ACC1224
Super Elite, Passing ALL Tests since 2002
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Post-Game Talk: Hyman the only Leaf to show up as Leafs lose 8-4
- Thread starter stickty111
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Nithoniniel
Registered User
Oh my, if plus minus says he was bad then it must be so.
It's true though. You simply can't be on the ice when other players screw up defensively. That's unforgivable.
CantLoseWithMatthews
Registered User
- Sep 28, 2015
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Nylander was on the ice for 9 shots against and 5 went in. Somehow I don't think Nylander is directly responsible for our goalies doing that
Stigma
Registered User
Mess
Global Moderator
Hyman on the other hand posted 1-2-3 points was a +2 on the night and set up Marner for a pair of 1 foot tap in goals.
In case you missed it this was the Leafs highlight of the night.
Matthews has tricky stick flip to teammate
https://www.espn.com/nhl/recap/_/gameId/401145748
After Auston Matthews' teammate loses his stick, Matthews gets it back to him with an unreal behind-the-back stick flip to Morgan Rielly.
Wafflewhipper
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- Jan 18, 2014
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Well since i always pick up for Willy almost to a fault, he was weak defensively a couple times by getting caught cheating to offense. That said, the entire team abused the coaches system with zero regard fir defense to a man. Completely disgusting display of proper hockey. Terrible game by all especially the first period and half.
burn this game right out of our heads is best. It’s not a good comparison to how they generally play. Worst game of the season so far by a mile. I’m just going to forget about it and say they were all equally responsible as a unit on the night.
However there was a development worth noting for Marner in all that bad. Go to the net again Marner it works for you. Marner got mad and went hard to the net without thinking pass first. That was a great idea for him. He should play a bit greedier and hungrier more
Babcocks Marner
It's a magical time
What a horrible Sunday.
First, woken up with the threat of nuclear annihilation.... 12 hours later it was 4-0 Panthers.
All I had left to look forward to was Sunday dinner, when BOOM, oven fries half way through dinner and we had to eat subway..... I hate take out....
What a day, first time ever I am happy about Monday. Sunday needed to end.
First, woken up with the threat of nuclear annihilation.... 12 hours later it was 4-0 Panthers.
All I had left to look forward to was Sunday dinner, when BOOM, oven fries half way through dinner and we had to eat subway..... I hate take out....
What a day, first time ever I am happy about Monday. Sunday needed to end.
Freddy clearly is in another funk. Hutch was always very bad but he put together a couple good games and clearly people lost sight of what he is.
But but but we are going to have a very very hard time winning games when we give up continual 2on1's like we did in 1st and 2nd periods. Q really outcoached Keefe last night. Really really badly out coached him. Like a guy with 4 Cup rings does to a guy with none. And that is ok it is part of the learning curve for Keefe.
I fear every other coach around the league has figured out how we play in the offensive end and might just continue to take advantage of us. Playing the defense pinch every single time and relying on the high centre to stop the breakout every time is a highly risky coaching strategy. Even more so when it is Matty and JT as the primary high centre defender. It leads to numerous odd man chances and too many kill zone opportunities. It only works if Freddy can be all-star Freddy and make 9 saves on the 10 kill zone chances. When he lets in 3 of 5 kill zone chances and another softie on top of that then it is game over. 4 goals against. In pro hockey thats it - you lose.
I hope Keefe can make the adjustments needed. It is tough without Muzzy and team may have to change strategy short term until he is back in lineup.
The other thing that concerns me is when ice tightens up like last night and a team plays a more playoff type game (like what happens in 2nd half of every pro season) our guys do not respond well to that type of game. We let the other team take all the loose pucks and it is really really tough to win when you don't fight for loose pucks. Skill can get you some goals (like last night) but it clearly does not win games. We need some more guys like Hyman who fight for pucks. 1 man can't do it all. Kerfoot can't do it for JT. Move Engval there ASAP. I am not sure he can do it either but Kerfoot can't.
But but but we are going to have a very very hard time winning games when we give up continual 2on1's like we did in 1st and 2nd periods. Q really outcoached Keefe last night. Really really badly out coached him. Like a guy with 4 Cup rings does to a guy with none. And that is ok it is part of the learning curve for Keefe.
I fear every other coach around the league has figured out how we play in the offensive end and might just continue to take advantage of us. Playing the defense pinch every single time and relying on the high centre to stop the breakout every time is a highly risky coaching strategy. Even more so when it is Matty and JT as the primary high centre defender. It leads to numerous odd man chances and too many kill zone opportunities. It only works if Freddy can be all-star Freddy and make 9 saves on the 10 kill zone chances. When he lets in 3 of 5 kill zone chances and another softie on top of that then it is game over. 4 goals against. In pro hockey thats it - you lose.
I hope Keefe can make the adjustments needed. It is tough without Muzzy and team may have to change strategy short term until he is back in lineup.
The other thing that concerns me is when ice tightens up like last night and a team plays a more playoff type game (like what happens in 2nd half of every pro season) our guys do not respond well to that type of game. We let the other team take all the loose pucks and it is really really tough to win when you don't fight for loose pucks. Skill can get you some goals (like last night) but it clearly does not win games. We need some more guys like Hyman who fight for pucks. 1 man can't do it all. Kerfoot can't do it for JT. Move Engval there ASAP. I am not sure he can do it either but Kerfoot can't.
Suntouchable13
Registered User
This is where we'll see how good Keefe is. Babcock refused to make adjustments, hopefully Keefe won't. We have to start winning again, starting tomorrow.
Mess
Global Moderator
BEFORE:
The last time the Leafs gave up 8 or more goals against in a game was November 18th, 2014 when they lost to the Nashville 9-2.
A few post game comments from the captain and the coach.
"When you get beat like that in professional sports, it's embarrassing," Maple Leafs captain Dion Phaneuf said.
Coming off an ugly defeat, Toronto was flat early against the Predators and couldn't muster much in the way of meaningful offense until the game was far out of reach.
Toronto coach Randy Carlyle was disgusted by the "awful performance."
"We need a better performance from everybody," he said. "Goaltending is part of that, defense is part of that, offence, all those things combined for the team effort. It was a team effort in the loss tonight."
AFTER:
History tends to repeat itself as Leafs get embarrassed in a 8-4 loss.
A few post game comments from player and coach
"You take (the loss) as what it is which is a good slap in the face," Maple Leafs coach Sheldon Keefe said. "It's a good reminder of how we can't play if we have any intention at all of being a successful team. It was a big step backwards for us here today defensively."
"Right off the bat there we were giving their best players walk-ins to the net and it's not acceptable," Marner said. "(We) were leaving our goalies out to dry on multiple goals tonight. It's unfair to them and we have to be way better."
The last time the Leafs gave up 8 or more goals against in a game was November 18th, 2014 when they lost to the Nashville 9-2.
A few post game comments from the captain and the coach.
"When you get beat like that in professional sports, it's embarrassing," Maple Leafs captain Dion Phaneuf said.
Coming off an ugly defeat, Toronto was flat early against the Predators and couldn't muster much in the way of meaningful offense until the game was far out of reach.
Toronto coach Randy Carlyle was disgusted by the "awful performance."
"We need a better performance from everybody," he said. "Goaltending is part of that, defense is part of that, offence, all those things combined for the team effort. It was a team effort in the loss tonight."
AFTER:
History tends to repeat itself as Leafs get embarrassed in a 8-4 loss.
A few post game comments from player and coach
"You take (the loss) as what it is which is a good slap in the face," Maple Leafs coach Sheldon Keefe said. "It's a good reminder of how we can't play if we have any intention at all of being a successful team. It was a big step backwards for us here today defensively."
"Right off the bat there we were giving their best players walk-ins to the net and it's not acceptable," Marner said. "(We) were leaving our goalies out to dry on multiple goals tonight. It's unfair to them and we have to be way better."
The Man with a Plan
Registered User
Against the top skilled teams who skate the leafs just can't pinch down all the time. Some of the forwards have grind it out down low without support from the D. The Panthers did a great job of clogging up the neutral zone and attacking the puck carriers then waiting for the leaf D to pinch and going for the breakout pass.
The solution to the above? Dump, chase and grind - which the Panthers know the leafs are reluctant to do.
All that being said if Freddy isn't better it's all a moot point.
Clark4Ever
What we do in hockey echoes in eternity...
Is it just me, or has Freddy's game gone south ever since Hutchinson got that unexpected start recently?
Whatever the case, this is one of his worst stretches in a Leaf uniform, and he needs to get back on track quickly. We don't have enough of a margin for error thanks to the start we had under Babcock.
Whatever the case, this is one of his worst stretches in a Leaf uniform, and he needs to get back on track quickly. We don't have enough of a margin for error thanks to the start we had under Babcock.
tmlfan98
No More Excuses #MarnerOut
Guys of course the defence is **** right now. None of this should be a surprise.
Like ffs not only are Marincin and Ceci both playing every night, they're on the same pair!!
Like ffs not only are Marincin and Ceci both playing every night, they're on the same pair!!
Clark4Ever
What we do in hockey echoes in eternity...
It's also deflating for the entire team when your starting goaltender can't make a good save in the early going.
I'm not letting the rest of the team off the hook, but Freddy could have realistically stopped 2-3 of those goals, and then the game would have had an entirely different complexion.
There is only 1 guy Zach who can grind it out as you say. The solution with this personnel group can never be dump and chase. It will be dump and give up the puck. It has no chance of success with this constructed roster. Matty (can do it but lacks will to do it to avoid injury), JT (can do it but too slow to get in on forecheck), Marner (too small), Willy (again too small and does not want to), Goat (too slow and not physical), Kerfoot (does not want to play like that a pure skater boy), Spezza (same as JT), AJ (willing but can't stay on his feet easily pushed off puck), Kappy (willing and has skills but a little small too). Bottom line to many guys who either can't OR don't want to play a dump and chase game. I can't see how it ever can be successful for our Leafs.
CelticDruid
Registered User
Holl woke up this morning and found out that he was still in "Back to The Future"
Not a single Leaf got angry.........................................................................
The Leaf fans left early because not a single Leaf player got angry.............
Not a single Leaf got angry.........................................................................
The Leaf fans left early because not a single Leaf player got angry.............
Wafflewhipper
Registered User
- Jan 18, 2014
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No, maybe I wasn't clear, I think quality shots are important and like I said many of Florida's goals came from bad not quality shots. Andersen and Hutchinson both had bad games.
Thread The Needle
I have no strong feelings one way or the other.
In this instance, they were only on for like 2 GA while Barrie was on for 5. I'm certainly not saying Marincin-Ceci is a good pairing, but they can't be the only ones to blame. Like many have pointed out, the forwards need to be more aware and responsible. Also, the team as a whole is pretty bad at predicting and breaking up the cycle.
Somehow I think the run they had was due to the adrenaline rush from when they hired Keefe. Now that has worn off and they are returning to where they were under Babcock (I hated Babcock and was very happy when he was fired and Keefe was hired. It was a very noticeable improvement under Keefe).
However, this team has one very glaring weakness, playing defence, and possibly a backup goalie, not to mention that Anderson has been a little shaky lately.
I think it says a lot about a team when they have multiple non-showings in games (vs Penguins as one example), and not having played since last Wednesday. They should have been the ones carrying the play at the start of the game. I don’t know how they could look in the mirror today, or take their next paycheque!
Extremely embarrassing!
ITM
I've seen things you people wouldn't believe...
- Jan 26, 2012
- 4,546
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Absolutely.
Slightly off topic but germane...
Was watching highlights from an early 80s Leafs/Oilers bout. The score at the end of the game was 7-1.
If I said to a Leafs fan, that that game was between a Gretzky/Fuhr led Oilers club against a Vaive/Laroque led Leafs team, and that the only #99 in the Three Stars that night was Wilf Paiement, they might think I remembered the game after a beer or twelve.
But that’s exactly what happened. IT happens. IT will happen again. This club needs to learn to win in the same arduous, lengthy process it takes most clubs.
Why a streak here or there inspires or deflates our fanbase to such extremes against these truths is beyond me.
Patience isn’t going to be taken out of the championship recipe just for us.
Last edited:
tmlfan98
No More Excuses #MarnerOut
I get it, last night specifically Marincin and Ceci weren't the worst, but if you have to play these guys every single night, what is the ripple effect that's gonna have on the rest of the defence?
I would have to imagine Marincin-Ceci is getting some of the most sheltered 3rd pair minutes of all time. But that's already a huge problem because Rielly-Barrie and Dermott-Holl (to a lesser extent than the other 2 pairs) aren't who you want facing top comp either.
Honestly, what is stopping the Leafs from just waiving Ceci and calling up Rasmus and Tim at this point? Dubas, who tf cares that you're trying to trade Ceci, getting rid of Zaitsev alone was a big enough win that no one is gonna care if Ceci gets waived instead of this terrible showcasing that's going on. All that's been showcased is how **** this guy is.
Like cmon just look at this:
Rielly-Barrie
Sandin-Holl
Dermott-Liljegren
You all definitely wanna see this instead of the garbage we've been putting out there since Muzzin's been out.
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