I think Marner is going to have a better year than Matthews

[Notsince67]

And Matthews with Tavares on the PP will be twice as deadly. You do realize that Tavares is a deadly playmaker plus he can score don't you?

You don't get the point. All things being equal, Marner is better at the PP. Trying to add Tavares+Matthews as some imaginary gangup of Marner doesn't change the fact.

 

[ViewsFromThe6ix]

I feel like I'm part of a section of the fanbase that is getting smaller and smaller....I think Nylander is better than Marner, or at worst equal. Nylander is the much better 5on5 player and while I do put value on Marner's PP ability, I think Nylander could produce similar results given the opportunity.

I still think the scoring title is going to Matthews solely based on how dominant he is 5on5 (and the Matthews PP units shouldn't be complete garbage for 2 months this year). I'm just happy we have both Nylander and Marner, but I feel Nylander is getting underrated in the fanbase because of his mediocre playoffs and don't know that Marner's 2nd half was largely PDO driven.

 

[Walshy7]

I feel like I'm part of a section of the fanbase that is getting smaller and smaller....I think Nylander is better than Marner, or at worst equal. Nylander is the much better 5on5 player and while I do put value on Marner's PP ability, I think Nylander could produce similar results given the opportunity.

I still think the scoring title is going to Matthews solely based on how dominant he is 5on5 (and the Matthews PP units shouldn't be complete garbage for 2 months this year). I'm just happy we have both Nylander and Marner, but I feel Nylander is getting underrated in the fanbase because of his mediocre playoffs and don't know that Marner's 2nd half was largely PDO driven.

as of right now Marner is ahead, but not by as much as some make out here. Actually he is probably equal to the amount of points he had more than nylander last year ahead 5-10 points and as you say a lot of that was on the pp. Which PP is still part of hockey I get that before others jump on me. Nylander is very underrated here now and to be honest marner is getting a little overrated for his current level of play. He obviously will improve as he gets older (so will nylander) but right now he isn't close to JT or Matthews on our team.

It will depend on how babcock runs out his PP, there is a real possibility Nylander ends up by himself on unit 2 if babcock stacks the units. Matthews and babcocks meetings at his home Im sure were about ice time and JT must have been promised significant ice time and pp time. Kadri played last year with Marner on the 1st unit so it is possible the units end up

Kadri-Matthews-JT
Rielly-Marner
(1:30TOI)

and

Marleau-Nylander-Kapanen
Gardiner-Johnsson
(0:30 TOI)

I doubt it but it is possible, most likely though babs would be switch Kadri and Kapanen or johnssson because 3 c's on one unit is overkill

 

[ViewsFromThe6ix]

as of right now Marner is ahead, but not by as much as some make out here. Actually he is probably equal to the amount of points he had more than nylander last year ahead 5-10 points and as you say a lot of that was on the pp. Which PP is still part of hockey I get that before others jump on me. Nylander is very underrated here now and to be honest marner is getting a little overrated for his current level of play. He obviously will improve as he gets older (so will nylander) but right now he isn't close to JT or Matthews on our team.

It will depend on how babcock runs out his PP, there is a real possibility Nylander ends up by himself on unit 2 if babcock stacks the units. Matthews and babcocks meetings at his home Im sure were about ice time and JT must have been promised significant ice time and pp time. Kadri played last year with Marner on the 1st unit so it is possible the units end up

Kadri-Matthews-JT
Rielly-Marner
(1:30TOI)

and

Marleau-Nylander-Kapanen
Gardiner-Johnsson
(0:30 TOI)

I doubt it but it is possible, most likely though babs would be switch Kadri and Kapanen or johnssson because 3 c's on one unit is overkill

Agreed on your points. I see the first unit PP the same as you. No chance Kadri loses his role in the middle of the PP setup, he's incredible there.

 

[ACC1224]

I feel like I'm part of a section of the fanbase that is getting smaller and smaller....I think Nylander is better than Marner, or at worst equal. Nylander is the much better 5on5 player and while I do put value on Marner's PP ability, I think Nylander could produce similar results given the opportunity.

I still think the scoring title is going to Matthews solely based on how dominant he is 5on5 (and the Matthews PP units shouldn't be complete garbage for 2 months this year). I'm just happy we have both Nylander and Marner, but I feel Nylander is getting underrated in the fanbase because of his mediocre playoffs and don't know that Marner's 2nd half was largely PDO driven.

I don't see Nylander being underrated at all, he seems to be slotted correctly behind Matthews and Marner.
IMO, if Marner had played the last two seasons with Matthews, the gap would be considered even greater.

Agreed on your points. I see the first unit PP the same as you. No chance Kadri loses his role in the middle of the PP setup, he's incredible there.

This is an interesting one. You don't want to mess with the success but IMO, this season Kadri becomes fulltime on the PK and no longer sees the PP.

 

[HamiltonNHL]

Kadri-Matthews-JT
Rielly-Marner
(1:30TOI)

and

Marleau-Nylander-Kapanen
Gardiner-Johnsson
(0:30 TOI)

What about keeping the power play lines the same as the regular strength lines ?
Might help with the flow ?

 

[Sypher04]

You don't get the point. All things being equal, Marner is better at the PP. Trying to add Tavares+Matthews as some imaginary gangup of Marner doesn't change the fact.

Nylander had 26 points on the powerplay in 81 games his rookie year.
Marner had 27 points on the powerplay in 82 games his sophomore year.
Both are their career highs.

I think at this point it's way to early too make definitive statements on who is better on the powerplay.

Edit; looking back now seems your comparison was Matthews and marner. Marner was definitely more productive this year but his unit gelled while Matthews unit didn't really. Marleau, Brown, komarov... none of them really fit.

 

[Walshy7]

What about keeping the power play lines the same as the regular strength lines ?
Might help with the flow ?

I agree, but there must be some smoke to the Matthews wants more ice time narrative imo and JT will have been made assurances he will get his too.

 

[Liminality]

I don't see Nylander being underrated at all, he seems to be slotted correctly behind Matthews and Marner.
IMO, if Marner had played the last two seasons with Matthews, the gap would be considered even greater.



This is an interesting one. You don't want to mess with the success but IMO, this season Kadri becomes fulltime on the PK and no longer sees the PP.

I personally don't think there's any chance that happens. Kadri's spot in the middle is where he got 12 of his 32 goals last year. If he's not on the first unit he's most definitely going to be on the 2nd unit cause he fits so well there.

Nylander had 26 points on the powerplay in 81 games his rookie year.
Marner had 27 points on the powerplay in 82 games his sophomore year.
Both are their career highs.

I think at this point it's way to early too make definitive statements on who is better on the powerplay.

I think that had more to do with Marner's quarter backing ability compared to Nylander's and Matthews' chemistry on the powerplay using the royal road passes.
Personally I think Marner can run a powerplay by himself and he's one of the best at it. Not to say Nylander is bad, he's actually really really good on the powerplay too cause he can utilize his great shot better with that time and space.

We'll still have to wait and see how the training camp powerplay setups are run to get more of an idea.

 

[Sypher04]

I agree, but there must be some smoke to the Matthews wants more ice time narrative imo and JT will have been made assurances he will get his too.

I don't think there has to be any truth at all to the more ice time narrative.

The alleged "rift" between Babcock And Matthews was speculation over him looking annoyed on the bench at one point during the playoffs.

The alleged demand to play with Marner was media misquoting him when asked a direct question about playing with marner more.

One person starts something in our media and it just takes on a life of its own. True or not.

 

[ACC1224]

I personally don't think there's any chance that happens. Kadri's spot in the middle is where he got 12 of his 32 goals last year. If he's not on the first unit he's most definitely going to be on the 2nd unit cause he fits so well there.


.

Tavares slots into Kadri's spot.
Who replaces Komarov on the PK?
IMO, Hyman and Kadri will be the top PK duo.

 

[Liminality]

Tavares slots into Kadri's spot.
Who replaces Komarov on the PK?
IMO, Hyman and Kadri will be the top PK duo.

I've heard Tavares slots in where JVR used to be on the Islanders powerplay. So I thought a stacked unit might look something like this.

Tavares
Matthews-Kadri-Marner
Rielly

Also not sure on the PK. I know Hyman, Brown, Johnsson and Kapanen are going to be given chances there. Maybe they won't use centers.

 

[Mess]

Marner plays the point on PP#1 unit and racked up 27 PP points PP (tied for 20th OA).
Matthews plays on PP#2 unit and racked up only a mere 13 PP points.

The PP is where players feast on their personal stat totals with a man up..

If Matthews PP#2 unit becomes PP#1 unit this year this will add intrigue to the most points race between the 2 players as we already know Matthews in a beast 5v5.

 

[Mess]

Tavares slots into Kadri's spot.
Who replaces Komarov on the PK?
IMO, Hyman and Kadri will be the top PK duo.

Kadri lead the Leafs in PP goals with 12 last year, JVR was 2nd with 11.

Hard to imagine with JVR already missing (likely replaced by JT now) that Babs would take his #1 PP GS off the top PP unit. IMO

 

[ViewsFromThe6ix]

Tavares slots into Kadri's spot.
Who replaces Komarov on the PK?

Kadri lead the Leafs in PP goals with 12 last year, JVR was 2nd with 11.

Hard to imagine with JVR already missing (likely replaced by JT now) that Babs would take his #1 PP GS off the top PP unit. IMO

IMO, Hyman and Kadri will be the top PK duo.

Kadri is one of the best goal scoring PP threats in the league and generates a ton of high danger chances/60min, I really don't think he's going to lose his spot. Also, Tavares is one of the best PK'ers in the league, that is one of his largest strengths. I'd be hugely disappointed and surprised if he doesn't log heavy PK time this season.

I'd run:

Tavares-Kapanen
Hainsey-Dermott

and

Matthews-Brown
Rielly-Holl

 

[ACC1224]

Kadri is one of the best goal scoring PP threats in the league and generates a ton of high danger chances/60min, I really don't think he's going to lose his spot. Also, Tavares is one of the best PK'ers in the league, that is one of his largest strengths. I'd be hugely disappointed and surprised if he doesn't log heavy PK time this season.

I'd run:

Tavares-Kapanen
Hainsey-Dermott

and

Matthews-Brown
Rielly-Holl

Interesting, I guess we will see.
I would like to stack a PP, then I guess it would be between Nylander and Kadri with the edge to Nylander since Kadri could PK.

I would think they would be hesitant to use their $11m on the PK.
Matthews on the PK as well?? No chance, IMO. Hyman for sure will be there

 

[ACC1224]

Kadri lead the Leafs in PP goals with 12 last year, JVR was 2nd with 11.

Hard to imagine with JVR already missing (likely replaced by JT now) that Babs would take his #1 PP GS off the top PP unit. IMO

While you're probably correct, I can also see Babcock starting to mold the team into what he thinks will be needed to go deeper in the playoffs. I don't think the status quo is in the plans.

 

[HamiltonNHL]

I agree, but there must be some smoke to the Matthews wants more ice time narrative imo and JT will have been made assurances he will get his too.

Well then Kadri won't be getting much PP time then.

 

[Sypher04]

I'll be shocked if Matthews & Tavares play more than 5 minutes combined on the penalty kill all season.

 

[Sypher04]

Well then Kadri won't be getting much PP time then.

I think it's a very real possibility that Kadri won't get on PP1. I think he along with Marleau, Gardiner & some kids like Johnsson and Kapanen will make up the #2 unit which will only get maybe ~40 seconds per powerplay.

 

[biotk]

It will depend on how babcock runs out his PP, there is a real possibility Nylander ends up by himself on unit 2 if babcock stacks the units.

Babs is not going to stack a PP. It makes little sense to split up Matthews and Nylander on the PP as they play together at ES.

 

[Mess]

While you're probably correct, I can also see Babcock starting to mold the team into what he thinks will be needed to go deeper in the playoffs. I don't think the status quo is in the plans.

Your point is valid as Leafs do need a centre to win draws on the PK and Kadri is being groomed as a checking C for the team.

Since Kadri as #3C will see his ES TOI/g go down that getting some PK time will increase it again so we might see Kadri in all situations this year.

 

[biotk]

I'll be shocked if Matthews & Tavares play more than 5 minutes combined on the penalty kill all season.

Agreed. I will be shocked if Matthews, Tavares and Kadri play more than 5 minutes combined on the PK all season. Kadri played 42 seconds last season. Marleau played more than 33 minutes. Babs likes players with Marleau's or Kapanen's speed on the PK. Kadri playing the shutdown role at ES has no relation to what Babs is looking for on the PK.

 

[biotk]

Your point is valid as Leafs do need a centre to win draws on the PK and Kadri is being groomed as a checking C for the team.

The Leafs do not need a centre to win draws on the PK.

Being effective on the PK has no relation to being a good checking C.

 

[Walshy7]

Babs is not going to stack a PP. It makes little sense to split up Matthews and Nylander on the PP as they play together at ES.

totally agree, I was just spit balling and using the babs/Matthews end of season "chat" and smoke about ice time to show it is entirely possible Nylander could be left on an island essentially by himself (in terms of experience) on PP2.

I think 50/50 split works best tbh

Marner/JT even strength build chemistry work together on the pp too
Matthews/Nylander same as above

Then add kadri, Johnsson, Marleau and kapanen in there somewhere too we have the makings of 2 extremely strong pp units. as long as marleau can start scoring on the pp again seems to have gone cold on the pp last year.

Johnsson-JT-Kadri
Rielly-Marner

Marleau-Matthews-Kapanen
Gardiner-Nylander (I hope dermott gets a little bit of pp time too this year)

On paper those 2 units should be top 5 at least in the league