How worthless is the " Messier leadership " award?

[BehindTheTimes]

Mark Messier, the most overrated, mystical being the NHL has ever seen.

 

[me2]

It is the Cold FX of awards.

 

[Blueblood2]

The award is flawed not because of being named the Messier award. Ask any player and not the whiny Vancouver fans and they will tell you the truth. However, it IS useless as it should be a player's poll award where you cant vote for your own teammate. As far as Messier in Vancouver....he never wanted to go there. It was just an outlet to try and stick it to the Rangers.

 

[hohosaregood]

should only go to the captain of the SCF winning team

 

[notsocommonsense]

The award is flawed not because of being named the Messier award. Ask any player and not the whiny Vancouver fans and they will tell you the truth. However, it IS useless as it should be a player's poll award where you cant vote for your own teammate. As far as Messier in Vancouver....he never wanted to go there. It was just an outlet to try and stick it to the Rangers.

Easily my favourite take on this subject.

So Messier signed somewhere he didn’t want to be, only to act like a jerk for 3 years there, just to stick it to the team he used to play for.

I’m convinced, that’s leadership!

 

[GordieHowsUrBreath]

the award was well deserved when crosby and toews won it, being in the foxhole with those guys while bombs are exploding would make me feel like i'm under silk sheets in a gated community

it lost prestige when guys like dustin brown won it, that guy ain't no leader hence him losing the C

alfredsson won it too, this is a guy that when asked by a reporter "is the series over" when the sens were down 3 - 1 to the pens in the 2013 playoff series, he answered "yeah probably" LMAO what a leader

 

[thethirdhockeyman91]

the award was well deserved when crosby and toews won it, being in the foxhole with those guys while bombs are exploding would make me feel like i'm under silk sheets in a gated community

it lost prestige when guys like dustin brown won it, that guy ain't no leader hence him losing the C

alfredsson won it too, this is a guy that when asked by a reporter "is the series over" when the sens were down 3 - 1 to the pens in the 2013 playoff series, he answered "yeah probably" LMAO what a leader

Don’t forget the time when he tried to take neidermayer’s balls off with a slap shot.

 

[ScaredStreit]

Silly award but Yzerman would have been a much better choice if they insisted on having it (provided he wasn’t the Bolts’s GM).

 

[Perfect_Drug]

I'm guessing you're trying to get a rise out of Canucks fans?

I'm not even a fan but of the team but Messier's misdeeds with Vancouver are pretty clear, starting with the hit on Linden in 94. Underperforming on a big contract, blaming things like the quality of the ice, wearing Maki's number, taking the C from real leader Linden.

I lived in Vancouver at the time.

Underperformed on a big contract? He was 36-40 years old. What did you expect?

Fans love to believe he went up to Linden and ripped the C from his jersey himself by force.

But the captaincy was offered by Linden, and management allowed the use of #11 because Maki's jersey was never retired.

 

[ES]

As the winner is picked by Messier himself, I wonder what happens with the award when he's no longer with us.

Not saying it would happen soon but more likely in 30-40 years. He's 57 years old now.

 

[Perfect_Drug]

That's pretty much what he did in Vancouver. In my example I forgot to start with imagining a player cheapshotted Yzerman in the playoffs, then came to the team a few years later and took his captaincy.

And I didn't even get into the stuff about his role in shipping players out and having the owner and GM's ear on personnel because it's harder to know for sure how true that was.

All baseless rumors and conjecture.

Until this day every Canuck fan is SO upset their beloved pylon of a former captain was traded for the BEST POWER FORWARD IN THE LEAGUE in Bertuzzi, Star Dman McCabe and fan favourite agitator Ruutu.

But yeah. How awful the baseless conjecture lead to a lopsided fleecing of Milbury that directly lead to the Canucks ascension to the top of the league.



I never understood how Canucks fans couldn't see they missed the playoffs the year before Messier got there, and all those moves and trades lead them back to the top of the league in a very short time

 

[Seanaconda]

All baseless rumors and conjecture.

Until this day every Canuck fan is SO upset their beloved pylon of a former captain was traded for the BEST POWER FORWARD IN THE LEAGUE in Bertuzzi, Star Dman McCabe and fan favourite agitator Ruutu.

But yeah. How awful the baseless conjecture lead to a lopsided fleecing of Milbury that directly lead to the Canucks ascension to the top of the league.



I never understood how Canucks fans couldn't see they missed the playoffs the year before Messier got there, and all those moves and trades lead them back to the top of the league in a very short time

They have a picture of his napkin contract on the internet somewhere

 

[tarheelhockey]

It’s the Lady Byng Award of the 21st century.

 

[Lazlo Hollyfeld]

I lived in Vancouver at the time.

Underperformed on a big contract? He was 36-40 years old. What did you expect?

Fans love to believe he went up to Linden and ripped the C from his jersey himself by force.

But the captaincy was offered by Linden, and management allowed the use of #11 because Maki's jersey was never retired.

They probably didn't expect his production to fall by 20+ points in a single season and never rebound.

And I'm aware of the situation with Maki's number. It's still a jackass move. That's why I used the equivalent of someone coming to Detroit, taking the captaincy from Yzerman (after cheapshotting him in the playoffs a few years earlier) and taking Vladdy's number.

As for the captaincy, what exactly was Linden supposed to do, hide the C? By taking the captaincy, Messier is showing he is coming in to be the new leader of the team. His leadership involved taking the captaincy from a beloved player, wearing a dead players unofficially retired number, and then underperforming.

It's not hard to understand why Canucks fans hate Messier. They have plenty of solid reasons.

 

[Lazlo Hollyfeld]

They have a picture of his napkin contract on the internet somewhere

 

[Perfect_Drug]

They probably didn't expect his production to fall by 20+ points in a single season and never rebound.

His final year as a Canuck he had 54 points in 66 games. The height of the dead puck era when scoring league-wide plummetted.

As a 39 year old, his PPG was the same as Jarome Iginla, Chris Drury, Vincent Lecavalier, Kovalev, Fleury, and his #1 supporter who defends him, and takes personal offense to ill-will being thrown towards Messier: MARCUS NASLUND.

Most Canucks fans don't even remember, that Messier lead the Canucks into being a great team the final half of his last season there. They were going to make the playoffs, until Messier got injured, and the canucks went into a horrible tail-spin that ended their season.

And I'm aware of the situation with Maki's number. It's still a jackass move. That's why I used the equivalent of someone coming to Detroit, taking the captaincy from Yzerman (after cheapshotting him in the playoffs a few years earlier) and taking Vladdy's number.

Except it has nothing to do with that, and is not even close. Yzerman was a 150 point player who won cups, while Linden was 0.5PPG player, on a non-playoff team before he personally offered the captaincy to a 36 year old.

Canucks fans don't realise they were REBUILDING. And when Teams rebuild they tend to lose.

Except the Vancouver Canucks fanbase seems to scapegoat Messier for the rebuilding years in what became a VERY successful rebuild.

 

[Perfect_Drug]

Next Up, St.Louis fans claiming Gretzky isn't the Greatest ever, because of his time in St.L.

 

[StoneHands]

The best denfensive forward among those who are better offensively than 80% to 95% of the league's forwards .....sorry but that award lost all meaning through the years.

The best defensive forwards in todays NHL are also good offensive players. There are no longer 3rd line defensive specialists like Madden and Draper. Who is clearly better defensively than guys like Bergeron, Couturier, and Kopitar?

 

[Price is Wright]

Silly award but Yzerman would have been a much better choice if they insisted on having it (provided he wasn’t the Bolts’s GM).

I don't think any award should be named for a player until they haven't been active for 30 years or passed away. Rocket Richard Award was 35 years after Richard played. By then it was clear he was the right guy to name it after.

Any leadership award should have been named after Beliveau but they might have not wanted another Hab. In that case I would have gone with Red Kelly.

 

[Mr Positive]

lol this thread.

yes there were problems with the Canucks, but they probably got him for the wrong reasons anyway. Messier was still in their collective memories because his will and leadership is what ripped away their best chance at a Stanley Cup in 94. The team had decided that Linden didn't have the leadership qualities it would take to win the cup, which was probably true. That Canucks team had problems aside from Messier, and he became their scapegoat when things didn't go well (and maybe them moving away from Linden in the first place was scapegoating him).

Ultimately, Messier was only there for 3 seasons so I don't see how that time should stand as representative of his career especially considering his "bad" years were well out of his prime when he shouldn't have been expected to be some saviour in the first place.

 

[SillyRabbit]

The award is about as valuable as going out of your way to elbow someone who has already been lying on the ice for 10+ seconds from the first cheap shot you gave them earlier in the shift.