How many MAN UTD players leave after this season? - and, what will happen to United

[Duchene2MacKinnon]

Who's your top 5? Depending on who you ask, it's close, but he's just on the outside looking in on the top 5.

In no particular order, I rate De Gea, Alisson, ter Stegen, Handanovic (he gets really underrated), and Neuer (when healthy) over Oblak. Others like Ederson, Lloris, and Leno are up there too. Courtois would be in this grouping too if his form wasn't absolute ass this season.

Ederson/Leno/Lloris do not touch Oblak. Courtois prior to this season was at a similar level. Oblak is a bonafide top 5 keeper.

 

[Evilo]

You watch the last WC and you wonder who a guy like Lloris "doesn't touch".

 

[Duchene2MacKinnon]

You watch the last WC and you wonder who a guy like Lloris "doesn't touch".

Really surprising coming from you. Putting so much weight on a 2 week tournament.

 

[Ajacied]

Also:

 

[robertmac43]

Why can’t he play somewhere else and continue his form?

If you can pawn him off on Spurs and get him to continue playing badly than I'll be fine with the situation.

 

[Evilo]

Really surprising coming from you. Putting so much weight on a 2 week tournament.

Biggest tournament of 4 years.
And it's not as if Lloris didn't have a great career.

 

[Duchene2MacKinnon]

Biggest tournament of 4 years.
And it's not as if Lloris didn't have a great career.

What does a great career have anything to do with right now. Otherwise Nuer is number one.

And 2 week tournament is your words but it’s funny how the narrative changes once the argument is in your favour

 

[Evilo]

Erh
Great career + biggest tournament...

WTF are you even arguing about

 

[YNWA14]

Lloris hasn't exactly been in top form the last 2 seasons for Spurs. Thought I think stuff like 'don't touch' or 'pisses all over' and the like are thrown around a bit too much; the hyperbole is usually just used to show that there's a gap.

I find ranking keepers hard in general.

 

[Evilo]

I'm not even arguing Lloris isn't top 5 anymore. He isn't.
But yeah the "doesn't touch" about a goalie that won the biggest Cup after a breath taking tournament is not only hyperbole, it's borderline Pejorative Slured.
And the 2 weeks thing is also off base since Lloris isn't some kind of unknown player who got hot for 2 weeks. He had a wonderful career, where he was IMO among the top 5, even top 3 goalies for more of it.

 

[Duchene2MacKinnon]

I’m talking about right now how hard is that to follow. Really?

 

[Ceremony]

We have a saying here in Scotland:

Get doon, stay doon, die.

Fingers crossed.

 

[Il Mediano]

Not that I care, but it's kinda funny how this thread devolved into a Lloris debate.

I think it's pretty much accepted that his yearly bundle of major gaffes are what has held him back from being considered amongst the very the best. An honest Spurs fan would tell you the same thing.

He's an elite keeper, but I think it's fair to say Oblak's the better player.

Bringing this back to United, however, I think Man United should go for a young, up-and-coming keeper to pair with Romero should they move on from De Gea. There's plenty of intriguing options out there at clubs that wouldn't be too difficult to purchase from. Getting Oblak would be a nightmare (or ridiculously expensive), and really, United just aren't as good as Atletico right now. Outside of a wage increase, I'm not really seeing the appeal.

That said, whatever they do, just don't pull a Chelsea and make a total mess out of it.

 

[Evilo]

I’m talking about right now how hard is that to follow. Really?

Right now as in what?
Last 2 weeks? He was tremendous against City, saved a penalty and also a great game in the return leg.
Last month? He made a big blunder in a league game.
Last year ? Well it includes the WC as I said.

You're indeed tough to follow. Maybe avoid the far fetched expressions.

 

[Evilo]

Not that I care, but it's kinda funny how this thread devolved into a Lloris debate.

I think it's pretty much accepted that his yearly bundle of major gaffes are what has held him back from being considered amongst the very the best. An honest Spurs fan would tell you the same thing.

He's an elite keeper, but I think it's fair to say Oblak's the better player.

Funny indeed, because the contrary was never said.
I reacted to the "can't touch" comment, which is Pejorative Slured.

 

[Duchene2MacKinnon]

Right now as in what?
Last 2 weeks? He was tremendous against City, saved a penalty and also a great game in the return leg.
Last month? He made a big blunder in a league game.
Last year ? Well it includes the WC as I said.

You're indeed tough to follow. Maybe avoid the far fetched expressions.

I'll make it simple for you, One's a top 5 keeper in the world and one isn't.

 

[Evilo]

And obviously, the guys out of the top 5 "can't touch" the top 5.

Maybe next time try to make it easy for everyone and stop Pejorative Slured expressions.

 

[Duchene2MacKinnon]

And obviously, the guys out of the top 5 "can't touch" the top 5.

Maybe next time try to make it easy for everyone and stop ******ed expressions.

Some can’t some do. Lloris Isn’t one

 

[Evilo]

As the WC showed... Wait...
Oblak can't touch Lloris' level during the WC.
See I can play too.

 

[Stray Wasp]

On the subject of Manchester United, I think this article arising out of Roy Keane's recent criticisms is fantastic.

Ken Early: Football’s new age neutralises philosophies of the past

 

[les Habs]

On the subject of Manchester United, I think this article arising out of Roy Keane's recent criticisms is fantastic.

Ken Early: Football’s new age neutralises philosophies of the past

I think there are some good points there, like actually just clearing the ball rather than trying to play your way out every single time. However the Mourinho at Madrid example is at best lazy. Not that it's anything new, but Madrid got away with murder back then. Mourinho literally came from behind a man and poked him in the eye, just think about that for a second, and was handed a two match ban which was later overturned. I could provide plenty more examples too, like when Pepe stepped on Messi's hand while Messi was down from a challenge and literally argued that Messi's hand shouldn't have been there. Anyway, to say that Mourinho's tactics worked when a perfectly functioning VAR would have meant a different winner is as wrong as it is laughable. Mr Early seems to buy the ridiculous notion that somehow Sheriff Mourinho ran Ike Guardiola out of town despite the fact that Mourinho, with the most expensive squad every assembled at that point, was getting his ass kicked up until that season. Of course that's not to mention that Tito Vilanova came along the next season and ran riot in the league without poking anyone in the eye, yet his civility in the process of a 100 point season somehow doesn't work. Now don't get me wrong, I'm fine with banter when it's appropriate. Calling Mourinho a "little bitch" at a press conference would have been totally acceptable for example. However to think that Guardiola for example is somehow Kevin Keegan when faced with it is nonsense.

 

[YNWA14]

On the subject of Manchester United, I think this article arising out of Roy Keane's recent criticisms is fantastic.

Ken Early: Football’s new age neutralises philosophies of the past

This is a really good article, thanks for sharing.

As athleticism and talent continue to reach more parity with better training, diet, etc. tactical intelligence, quick thinking and understanding of the game become so important. It's been touched on in conversations before but you don't really have one player 'carrying' teams so to speak anymore (Messi is a freak), and it will become less and less common moving forward, I think. A lot of the players that embody this shift are still underrated as well. David Silva to me is an example of an elite player that while highly regarded, still isn't looked at quite as highly as I think he deserves; the things he does on the field aren't just measured on a stat sheet and I think he was one of the main catalysts that turned them into a PL powerhouse. His ability to read the game, his first touch, the way he uses space (and how he operates without space) and the speed of his decision making before and after he gets the ball are so crucial to the modern game.

 

[Stray Wasp]

I think there are some good points there, like actually just clearing the ball rather than trying to play your way out every single time. However the Mourinho at Madrid example is at best lazy. Not that it's anything new, but Madrid got away with murder back then. Mourinho literally came from behind a man and poked him in the eye, just think about that for a second, and was handed a two match ban which was later overturned. I could provide plenty more examples too, like when Pepe stepped on Messi's hand while Messi was down from a challenge and literally argued that Messi's hand shouldn't have been there. Anyway, to say that Mourinho's tactics worked when a perfectly functioning VAR would have meant a different winner is as wrong as it is laughable. Mr Early seems to buy the ridiculous notion that somehow Sheriff Mourinho ran Ike Guardiola out of town despite the fact that Mourinho, with the most expensive squad every assembled at that point, was getting his ass kicked up until that season. Of course that's not to mention that Tito Vilanova came along the next season and ran riot in the league without poking anyone in the eye, yet his civility in the process of a 100 point season somehow doesn't work. Now don't get me wrong, I'm fine with banter when it's appropriate. Calling Mourinho a "little *****" at a press conference would have been totally acceptable for example. However to think that Guardiola for example is somehow Kevin Keegan when faced with it is nonsense.

I should have specified that I was praising the main part of the article. The Mourinho stuff is indeed nonsense - as I've mentioned elsewhere, Real Madrid was manifestly where Mourinho's aura diminished, an experience from which he has never fully recovered.

Alas, I've read worse: an English football magazine once suggested that Alex Ferguson's mind games drove Kenny Dalglish to resign from Liverpool. The sole example of a hostile exchange they quoted between the pair was Dalglish's 'you'd get more sense out of her' line in 1988. Call me eccentric, but I'll stick with the notion that attending four funerals a day in the aftermath of Hillsborough undermined Dalglish's hunger to continue somewhat more.

When it comes to mind games, don't forget that not only was Guardiola not Kevin Keegan, but neither was Kevin Keegan. The narrative that the rant against Ferguson cost Newcastle United the 95-96 title is disproved by the ability to read a calendar correctly and a capacity for basic maths. (Little wonder, then, that said narrative was swallowed whole by so much of the English media).

Funnily enough, I suspect what caused Keegan's shock departure from Newcastle in January 1997 was probably the same thing that caused Guardiola to depart Barca: internal, self-imposed pressure rather than external pressure. But that doesn't excite journalists as much as the idea of gladiatorial mind games.

 

[Ceremony]

Yeah but think of the memes if the internet had been around in the nineties



Was this filmed in a 9 year old boy's bedroom? I never understood the posters on the walls.

 

[Stray Wasp]

Very strange. Maybe Leeds had a PR budget of £3.50 at the time because signing Brolin had emptied the coffers.