I Cannot See Buffalo Missing the Playoffs Next Year

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Snippit

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Dec 5, 2012
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I know you follow me around and Im sure youve seen me get into arguments where I've said I could see Eichel/Hall putting up McDavid/Drais numbers and everyone laughed me out of the thread. I give them props where they deserve it, but rip them where they dont. I think thats pretty logical and you dont like when I rip them, then prove me wrong. In another thread (I think az goalie proposal) I proved via stats that the Sabres defense was pretty awful all around and here also that the Sabres offense was bad defensively. And then they got rid of any Sabre forward that was decent defensively. So why is it crazy to assume that overall they could take a step back still. Tougher competition, they'll score more goals, but also let up in goals.

Skinner, I think sucks, and is by far one of the worst value players in the league (proven). And this is mainly because of his cap hit. If he was $4.5M, I'd love him. Can he bounce back? IMO with Eichel and PP1, yes. Will he get those opportunities? Doubt it. So why is it crazy for me to think he will only slightly improve off of last years career worst season?

I believe in Cozens, but do not believe in Sabres management to get the most out of him. Theyve proven to be awful at developing players. Guilty until proven innocent. If they get Cozens right, then sure, ill get on board with future prospects not selected in the top 3.

Tage. A wild card, but IMO a guy who needs talent around him to succeed. He will not get that on the 3rd-4th line UNLESS the Sabres actually give Cozens a chance as a 3C and dont rush him.



Most improved team in offseason debated

Ill leave it to the experts.

I think the Sabres were so bad that sure they improved, but not enoguh to make a dent anywhere and well be hoping we get good returns for Staal and Hall at the deadline, then cross our fingers Hall considers coming back. They improved offensively, took a step back defensively, and changed nothing goal. Well see where they end up, but I still think theyre at the bottom of their new division and would only be ahead of Ott/Det in a normal division with Mtl being arguable.

Why did they take a step back defensively though? Like what has changed - it's literally the exact same players.
 

Djp

Registered User
Jul 28, 2012
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Alexandria, VA
Buffalo is very much improved

Staal>MoJo
Staal is a center for middle 6. He can still play. I’m not expecting Stasl at 24 at all. But he can be a decent vet. I’m assuming the plan is for him to p,at with Cozens and teach him center over the course of the season.

Cozens would be a high impact rookie on the team. He could bea big addition.

Hall. That certainly is a major add.

exchange Larsson for Eakin, Vesey for Reider.

if they setup their lines right they could have 3 decent scoring lines

they could do something like

Top line Hall and Eichel + another player
Middle 6 of Skinner, Reinhart, Olofsson, Staal, and Cozens + another player

on D people forget ...to start the season in normal times Dahlin would be 20 and Jokiharju 21. Both have room to grow.

playoffs likely expanded this year where 5th or 6th place make the playoffs. They likely have all 4 divisions have internal playoffs with a final 4 match up of division survivors.
 

John Eichel da GOAT

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Oct 7, 2008
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Why did they take a step back defensively though? Like what has changed - it's literally the exact same players.
Pure defense, correct. And can assume Dahlin should only improve, so hope ther. But they were one of the worst teams in the league defensively from a forward standpoint and the only positive corsi players against elite competition were Larsson, Johanson, Vesey, Sobotka, Okposo, and Simmonds. 5/6 gone.

Elite competition:
PuckIQ | Woodmoney

Against all competition (Elite, middle of the pack, and bums) Eichel, Reinhart, Larsson, and Okposo were positive. So al though you are correct that nothing changed per say, they did lose nearly all of there forwards you would consider to be shutdown type guys against the McDavid/Matthews of the league. Eichel and co score a lot, but also get scored on a lot. Is Eakin and Reider good enough to replace any of that? Eakin hopefully will help the PK, but they were 2nd worst last season. He isnt enough to drastically change that much there.

All competition:
PuckIQ | Woodmoney

Complete defense:
PuckIQ | Woodmoney
 

Snippit

Registered User
Dec 5, 2012
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Pure defense, correct. And can assume Dahlin should only improve, so hope ther. But they were one of the worst teams in the league defensively from a forward standpoint and the only positive corsi players against elite competition were Larsson, Johanson, Vesey, Sobotka, Okposo, and Simmonds. 5/6 gone.

Elite competition:
PuckIQ | Woodmoney

Against all competition (Elite, middle of the pack, and bums) Eichel, Reinhart, Larsson, and Okposo were positive. So al though you are correct that nothing changed per say, they did lose nearly all of there forwards you would consider to be shutdown type guys against the McDavid/Matthews of the league. Eichel and co score a lot, but also get scored on a lot. Is Eakin and Reider good enough to replace any of that? Eakin hopefully will help the PK, but they were 2nd worst last season. He isnt enough to drastically change that much there.

All competition:
PuckIQ | Woodmoney

Complete defense:
PuckIQ | Woodmoney

Well Larsson is a big loss, no arguments from me there. The rest of the guys you mentioned range between awful and won't be missed, and some of them barely played any games for Buffalo. But fair enough, I thought you were just referring to the actual defensemen.
 

Satanphonehome

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Jan 4, 2015
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1. Have never called them a playoff team.

2. Almost every 1st overall comes in immediately as a better player than Fast. That's ridiculous to say otherwise. If Lafreniere is a worse player than Fast then its a major letdown of a season.

3. How many rookie goalies have played better than Lundqvist did last season? A wholeeeee bunch. Nevermind that Georgiev has already been the better goalie than Henrik the last two seasons, and Shesterkin is even better.

4. Arguing who is better between Staal/Johnson is like arguing between diarrhea or violently puking. They're both awful and neither is wanted. Its a wash at best.
Add in how many key young players should have much better seasons and its not really arguable that they got worse.

Nobody said Fast was better than Lafreniere. You said Fast was a 4th liner, which was false.

I don’t think the Rangers got worse, but you are staking their improvement on two players who have played a combined 12 NHL games and their other young players getting better. You don’t seemed to be concerned that their top five scorers all had career years last year - something players rarely do in consecutive years.

At the same time you don’t seem to think Buffalo’s young players will get better, or that replacing Jimmy Vesey and Marcus Johansson with Taylor Hall and Erik Staal is significant or that Jeff Skinner might bounce back from 14 goals to the double that total he has typically put up over that career. And you say the Sabres can’t win with their defence and goaltending, but you don’t consider that an issue for the Rangers, whose defence and goaltending have not proven to be any better.

Go down the rosters: player for player and the Rangers are no better than the Sabres.
 

nbwingsfan

Registered User
Dec 13, 2009
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Nobody said Fast was better than Lafreniere. You said Fast was a 4th liner, which was false.

I don’t think the Rangers got worse, but you are staking their improvement on two players who have played a combined 12 NHL games and their other young players getting better. You don’t seemed to be concerned that their top five scorers all had career years last year - something players rarely do in consecutive years.

At the same time you don’t seem to think Buffalo’s young players will get better, or that replacing Jimmy Vesey and Marcus Johansson with Taylor Hall and Erik Staal is significant or that Jeff Skinner might bounce back from 14 goals to the double that total he has typically put up over that career. And you say the Sabres can’t win with their defence and goaltending, but you don’t consider that an issue for the Rangers, whose defence and goaltending have not proven to be any better.

Go down the rosters: player for player and the Rangers are no better than the Sabres.
Ive quite clearly said the Sabres improved dramatically.

Im also saying on paper that the Rangers are now better, while being the vastly better team last year.

I would bank on the Rangers D/Goaltending being better than the Rangers. A whole lot of players had career years last season, and other than Zibanejad I dont see any potential regression from anyone on that team
 

John Eichel da GOAT

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Oct 7, 2008
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Well Larsson is a big loss, no arguments from me there. The rest of the guys you mentioned range between awful and won't be missed, and some of them barely played any games for Buffalo. But fair enough, I thought you were just referring to the actual defensemen.
Yeah i was shocked to see that as well. Obviously can ignore Simmonds since he barely played as a Sabre, but still wanted to be accurate. Eakin has decent numbers but that is on a very alaytically good Vegas team. Reiders are pretty blah. So my point in general was the defensive side of our forwards was pretty blah and the few that were good are now gone and not replaced with anything better.
 

John Eichel da GOAT

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Oct 7, 2008
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I see Buffalo finishing in the top 3.
- their division
1. Philly
2. Boston
3. Buffalo
4. Washington
5. Pittsburgh
6. Islanders
7. Rangers
8. Devils

?? I like the optimism, but I feel like passing Wsh/Pit will have to be like Brady leaving NE. Need Sid, Geno, and Ovi to retire. And ofcourse the Islanders keep proving the haters wrong so tough to not include them. Lafrenniere is a wild card. If he goes off with Breadman and Mika, could be scary.
 

MarkusKetterer

Shoulda got one game in
1. Philly
2. Boston
3. Buffalo
4. Washington
5. Pittsburgh
6. Islanders
7. Rangers
8. Devils

?? I like the optimism, but I feel like passing Wsh/Pit will have to be like Brady leaving NE. Need Sid, Geno, and Ovi to retire. And ofcourse the Islanders keep proving the haters wrong so tough to not include them. Lafrenniere is a wild card. If he goes off with Breadman and Mika, could be scary.

Aren’t Laf and Panarin both LW?
 

GlitchMarner

Typical malevolent, devious & vile Maple Leafs fan
Jul 21, 2017
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Brampton, ON
Man, you almost have to feel bad for that organization at this point. How much longer will the ineptitude last?
 

CupsOverCash

Registered User
Jun 16, 2009
16,353
7,092
What the hell happened to this team? They really went off a cliff after the last time they made the playoffs a while ago.
 
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