Hype surrounding Lindros vs Crosby

Discussion in 'NHL Draft - Prospects' started by trahans99, Nov 9, 2004.

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  1. trahans99

    trahans99 Registered User

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    I'm just curious I was too young at the time to understand the hype of Lindros. Can someone tell me who was/is hyped more? I've heard Crosby is the biggest hyped prospect since Mario, is that true?

    What was Lindros suppose to become, who was he suppose to be like? Who is Crosby compared to again? I remember Gretzky saying he's going to be the guy to break my records one day.
     
  2. ZombieMatt

    ZombieMatt Registered User

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    I also was young when Lindros was being hyped, but one thing I can contribute to this is that the big thing about Eric Lindros as he got closer to the NHL is that he was seen as being somebody that was like NOBODY before him. Scouts, GMs, Coaches, and fans ogled over his blend of incredible skill and size, and the fact that he was willing to exert every pound of his enormous frame.

    Many people have a negative taste in their mouths about Lindros because of the concussions, but this is a guy who scored 40 goals in each of his first three full seasons (I skipped the lockout year in this). 2002-03 was the first year of his career he did NOT average a PPG. I think that Lindros was well on his way to being everything he was hyped to be before the injuries started to hit him. There is a lot of negative things surrounding him, but Lindros certainly has had a good career. Not as incredible as hoped, but still very, very good.

    I think that Lindros was actually MORE hyped than Crosby because he was supposed to be in many ways a new sort of player (or at least, a bigger form of what pre-existed in some forms). Crosby is amazing, I saw him live for the first time a few weeks ago and he is the real deal, but he doesn't possess the same mind boggling physical attributes that Lindros was blessed with.
     
  3. trahans99

    trahans99 Registered User

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    I think that Lindros was actually MORE hyped than Crosby because he was supposed to be in many ways a new sort of player (or at least, a bigger form of what pre-existed in some forms). Crosby is amazing, I saw him live for the first time a few weeks ago and he is the real deal, but he doesn't possess the same mind boggling physical attributes that Lindros was blessed with.[/QUOTE]



    I understand that Crosby isn't as tall or strong as Lindros was at 17 or 18. There probably hasn't been someone ever as strong or physical as Lindros was..... but IMO Crosby has much more skill, vision and overall better than Lindros was.

    I can't wait to watch Crosby on Sportsnet on Sat. Nov 13 for the first time ever :yo:
     
  4. Coffey77

    Coffey77 Registered User

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    Lindros was hyped as the ultimate power forward. In 1991 (when he was drafted), there weren't many 6'4" 235 pound players in the NHL. And many of them that were that big weren't incredibly agile or fast. Like Kjell Samuelson for instance.

    Lindros was different. He's an incredibly large player who could punish guys with bodychecks, even at a young age. In the 1991 Canada Cup he broke Martin Rucinsky and Ulf Samuelsson's collarbones on clean bodychecks. Add to that he was a highly skilled player who could skate pretty well. From 1991 to about 1998 he matched the hype IMO. Concussions have severely limited his game though and he's no longer the guy he was then.

    Not sure who Crosby is compared to. Gretzky is one name that I hear pop up, most likely because of hockey sense and vision. It's tough to say which guy was more hyped (crosby or lindros). And I unfortunately haven't seen enough of Crosby to say what kind of player he compares to.
     
  5. Epsilon

    Epsilon #basta

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    Am I the only one feeling a bit of the shine coming off of Crosby this year? I mean, he's still a superb prospect and the clear favorite for #1 overall, but it feels like this season he's not getting talked up nearly as much. Maybe it's because his numbers arn't really any better than several other CHL players (who are all of course older) and he's not on some ridiculous 200+ point pace. There seems to be a lot more critical evaluation of his play this year and less of the fawning hype that we saw last season. A really good WJC could have the hype machine back in full gear but as of right now I find I'm hearing a lot less next Gretzky/Lemieux/Lindros type stuff.
     
  6. Sweeney

    Sweeney Registered User

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    It's jsut that the others teams are more ready against him... he is still extraordinary on the ice... its just that he cant put up 8 points per game by himself... his linemates can't catch up the pass... or the golie make a superb save... he didnt lose nothing... they're was just too much hype this year.

    Tonight he has play an extremely good game, got 3 points in a win against Halifax and Cabana!

    He will be on the Elite of the NHL in the future with Ovechkin, Kovalchuk, Gaborik, Lecavalier, Brulé, heatley (if he can recover forom his eye injury)
     
  7. Form and Substance

    Form and Substance Registered User

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    Crosby will supercede each one of them easily. Crosby's a real Bulldog out there.
     
  8. Genghis Keon

    Genghis Keon Registered User

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    I agree with you a bit, but not entirely, which makes Crosby seem all the more extraordinary. In the past few years, we've had a few "once in a decade" type players (Spezza, Bouwmeester, and Ovechkin), and each of them suffered a lot of reverse hype in their draft year--their expectations fell considerably in their draft year (Spezza was no longer Spetzky, the Orr comparisons died for J-Bo, and, as we've just seen, Ovechkin lost a lot of his lustre). Upon closer inspection, none of these great prospects were seen as living up to their hype, and their competition had significantly closed the gap, or even passed them. Crosby, on the other hand, at least in my view, has stayed relatively constant so far in his draft year. I don't think anyone but his most ardent supporters thought Crosby was the next Gretzky: before this year, I think most people thought Crosby had the potential to be the best player in the game for a long time, and I think most people still think he's got the potential to be the best player in the game for a long time--a best in his generation type player, not a best ever type player (and if you look at each generation's best player, you're talking about the collective best the game has ever produced).

    I think as a whole, the 2005 draft isn't living up to its hype. Brule, while a *great* player, hasn't seemed to distinguish himself as a *special* player, as his supporters paint him to be; Kindl isn't looking dominating to say the least; and Latendresse isn't exactly lighting it up. Crosby is one of the only top players who isn't suffering a major drop in expectations.
     
  9. HOCKEY_GURU

    HOCKEY_GURU Registered User

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    I think Lindross was more hyped ..in a nutshell it went something like this:

    there was gretzky (the great one)... then came lemieux (the magnificent one) .. then came the "Next one " (Lindross)...ok you get the idea what sort of expectations was placed on him...lemieux showed that players of Gretzky's calible is possible to come again (when many thought that will never happen ever again)...so when lindross came around ...like some said no one had his physical attributes combined with top notch skills....so some believed he could be the next Mega star... but now that lindross has shown he was never that player..... people again are cautious about the "next One" label...well perhaps in the media/experts anyways.... as opposed to the odd over zelous fan we see here sometimes :D
     
  10. Til the End of Time

    Til the End of Time Registered User

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    Yeah, quite easily. Those guys are basically chopped liver compared to Crosby.
     
  11. The Pucks

    The Pucks Registered User

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    1st. Lindros was hyped more than Crosby, it was horrible.

    2nd, Crosby is suffering through the draft year cycle. Up to this point everybody focused on his positives, but now that its his draft year scouts now look for what is wrong with his game. Virtually every touted prospect goes through this.
     
  12. ZombieMatt

    ZombieMatt Registered User

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    As another poster said, its important to emphasis the ridicoulous amount of attention which Crosby receives on the ice. I've seen four of his games this year, obviously not tons, but every time he touches the puck the entire defensive scheme for the opposing teams is altered. Actually, correct that, the entire way the opposition plays the second he steps on the ice is geared towards making sure he doesn't score. He has 2-3 guys draped all over him every time, he's getting hacked at, high sticked, he has guys like Cabana pulling stunts on him, and amongst all this he's still averaging over 2 PPG.

    That is why his assist numbers are so high (double his goals). It's difficult to score when you're getting Todd Bertuzzi-esque treatment on the ice, but he's able to get the puck to his wingers in great situations and they've been doing a decent job, although they still miss a lot of open chances.
     
  13. trahans99

    trahans99 Registered User

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    I'm surprised to read so many think Lindros was more hyped .... its hard for me to imagine someone being more hyped than Crosby has been the past year and half.

    I'm also surprised b/c i've read that he's the most hyped prospect since Mario. I guess I was wrong from listening to the opinions on this thread so far.
     
  14. pei fan

    pei fan Registered User

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    Crosby's year can be divided into 2 parts this season:pre Cabana and post Cabana.
    pre Cabana;averaging over 3 pts per game high pos +/- his team winning more
    than losing.
    post Cabana;averaging around 1.5 pts per game slightly neg +/- team losing more than they are winning.I've seen him play and he's just not the same.
    However there are other things going on.Rimouski has given the lead role on
    the team to Pouliot and sometime in the second period they put them together.
    Interesting that Crosby's +/- has taken a turn for the worse since he's played with
    Pouliot.Also Sidney has been put on the point on the powerplay and has been feeding Pouliot.There's been a coaching change and the Nics have won their
    last 2 games they may be turning it around.
    Last year Sid was covered alot and took alot of abuse but both things have been
    elevated this year.Is it getting to him.Yes I think so but he should be able to
    learn and grow from it.
     
  15. Form and Substance

    Form and Substance Registered User

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    I was also going to point to point out that he hasn't been the same since the Cabana cheap shot. Oh and on an unrelated note, I've also heard Mailhiot suffered a 7th concussion hence the reason for his premature retirement. Well the real reason to that folks, is that he's finally made his mind up; he'll be designing bathing suits for sears.
     
  16. Dr Love

    Dr Love Registered User

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    I don't know who was more hyped, but Lindros' hype was a bit more tangible, his size was a big factor in his hype; something Crosby doesn't have. I don't know if that makes Crosby more or less hyped, but I think it makes it more intangible, if only a little.

    And the advancement of the internet and such plays some part in Crosby's hype too, that I firmly believe. Back when Lindros was Crosby's age, we didn't have things like this website and forum to share information/spread hype.
     
  17. 12# Peter Bondra

    12# Peter Bondra Registered User

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    What did Cabana do to Crosby? Around here we dont get a lot of info on prospects..
     
  18. Form and Substance

    Form and Substance Registered User

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    Cabana received an eight game suspension for kneeing crosby.
     
  19. Speed Demon

    Speed Demon Registered User

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    Do you guys think that the reason Crosby has decline in the ppg is because of post-symptoms to his injury or is he in perfect physical condition concerning his knee?
     
  20. gb701

    gb701 Registered User

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    Your point is well taken, but applies equally to EVERY hyped prospect, and for that matter every star once he earns his reputation in the league - the better you are, the more other teams key on you. No surprise there. So, all the stars that he is being compared to have had to deal with exactly the same issues.

    I also think that the answers to the question sometimes tell us a lot about the age of posters and whether they were actually paying attention when Lindros or Lemieux or Gretzky or whoever came along. Actually, I see a lot of similarities between Lindros and Crosby - they both have had active and very effective hype "machines" running along for years; both families have played very active roles in not only their son's play but set terms with teams, complained when they felt it necessary, etc.; the hype really went far beyond proven potential at times but was backed up by some pretty incredible play, and so on.

    Crosby could do worse than coming into the league the way Lindros did, and if he is able to avoid injuries, his career could be outstanding. At the same time - I still find it hilarious when someone comes on (as at least two have) and put him into a league above someone like Heatley. I hope there is some sarcasm there.

    Going back a bit farther - what is remarkable about the change in the news and discussions today is that there was very little "hype" around Gretzky - in fact there were a few comments that he would not be able to handle the NHL game - too small, too slow, etc., but before he signed his contract with Skalbania, there were actually not all that many fans who had even heard of him. Hype has been taken to whole new levels by dedicated sports and hockey TV channels and by the internet - and Crosby either benefits from that or suffers from it, depending on your view of things.
     
  21. Rand

    Rand Registered User

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    I'm inclined to agree with others that the hype surrounding Lindros was bigger then that for Crosby, he was more widely known then Crosby is now even outside of hockey circles.
    The hype for Crosby is also benefitted by the advancement of the internet as a more acceptable and mainstream source of information then it once was.

    Lindros at the time was regarded as an entirely new type of player, someone wholly unlike anyone that had come before.
    He was supposed to be bigger, stronger, tougher, more skilled and more determined then anyone else.

    Crosby's hype revolves primarily around his skill set, whereas Lindros was hyped as much due to his incredibly dominant physical presence as his skills.
    The NHL at the time was only beginning to develop into the bigger/stronger physical blend we're accustomed to.
    Lindros was supposed to dominate in every zone, and control the game entirely physically even without taking into account his scoring abilities.


    I think of the hype around Crosby as similar to that Alexandre Daigle saw. Both saw comparisons to Gretzky, and are/were regarded as incredibly talented players with unparalleled abilities. Crosby's hype is probably somewhat more intense then that surrounding Daigle though. Daigle wasn't quite drawing the massive crowds and casual fans Crosby has managed to thus far.
    Crosby was also hyped a lot earlier for a longer period of time then Dailge was.
    Ironically, I think despite Crosby having greater attention to him that the expectations for Daigle may actually have been a bit higher then those for Crosby, though that likely has as much to do with the fact that the hockey community is more aware of the failures of past high profile prospects then was the case during Daigle's draft year.
     
    Last edited: Nov 10, 2004
  22. Dr Love

    Dr Love Registered User

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    In the end, he'll suffer; unless he totally pans out. It might help him the short term with a contract, but what if he "only" becomes as good and accomplishes as much as say, Steve Yzerman? Now there's a career no one would turn down, and no one would be disappointed in. But his hype makes you think he'll be better than that, and no matter how good he becomes, if the hype is that he is expected to be the next once in a generation player, he'll have a hard time living up to it, and nobody can tell what will happen, other than locked threads here as posters scream at each other over how good he really is. But that's the world we live in, look at the hype and media bow down to Michael Vick.
     
  23. 12# Peter Bondra

    12# Peter Bondra Registered User

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    Thanks.
     
  24. Vlad The Impaler

    Vlad The Impaler Registered User

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  25. Dr Love

    Dr Love Registered User

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    *sigh* Thus is the mentality. Never seen the kid play before, but says that he's better than Lindros was at the same age. Imagine what it would have been like if we were all here for when Lindros was in juniors?
     
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