News Article: How the Leafs adjusted, from their defensive zone formation to their breakout against the Jets

[Kamiccolo]

Wheeler: How the Leafs adjusted, from their defensive zone...

I think this is an awesome article that everyone should take some time to read. It really breaks down the issue that a lot of us have been saying. The defense isn't that bad, it's the forward support that is causing all the issues in our own zone.

The author broke the system down into digestible clips showing how the system works and the weakness of the system (the play goes back to the point) and chances are happening from there. The issue is our forwards are standing around not allowing the D any chance to make an outlet pass, forcing them to try the stretch pass as their only option.

He then shows how against the Jets the Leafs were coming back and supporting the D allowing quick touches and exiting the zone with speed and control.

Click to read more...

 

[MR4]

Considering this has been a problem for the past 2 years, the responsibility falls on Babcock and co.

 

[bonjovi0308]

Does that mean players don't listen to Babcock?

 

[member 298589]

Considering this has been a problem for the past 2 years, the responsibility falls on Babcock and co.

2 years to try, for a coach like Babs, is pretty much an open-armed embrace.

 

[White Shadow]

Considering this has been a problem for the past 2 years, the responsibility falls on Babcock and co.

Wild guess here but I don't think you read the article.

 

[BoredBrandonPridham]

Great article, instant Babcock shit thread thanks to armchair coaches.

Boobcock

Egocock

Etc etc...

 

[MR4]

Great article, instant Babcock **** thread thanks to armchair coaches.

Boobcock

Egocock

Etc etc...

Wild guess here but I don't think you read the article.

I did. 1 game of using our forwards well vs 2 years of it being rush rush rush with no support doesn’t mean Babcock deserves a pat on the back for the Jets game, he deserves to be questioned on why he didn’t fix such an obvious problem earlier (and 1 game doesn’t mean it’s fixed either, he has to COACH it into them)

 

[White Shadow]

I did. 1 game of using our forwards well vs 2 years of it being rush rush rush with no support doesn’t mean Babcock deserves a pat on the back for the Jets game, he deserves to be questioned on why he didn’t fix such an obvious problem earlier (and 1 game doesn’t mean it’s fixed either, he has to COACH it into them)

Maybe you missed the part where he shows Matthews, Hyman, Marner and Kappy not executing the structure very well. How they need to be less stationary and how the forwards need to not be in such a hurry to leave our own zone.

If some players are doing it properly and some are not is that on the coach? Because I guarantee you if he took ice time away from those players to send the message home there's a huge uproar in Dramaland.

 

[thewave]

Wheeler: How the Leafs adjusted, from their defensive zone...

I think this is an awesome article that everyone should take some time to read. It really breaks down the issue that a lot of us have been saying. The defense isn't that bad, it's the forward support that is causing all the issues in our own zone.

The author broke the system down into digestible clips showing how the system works and the weakness of the system (the play goes back to the point) and chances are happening from there. The issue is our forwards are standing around not allowing the D any chance to make an outlet pass, forcing them to try the stretch pass as their only option.

He then shows how against the Jets the Leafs were coming back and supporting the D allowing quick touches and exiting the zone with speed and control.

They could have read a handful of our posts (mine included) over the past couple years. We laid it all out here at HFBoards, no pay, no glory, no anything. I was a broken record about this stuff... It's not the D it's the system, it's not the D it's the support, it's not just the D it's Smith. I bet 100+ people have me blocked because of those posts alone and how I annoyingly repeat myself over and over and over again.

 

[thewave]

Maybe you missed the part where he shows Matthews, Hyman, Marner and Kappy not executing the structure very well. How they need to be less stationary and how the forwards need to not be in such a hurry to leave our own zone.

If some players are doing it properly and some are not is that on the coach? Because I guarantee you if he took ice time away from those players to send the message home there's a huge uproar in Dramaland.

They refused to adjust, other adjustments were made and were executed along the way. This was on Smith and Babcock and it's really obvious in how, well, Babcock had them playing a slightly refined Carlyle system until that Winnipeg game where things seemed to work well.

 

[zeke]

Considering this has been a problem for the past 2 years, the responsibility falls on Babcock and co.

I mean, yeah.

This is exactly what a coach is paid for.

 

[zeke]

They refused to adjust, other adjustments were made and were executed along the way. This was on Smith and Babcock and it's really obvious in how, well, Babcock had them playing a slightly refined Carlyle system until that Winnipeg game where things seemed to work well.

this makes me so angry, because it's so true.

it's the same "cheater" system, where you're trying to win games by outclevering the other team instead of outplaying them.

 

[White Shadow]

They refused to adjust, other adjustments were made and were executed along the way. This was on Smith and Babcock and it's really obvious in how, well, Babcock had them playing a slightly refined Carlyle system until that Winnipeg game where things seemed to work well.

Wrong in just so many ways.

 

[thewave]

Wrong in just so many ways.

It seems apparent to me, maybe others don't see what I see. He has his little 5 game thing, he switches it up a little every 20 games or around that so other teams don't predict our every move. It's not hard to break down Babcock and Smith little game. It still relies heavy on his G-Pros and the stretch passes and the dump and chase RC style but uses soft obstruction better. It's really annoying tbh and the Winnipeg game was some of the best ACTUAL CEREBRAL HOCKEY I have seen this team play yet. A good mix.

We went from 100 IQ Hockey to 125 IQ vs WPG.

 

[White Shadow]

It seems apparent to me, maybe others don't see what I see. He has his little 5 game thing, he switches it up a little every 20 games or around that so other teams don't predict our every move. It's not hard to break down Babcock and Smith little game. It still relies heavy on his G-Pros and the stretch passes and the dump and chase RC style but uses soft obstruction better. It's really annoying tbh and the Winnipeg game was some of the best ACTUAL CEREBRAL HOCKEY I have seen this team play yet. A good mix.

We went from 100 IQ Hockey to 125 IQ vs WPG.

No

 

[thewave]

No

Break it all down. Lay it out man in depth I am dying to hear it when you have time.

 

[Shanty]

No

Listen, I tend to agree with you, but this is pretty lazy posting.

 

[White Shadow]

Break it all down. Lay it out man in depth I am dying to hear it when you have time.

You clearly didn't read the article either so what is the point even commenting on yours.

The only part you were remotely correct about was the RC system being somewhat similar to Babcock's (it isn't). The similarities end with neither system covering the point. But, guess what? Most NHL teams don't cover the point man either.

Tell you what. Explain the differences between Babock's defensive system and RC's. Let's just see how much you can get on your own since you clearly believe you have this unmatched hockey knowledge.

 

[Kazparov]

Anyone want to copypasta this article onto here. I don't have the Athletic

 

[WTFMAN99]

I read this earlier and it was interesting how quickly someone picked up on this in the media and decided to write an article. If it's obvious to us, and him then Babcock and co. should be able to break this down a lot in the video room for our players.

You can point at the players or Babcock but it's an issue either way.

 

[Liminality]

Anyone want to copypasta this article onto here. I don't have the Athletic

Don't feel it's right to copy paste the entire article but I'll try and give a short summary.

They talk about how after the two really bad games against Pitts and St.Louis, they needed to adjust. Babcock mentions the offense dried up because of two reason. Lack of work ethic/detail and teams playing good against the Leafs after watching how they run. So in a sense adjusting to the teams adjusting to them.

Before they went on to the adjustments they showcase a huge amount of mistakes that the Leafs players did in the two games. They take note of the team running a tight box defense which has apparently been getting too tight. Players floating, being out of position and puck watching. I think this part explains it pretty well so I'll leave a quote. "The other ripple effect of collapsing into such a tight box is that it requires all three forwards involved in the play to be elastic, and swing or rotate to pursue pucks when they can’t get sticks in passing lanes. When they’re too static, it defeats the purpose. For years, Tyler Bozak and James van Riemsdyk struggled with this."

Lots of people being static in those games, just not enough hustle to work that type of coverage. They call out Matthews, Kapanen, Hyman and Marner as some of the culprits for this.

"One problem leads to another. What starts with stagnant defensive zone formations and the surrendering of a lot of shots on goal from plays to the trailer or the defencemen, is made worse by significant time spent in the defensive zone when, after regaining possession, the Leafs can’t break the puck out."
Fast forward to the Jets game, they showcase a couple really good breakouts with good support for the Leafs. Lots of players touching the puck before it even gets out of the zone and lots of speed being created from it.

So in the end Pitts and St.Louis games = slow out of the zone. Jets game = fast out of the zone.
“Our structure was good, especially breaking through the neutral zone. That was really the difference tonight. Guys were in the right places at the right time and able to sort out who their guy is in the defensive zone,” Kadri added, describing the problems of the previous two games down to the detail. “They like to run a lot of those pop plays where they’re getting their Grade A scoring chances from the tops of the circles. We were able to sort things out well.”

So really Babcock's system didn't change that much, it seems like it was the players attention to detail that gave us those two losses.

 

[thewave]

You clearly didn't read the article either so what is the point even commenting on yours.

The only part you were remotely correct about was the RC system being somewhat similar to Babcock's (it isn't). The similarities end with neither system covering the point. But, guess what? Most NHL teams don't cover the point man either.

Tell you what. Explain the differences between Babock's defensive system and RC's. Let's just see how much you can get on your own since you clearly believe you have this unmatched hockey knowledge.

Very lazy posting answering a question with a question. I will be lazy as well but go further...

https://hfboards.mandatory.com/thre...d-which-existing-players-will-thrive.1899199/
Maple Leafs Systems - Neutral Zone & Offensive Zone Forechecking | Maple Leafs Hotstove
Leafs' D-Zone Winger Positioning
https://mapleleafshotstove.com/2015/05/26/exploring-mike-babcocks-systems/
https://www.tsn.ca/leafs-adapting-babcock-s-40-second-shift-mentality-1.838066

It's what I said, a tweaked Carlyle system essentially with better players and better buy in. Both coaches even dog guys they dislike which is quite funny.

 

[Polaris1010]

Break it all down. Lay it out man in depth I am dying to hear it when you have time.

I did not read the article. I wanted to post something in the post game thread but they started talking about sexual politics and the upright mod closed it down. So let post what I wanted to post, and it may related to the discussion. That article I did not read, it could be good or bogus.

What works is dump and chase go forecheck, and the other thing that works is the stretch pass. This Leafs team will only find success with this on offense.

There is irrefutable evidence from one game that this works, and that was the win in Winnipeg.

All four line scored a goal in the win. Not a single goal was the direct result of a clean break out. There was no - breakout, rush the puck through the neutral zone, and he shots he scores. None. All the Leafs goals came another way.

First goal great forecheck. Would Nylander have done the same? We'll probably find out later.

Second goal, another forecheck type of goal, where Ozhiganov made a good pinch, Levio a good play covering the point, and Ennis gets a goal. What happen, just like the first goal, not predicated on the type of breakout that was used.

Third goal, Zaitsev makes a great tape to tape stretch pass to Brown who banks it off the boards on the fly to Kadri and he shoots and he scores! After the game, people complain about how bad Gardiner and Zaitsev were of course.

Fourth goal, the flip of the puck by Ozhiganov, the bomb into the neutral zone, and Marner did his thang by taking it to da net and garbage man Tavares with the clean up.

That's how the Leafs have been playing the past two years, that's how the Leafs have been winning the last two years. Stretch pass and forecheck.

If the forwards do not come back to support the defense and all three are waiting for the stretch pass, then one of them should come back, and that someone should be the center. In the Winnipeg, nursing the 2 goal lead in the 3rd, everyone came back into the zone. So they win!

Go Leafs Go!

 

[White Shadow]

Very lazy posting answering a question with a question. I will be lazy as well but go further...

https://hfboards.mandatory.com/thre...d-which-existing-players-will-thrive.1899199/
Maple Leafs Systems - Neutral Zone & Offensive Zone Forechecking | Maple Leafs Hotstove
Leafs' D-Zone Winger Positioning
https://mapleleafshotstove.com/2015/05/26/exploring-mike-babcocks-systems/
https://www.tsn.ca/leafs-adapting-babcock-s-40-second-shift-mentality-1.838066

It's what I said, a tweaked Carlyle system essentially with better players and better buy in. Both coaches even dog guys they dislike which is quite funny.

And you think I am lazy. This proves you can cut and paste but it doesn't prove you can comprehend.

When you talk about buy in, dogging and skill as opposed to the actual question regarding structure you really make it seem like you have no clue about the X's and O's of our team.

 

[Slyfox]

The blame lie soleys on Babcock. During his first year we actually played well and made quick passes to exit the zone. Our possession number were better in year 1 of Babcock than the subsequent years due to this. Not sure why we strayed from this.