PK in the AHL and I don't doubt that he can do it. He PKed a bit in his two games for the Leafs - although Hainsey was out those 2 games. I don't see Holl being a regular in the line-up. Probably the extra D, and will pay 15 or so games this year. Hainsey and Zaitsev will play most of the PK minutes. Rielly will play some. Babs will complain about his need for a Polak like player.

Babcock doesn't generally like to use the same players on the PP and on the PK. Tavares did PK on the Islanders, but I think a lot of that was the Islanders' desire to have him out there for faceoffs. The Leafs have shown that faceoffs are of little concern on the PK. What matters is the actual killing of the penalty. They will continue to put out a lefty and righty on the PK and have the strong side take the draw. Their wingers took 79% of their PK faceoffs last year and had the exact same winning % as their centres taking the other 21% (one of the best winning percentages in the league by the way).

I could see that being the situation for the defense. Hainsey and Zaitsev still being the go to guys and Holl probably doesn't make the team out of camp anyways.

We technically don't need a center for our PK but when we've had the option to have a defensive center, Babcock has at least tried to put them out there.
Short sample sizes but when Fehr was on the team for 4 games he had 3:42 PK per game. Gauthier had 1:19 in 9 games, Plek had 1:15 and Moore had 1:13.

When Babcock was still with the Red Wings, he did have Datsyuk and Zetterberg out there on the PK from 2005-06 to 2013-14 for about 1:00 to 1:30 a game. Not sure if there's been some sort of coaching adjustment for him or if he wants to groom the young stars a bit more before putting them on the PK. Babcock definitely still had his go to players for the PK taking most of the time but his stars would at least see some time on it. I can definitely see him utilizing Matthews like he did with Zetterberg and will be interesting if he puts him on there eventually. I hope he does.

 

[diceman934]

And Matthews with Tavares on the PP will be twice as deadly. You do realize that Tavares is a deadly playmaker plus he can score don't you?

So wrong again the best play maker on the Leafs is Marner and it is not even close. Tavares is shooter who has to pass when he is the one carrying the mail. He is a scorer first. He may get 50 this year.

100% Marner is playing the right side on the PP and Tavares is on the PP with him. If it is not a loaded PP then Marthews is on the other unit with Nylander on the right side.

Not loaded:
Rielly, Marner, Tavares, Kadri and johnsson
Gardiner, Nylander, Mathews, Marleau and Brown

Loaded:

Rielly, Marner, Tavares, Mathews, Kadri or Johnsson

 

[Sypher04]

Rielly, Marner, Tavares, Mathews, Kadri or Johnsson

No chance a loaded powerplay gets Johnsson before Nylander. I'm willing to offer Kadri is a possibility over Nylander due to his goal scoring, but I think it's pretty clear its one of those two. And I personally believe it'd be Nylander.

 

[diceman934]

No chance a loaded powerplay gets Johnsson before Nylander. I'm willing to offer Kadri is a possibility over Nylander due to his goal scoring, but I think it's pretty clear its one of those two. And I personally believe it'd be Nylander.

Nylander has no spot to play on a loaded pp. I agree that Kadri would be an option but all 3 centers on the PP may be a bit much.

Nylander is not a net front guy and I say that Marleau plays over him on a loaded pp as well.
Umbrella spread/stacked

Rielly at the top Marner on the right and Mathews on the Left. JT low and Kadri the high spot the same as last year. If no 3 centers substitute Marleau or Johnsson.

 

[biotk]

We technically don't need a center for our PK but when we've had the option to have a defensive center, Babcock has at least tried to put them out there.
Short sample sizes but when Fehr was on the team for 4 games he had 3:42 PK per game. Gauthier had 1:19 in 9 games, Plek had 1:15 and Moore had 1:13.

Babs has tried putting out some defensive Cs early on as he was trying to find his four. Once he settled on Hyman, Komarov, Brown and Kapanen (which took the latter being called up) centers almost never played on the PK. Moore for instance averaged 13 seconds a game during his final 17 games in the lineup (after Kapanen had solidified a spot in the lineup). Plek averaged 1.15 per game, but almost all of that occurred over the couple games that Komarov was injured. With Komarov in the lineup Babs went with Hyman, Kom, Brown and Kapanen. With Komarov gone my guess is that Johnnson takes the spot.

 

[Minus Mitch]

You don't get the point. All things being equal, Marner is better at the PP. Trying to add Tavares+Matthews as some imaginary gangup of Marner doesn't change the fact.

How do you figure? Tavares had more PP points than Marner.

 

[Notsince67]

How do you figure? Tavares had more PP than Marner.

I figure this. That there are a few Marner haters here who can't stand that he was the best PP guy on the team last year. Saying that Matthews will be better once he gets Tavares type help is an absolute joke of an attempt to slam Marner. WTF?

 

[Minus Mitch]

I figure this. That there are a few Marner haters here who can't stand that he was the best PP guy on the team last year. Saying that Matthews will be better once he gets Tavares type help is an absolute joke of an attempt to slam Marner. WTF?

Not at all and implying so is very childish. Tavares is an equal setup guy to Marner plus he can score. He's a bigger PP threat than Marner. If paired with Matthews it would be deadly.