How many years has Sidney Crosby been the best player?

[kladorf2005]

Looking at PPG rank since Crosby entered the league. I'm aware he's got a lot of missed games in there (so do some others, though). But this is still pretty interesting to see how consistent he's been compared to the rest.

Player​

05-06​

06-07​

07-08​

08-09​

09-10​

10-11​

11-12​

12-13​

13-14​

14-15​

15-16​

16-17​

17-18​

Kovalchuk​

7​

43​

12​

6​

13​

72​

5​

39​

​

​

​

​

​

St. Louis​

102​

7​

22​

22​

9​

3​

17​

2​

31​

69​

​

​

​

Datsyuk​

14​

18​

8​

5​

37​

11​

18​

16​

40​

6​

58​

​

​

Jagr​

2​

12​

44​

​

​

​

75​

50​

42​

112​

30​

148​

​

Iginla​

82​

3​

7​

9​

43​

12​

42​

59​

47​

66​

142​

325​

​

Thornton​

1​

2​

9​

13​

12​

31​

20​

40​

21​

30​

7​

112​

76​

H. Sedin​

55​

33​

30​

19​

2​

5​

11​

26​

74​

18​

57​

125​

133​

D. Sedin​

64​

25​

38​

19​

3​

2​

23​

38​

105​

14​

56​

163​

111​

Zetterberg​

20​

21​

5​

27​

26​

13​

33​

15​

6​

23​

124​

33​

107​

Crosby​

6​

1​

2​

3​

4​

1​

1​

1​

1​

1​

4​

2​

13​

Ovechkin​

5​

16​

1​

1​

1​

9​

38​

5​

11​

8​

20​

29​

15​

Getzlaf​

131​

110​

16​

8​

15​

6​

92​

7​

3​

16​

32​

10​

12​

Malkin​

​

19​

3​

2​

8​

37​

2​

14​

2​

7​

5​

4​

3​

Kane​

​

​

43​

45​

14​

13​

49​

4​

13​

4​

1​

6​

37​

Backstrom​

​

​

51​

11​

5​

40​

7​

19​

18​

11​

15​

8​

47​

Stamkos​

​

​

​

165​

6​

7​

4​

3​

5​

19​

31​

3​

11​

Giroux​

​

​

​

128​

152​

20​

3​

19​

9​

17​

25​

66​

6​

Benn​

​

​

​

​

202​

51​

27​

44​

16​

3​

2​

20​

29​

Tavares​

​

​

​

​

108​

39​

11​

22​

4​

5​

21​

24​

21​

Seguin​

​

​

​

​

​

400​

39​

86​

8​

2​

6​

21​

34​

Kucherov​

​

​

​

​

​

​

​

​

325​

44​

26​

5​

4​

MacKinnon​

​

​

​

​

​

​

​

​

54​

121​

69​

103​

2​

McDavid​

​

​

​

​

​

​

​

​

​

​

3​

1​

1​

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

 

[Dondini]

Eh, as a fan I wouldn't trade a single season of cheering for Ovechkin for any player since he has come into the league.

Eh that’s fair, Ovechkin is basically the only answer I would accept. Ovy is one of my favourite players. An absolute beast who hasn’t got nearly the credit from Canadian media about his physicality(or anything else). If Crosby was that physical Crosby would basically be paraded around as a Scott Stevens with Lemieux skill

 

[daver]

We're obviously in the minority but that's how I see things too. Of course to argue this you have to be pretty loose with the term "best player in the world" - no question about that, but that's how I generally view it when I talk about best player in the world. Ie in the late 90s, to me it's Jagr/Hasek - not Jagr *or* Hasek.

If a discussion wants to be had about who had the absolute best performance/season in a given year, different topic with only 1 guy eligible and Crosby looks a lot worst.

But I don't think if you asked someone in 2015, 2013, 2009 or 2016 who the "best hockey player in the world was" - that Crosby's name wouldn't come up in a large majority of cases.

I would also argue that:

- You can probably take that title away from Crosby at some point between this season (18-19) or even last year. I think most people today say McDavid surpassed him, and Crosby hasn't really done anything to warrant being #1 still.

- You should add McDavid to 2016-2017. Maybe in the moment, you don't add him that year (see if it's sustainable and not just a lucky season) - but since he's now showing consistency, absolutely McDavid as co best in 16-17.

- MacKinnon in my book is well on his way to working his way into the conversation alongside McDavid this year. If he makes this sustainable - i add his name back retroactively to last year too.

Putting McDavid as co-best back to 16/17 fine as long as Crosby is co-best after last season. Not so sure how this year plays out. Crosby has the same PPG as McDavid so far; both clearly behind the leaders. I think the playoffs could play a large role in who is at the top. If things stay the same, it could be three players at the top.

Looking forward to the "how many years Howe was best vs. Crosby" in the HOH. I expect the same amount of pushback.

 

[Midnight Judges]

Except unlike Crosby, Gordie Howe actually was the best player as evidenced by him having 6 Harts to Crosby's 2.

 

[Rodgerwilco]

He had 66 in 41, and 73 in 52, Led the scoring in both cases until injury. He was the best player on the ice when played. Or should we completely ignore this and just look at the absolute numbers without any context?

Last year, yeah, underwhelming, but still a solid season.

Imagine looking at straight point totals and ignoring PPG or the fact that he missed literally half a season in one year and 30 games in the other and thinking that you actually made a decent point..... lol. Or describing 89 points in 75 games as "firmly an 80-something player".

Took the rest of the league something like 4.5 weeks without Crosby even playing in 12-13 to catch him in points, but yeah, Ovi was better because he had more goals and led his team to playoff appearance (a first-round exit in which Ovi scored 1 Goal in 7 games). But then the year where Crosby literally won the goal-scoring race and led his team to a Stanley Cup victory (while capturing the Conn Smythe) that's not good enough for him.

I wonder if he thinks Yzerman, Marcel Dionne, and Ron Francis are better than Mario, too because they had more points... lol.

 

[filinski77]

Probably from 2010/2011 to 2015/2016 if we are talking on a consistent basis year to year.

05/06 ovi was clearly better (but neither was the best player in the league)

06/07 crosby clearly better

07/08 - 09/10 ovi was clearly better. Lead 3x g/gp and p/gp, won 3 straight lindsays as the leagues most outstanding player. His possession numbers were so much better than malkin/crosby because his offence was so dominant, that any arguments of defensive ability aren't looking at the whole picture.

 

[Hockey4Lyfe]

Crosby has been the best player on the planet since he entered the league.

He relinquished that title last year to McDavid.

/Close thread

 

[GlitchMarner]

Anyone could see that OV had no regard for defense in those days. It's not a critique.

His possession statistics were far above Crosby's in '08-'09. Crosby finished sixth in Hart voting despite not missing many games. There is nothing in statistics or award voting that supports the notion that they were all that close that season and I don't see why the playoffs should make up for the discrepancy in the season just because Crosby played more playoff games and scored more points in the playoffs, especially considering he didn't have a great showing against DET in the SCF that year.

You can go back to '07 or '06 or whatever, but I don't put as much weight in what happened two or three seasons earlier as you seem to. Crosby was the best player in '07 and that's enough to have made him the best player in the League after that season even though he wasn't really close to Thornton in '06. Ovechkin was good enough in '08 that '09 vaulted him ahead of Crosby for me. McDavid was good enough in '17 that '18 put him at the top. MacK was good enough last season that he can get to the top this season.

 

[gwh]

2 seasons: 06-07 and 13-14

NHL has awards to close discussion like this.

 

[Felidae]

We're obviously in the minority but that's how I see things too. Of course to argue this you have to be pretty loose with the term "best player in the world" - no question about that, but that's how I generally view it when I talk about best player in the world. Ie in the late 90s, to me it's Jagr/Hasek - not Jagr *or* Hasek.

If a discussion wants to be had about who had the absolute best performance/season in a given year, different topic with only 1 guy eligible and Crosby looks a lot worst.

But I don't think if you asked someone in 2015, 2013, 2009 or 2016 who the "best hockey player in the world was" - that Crosby's name wouldn't come up in a large majority of cases.

I would also argue that:

- You can probably take that title away from Crosby at some point between this season (18-19) or even last year. I think most people today say McDavid surpassed him, and Crosby hasn't really done anything to warrant being #1 still.

- You should add McDavid to 2016-2017. Maybe in the moment, you don't add him that year (see if it's sustainable and not just a lucky season) - but since he's now showing consistency, absolutely McDavid as co best in 16-17.

- MacKinnon in my book is well on his way to working his way into the conversation alongside McDavid this year. If he makes this sustainable - i add his name back retroactively to last year too.

Crosby looks better than he actually is using your loose definition.

Why be imprecise?

Daver's list seems to imply the two players were interchangeable as the best in each of those seasons. When clearly, Crosby was better than Thornton in 2006, as was Ovechkin during his 3 year peak.



Crosby's strength is his consistency being one of the best players, not in being the best player. If anything, your second paragraph was the more accurate definition of the OP's inquiry. Unless the answer is ambiguous as to who the best player was that season, I don't see how there shouldn't only be one player eligible as the best in a given year.

 

[GlitchMarner]

If you ask the players all will tell you Crosby. Why? They know just how good he is in all aspects of the game. Has he lost a little yes. But watch him play and he is still the guy teams fear the most. The constant comparison to OVI is a joke. OVI is a goal scorer and that is that. Like the Laine, he has that ability to score but he is not better that a center who can take face offs, distribute the puck and set up team mates on a consistent basis. But after seeing Mathews, and all the other younger players of note, no one offers the complete game Crosby offers. Win cups and go to finals before naming anyone better.

This isn't true for last decade, though. Ovechkin was beating him for Pearsons and Harts year after year. Crosby's all-around game wasn't as developed back then as it is now and Ovechkin was more dynamic and electrifying than he is now. The idea that Crosby was on another level is entirely revisionist history.

 

[GlitchMarner]

2 seasons: 06-07 and 13-14

NHL has awards to close discussion like this.

He had injury problems that limited him when it comes to major awards. I don't think there's any way he loses the Art Ross, Hart or Pearson in 2011 with a full or almost a full season played. With more games played in 2013 he takes the Ross and probably the Hart.

He hasn't had a ton of seasons where he's been the best player, but his consistency at a high level is remarkable and that's what made him the best over longer periods.

 

[daver]

His possession statistics were far above Crosby's in '08-'09. Crosby finished sixth in Hart voting despite not missing many games. There is nothing in statistics or award voting that supports the notion that they were all that close that season and I don't see why the playoffs should make up for the discrepancy in the season just because Crosby played more playoff games and scored more points in the playoffs, especially considering he didn't have a great showing against DET in the SCF that year.

You can go back to '07 or '06 or whatever, but I don't put as much weight in what happened two or three seasons earlier as you seem to. Crosby was the best player in '07 and that's enough to have made him the best player in the League after that season even though he wasn't really close to Thornton in '06. Ovechkin was good enough in '08 that '09 vaulted him ahead of Crosby for me. McDavid was good enough in '17 that '18 put him at the top. MacK was good enough last season that he can get to the top this season.

If Crosby wasn't close to Thornton in '06 how was OV close enough to Crosby in '07 to vault ahead the next year? Crosby outscored him by 30%.

If you don't think playing two back to back Cup finals needs to be considered then I don't know what to tell you. Nice cherrypicking of one series to try to diminish Crosby's playoff resume BTW.

 

[SeanConn]

I think he's been the best player since his sophomore year until up to this/last year when Connor took over. There's no question guys like have Ovechkin, Malkin … etc, have had better years (obviously in the injury years and even in some of the healthy years), but despite that, he still was always the best player in the world to me. If that makes sense.

Kyle Connor is good, but he's not the best!

 

[daver]

Crosby looks better than he actually is using your loose definition.

Why be imprecise?.

Makes for a more interesting discussion for one. The OP could be answered in one post by listing the Hart/Lindsay winners since 2005. This doesn't consider the playoffs or 2-way play, and most importantly, consideration for a player's body of work. It should take more than one year of elite play to get the title, and more than one year to be removed from the top.

 

[bambamcam4ever]

Undoubtedly from the time Bruce Boudreau got fired up until the time Connor McDavid entered the NHL.

Debatably, from 2006-2007 until the end of 2017-2018.

Well when players' need a certain coach to compete for the scoring title, it becomes difficult to argue that they are the best player.

 

[TheTang58]

That is totally false. Sid has seasons of 37 points, 66 points, and 72 points, in addition to not being a top 20 player last season. Sid was nowhere near the top last year. A complete non factor in Hart voting.

22 games = 37 points
41 games = 66 points
53 games = 72 points

I mean, really. Did you expect Crosby to score 82+ points despite playing half seasons?

 

[Pancakes]

Speaking of Crosby, this might be the best he has played in years. He's so dominant right now. Flying a little under the radar due to the Pens overall struggles and the awesome seasons of Mackinnon/Rantanen/Mcdavid etc but Sid is something to watch right now. He's got almost a 10 CF-Rel which is the best he's ever had in his career. His 1.33 PPG is the highest it has been since 2013-14 when he last won the scoring title.

Can he keep it up all year? Who knows. But right now he looks fantastic.

 

[Tad Mikowsky]

Has daver mentioned grace period yet?

 

[iamjs]

2005-2014, then McDavid happened

McDavid didn't get drafted until 2015, and missed half of his rookie season.

 

[Jacob]

Except unlike Crosby, Gordie Howe actually was the best player as evidenced by him having 6 Harts to Crosby's 2.

Bobby Clarke and Bobby Orr have the same amount of Hart Trophies. Are they equal?

 

[Midnight Judges]

22 games = 37 points
41 games = 66 points
53 games = 72 points

I mean, really. Did you expect Crosby to score 82+ points despite playing half seasons?

Of course not.

But those are down years. Those are crappy seasons, especially for ~$9M cap hit. Being injured, as a professional athlete, is not a neutral event. It is a negative event.

Being durable is a virtue in all professional sports.

 

[NextYear67]

List the amount of years or seasons Sidney Crosby been the best player in the NHL.

However many he's been in the league

 

[BM14]

PPG means best hockey player now, huh?

 

[Nathaniel Skywalker]

Seasons?
06-07
12-13
13-14
16-17

Best player in the world? 11-17