How did Minnesota go from 1981 Finals to 1988 last overall?

The Panther

Registered User
Mar 25, 2014
19,198
15,758
Tokyo, Japan
220px-Minnesota_North_Stars_Logo_2.svg.png


Looking at Minnesota's record in 1980-81, it's strange to see (under coach Glen Sonmor) that they were a solid defensive team, and mediocre offensively. Anyway, before the end of the year they called up Dino Ciccarelli, who really delivered with 18 goals in his first 32 NHL games, and then 14 (!) as a rookie in the playoffs. The North Stars, with great playoff runs also by Steve Payne and Bobby Smith, eliminated Boston, Buffalo, and Calgary to make it all the way to the Finals. They lost in five to the mighty Islanders (they managed one win at home, already down 3 to nothing in games), but it was a big season for them and expectations must have been sky-high for 1981-82.

Luckily, the North Stars were in the Norris division where the competition wasn't too tough. They did have quite a strong season in 1981-82, and now with Ciccarelli and Neal Broten on board became more of balanced offense/defense team. They could score. Five players had a point-per-game, including Bobby Smith's career year of 114 points. Craig Hartsburg was a stud on defense (4th in Norris votes). Meloche and Beaupre were in net, and (esp. Meloche) their stats look good. But then the team crashed in round one against Chicago, losing three games to one. I'm not sure why, exactly. The stats show that the scorers scored and the goaltending wasn't bad, but they lost in four (okay, I now see both teams scored 14 goals in the series, but Minny routed Chicago 7-1 in game three, otherwise losing by more modest scores).

Anyway, big things were probably expected for 1982-83, and they had another great season at 96 points, but this was only 2nd in the Norris behind Chicago's big year. I see that Sonmor was relieved of coaching duties midway through the year with a strong 22-12-9 record. Was this related to his drinking episodes? (So I've heard, anyway.) The team had a 36-17-15 record in early March, and must have been toe-to-toe with Chicago, but then went 4-7-1 to finish the regular season. They beat Toronto in the playoffs, but then lost again to their nemesis, Chicago, four games to one.

In summer 1983, the North Stars had the 1st overall pick, and famously chose Brian Lawton (Yzerman and Lafontaine were available). In retrospect, was this a franchise tipping point...?

1983-84, under new coach Bill Mahoney, they dipped to 88 points, but this was good enough for 1st in the weak Norris. The scoring stats and team offence were much more modest this season. Bobby Smith was traded to Montreal early in the season for Keith Acton and Mark Napier. Meloche and Beaupre still in net, but the numbers aren't so good this time. This time, however, the North Stars take down their rival, Chicago -- which must have been sweet --, and then eliminate St.Louis in a relatively tight, 7-game series. Steve Payne scored in overtime of game 7, which put Minny back in the Conference Series. However, they faced Edmonton, and lost in four straight.

The North Stars at this point still had a solid young core, with Broten, Bellows, Ciccarelli, McCarthy, Payne, Acton, Hartsburg, and Dirk Graham all aged 25 or younger.

1984-85, everything went wrong as Sonmor came back mid-season as coach. Brian Bellows led the club with a measly 62 points, as injuries and slumps hit Payne, Ciccarelli, and Hartsburg. Amazingly, this still put them in the playoffs (Norris) where they actually beat out St.Louis, but then lost again to Chicago.

In 1985-86, Lorne Henning became coach and they had a brief comeback to form with an 85-point season (despite a disastrous 6-12-6 start), with Neal Broten having his biggest-ever year (105 points) and Ciccarelli looking good again, too. This is the season Scott Bjugstad had his one and only impressive NHL season with 43 goals, never otherwise scoring more than 11. They easily made the playoffs but were bounced in the first round by St.Louis.

Then the real rot set in. In 1986-87 they briefly had a winning record as late as February 1st, 1987... but then went 7-17-3 to close out the year, missing the playoffs for the first time since 1979. Ciccarelli had 52 goals, but pretty much everybody else disappointed.

They fired Henning and brought in 'Miracle-on-Ice' coach Herb Brooks. The result was a disaster. In 1987-88, the North Stars were dead-last in offence, and second-worst in defence. Unbelievably, they needed only to play better than .325 hockey to beat out Toronto for a Norris playoff spot... and they couldn't do it. In early December, they were a respectable 11-13-4, and would have been comfortably in a playoff spot. Then they went 8-35-9 the rest of the way....! This period's losses included 10-4 to Edmonton, 5-0 to Quebec, 5-0 and 8-1 to Hartford, and 9-1 to St.Louis. Gretzky managed 7 goals and 13 points in three games against them...

Not surprisingly, that was the end of Herb Brooks in Minny, but the upside was they got to draft Modano 1st overall in summer '88.


Anyway, all of this (esp. prior to 1986-87) is stuff I don't remember first-hand, but had to read about online. But I do that Minny had an exciting, promising team that were viewed as up-and-comers circa 1981 to 1984. they seemed to run into a wall in 1983-84, and never really recovered. Was it the Bobby Smith trade? Hartsburg's and Payne's sudden declines? Too radical of a coaching change by bringing in Henning? It's sort of strange to me that with their young and talented line-up they reached such a sad state by 1987 or so, when other teams similarly built in the early-80s (like Edmonton, Philly) were flying still flying high.

What happened?
 

Vanzig

Registered User
Aug 6, 2018
113
46
Vancouver, B.C.
North Stars seemed to always have injuries, I always liked the North Stars and it would have been nice to see them do better but Hartsburg (Top Defenceman) being Injured a lot didn’t help.
He was an Offensive great and killer on the Power-Play.

They go from last to 3 years later making it to the FINALS & Lost in 6 Games but look at that PENGUINS Roster, So much talent it looked like a dam All Star Game Team lol - 8 Hall of Famers (Lemieux, Trottier, Murphy, Coffey, Mullen, Jagr (100% will get in), Francis, Recchi) - Plus All Stars (Barrasso, Stevens) to facing a Team with only 1 HOF (Modano) & a few All Stars (Bellows, Gagner, Broten, Smith, Propp). I was surprised when North Stars took PENS to Game #6. It was a great Cinderella run, BELLOWS had a killer Playoffs with (10-19-29), BOBBY SMITH Led Playoffs in Game Winning Goals (5), BRIAN PROPP played amazing defensively & offensively Scoring (8-15-23), Scored an Overtime Goal & (3) Game Winning Goals. MIKE MODANO played great
(8-12-20) but his inexperience in Post-Season was evident at times (Although he was a RC). Goaltending was the North Stars kiss of death, I knew going into the Finals that JON CASEY was gonna get lit up, He was good but comparing him to other Goalies in the Finals History he was near the bottom. In fact the Lemieux led Penguins faced the Worst Regular Season Team Ever to make the Stanley Cup Finals so that is why I was shocked that it went to 6 Games!!! GREAT Run by North Stars though.
 

brachyrynchos

Registered User
Apr 10, 2017
1,472
998
Looks like alot of different coaches in that span, maybe some players got tired of that carousel? Just a guess of course.
Hindsight is 20/20, but were their trades good trades at the time? I mean, in the best interest of on ice success or were they cost cutting moves?

Per Wiki: despite having the 2 worst records in the league (87-88), North Stars and Toronto were in the playoff race up until the last day of the season. Minnesota lost to Calgary and missed the playoffs but ended up with the 1st pick. Only Detroit had a winning record in the Norris that season, Stars were in a similar position a few years earlier. Teams would have to get through EDM and better teams from the Smythe.
 

Bluesguru

Registered User
Aug 10, 2014
1,957
823
St. Louis
Merging with the Cleveland Barons really gave the North Stars a boost heading into the 80's.

Great team, but couldn't get over the hump. Hawks really seemed to have their number in the post-season. And the Blues and North Stars had some great clashes too. I really do miss the North Stars, wish Minnesota had kept that name and uniforms.

Actually 1985-86 might of been their best shot but the Blues took them down in a great series. After getting pushed around by Minny the previous season by Willi Plett & Co., the Blues beefed up their team big time the following season and wore Minnesota down in the deciding Gm 5.

But the reason I say 85-86 might of been the North Stars year is because it was the Calgary Flames, and not the Edmonton Oilers in the Conference Finals that year. Blues came close to beating Flames in a hard fought 7 game series. But Minnesota would of had a great shot themselves at beating Calgary that year. Minnesota was 2-0-1 against Flames during regular season that year. Cup was wide open that year when Edmonton got knocked out of the picture.
 

streitz

Registered User
Jul 22, 2018
1,258
319
What was the story with this? Why did Smith want to be traded from Minny so badly? He was doing well, and they had just had two great seasons in a row...



I actually have no idea and I've always wondered that myself. I just remember reading a newspaper article about hoe he told their GM he'd use the money he had made and would go back to school if they didn't trade him.


Either way they didn't get a great return on their franchise #1 center and it hurt them in the coming years for sure.
 

GlitchMarner

Typical malevolent, devious & vile Maple Leafs fan
Jul 21, 2017
9,841
6,555
Brampton, ON
A lot can happen to a team in seven years or fewer. The Lightning went from being garbage in 1998 to being SC Champions in 2004, the Penguins went from an absolute joke in 2004 to being SC Champions in 2009, the Capitals went from being terrible in 2004 to being the President's Trophy winners in 2010, the Leafs went from being last overall in 2016 to being a 105 point in 2018 etc.
 

The Panther

Registered User
Mar 25, 2014
19,198
15,758
Tokyo, Japan
My quick Googling found this from the Star Tribune (relating to a North Stars' old-timers' game a couple of years ago):

In a move fitting the Minnesota sports scene circa 2000s, Smith forced his way out of town a year and a half later.
A coaching change brought Bill Mahoney's defensive system, and Smith fell out of favor. He was demoted to the fourth line and saw his ice time cut.
Nanne tried to wait things out. Smith requested a trade again that October, threatening to quit and enroll in college if he didn't get his wish.
Nanne asked him to wait until December to see if things changed.

"He said the only thing that's going to change between now and December is I'm going to come in with galoshes on and say I want to be traded," Nanne said.
Nanne finally traded Smith to Montreal. Fans and media were furious with Nanne and Mahoney.


North Stars alum Bobby Smith is still a fan favorite in Minnesota
 

The Panther

Registered User
Mar 25, 2014
19,198
15,758
Tokyo, Japan
A lot can happen to a team in seven years or fewer. The Lightning went from being garbage in 1998 to being SC Champions in 2004, the Penguins went from an absolute joke in 2004 to being SC Champions in 2009, the Capitals went from being terrible in 2004 to being the President's Trophy winners in 2010, the Leafs went from being last overall in 2016 to being a 105 point in 2018 etc.
Yes, of course. But I thought Minnesota's situation was a little more unusual than that. Going into 1983-84, for example, if you'd polled NHL GMs and fans on which teams had the brightest future, I suspect the winners would have been (1) Edmonton and (2) Minnesota. Yet by 1987-ish Minny was the worst team in hockey.
 

MS

1%er
Mar 18, 2002
53,561
83,925
Vancouver, BC
1) Bobby Smith trade.

2) Injuries destroying the potential HHOF career of the tremendously underrated Craig Hartsburg, who played ~50 games past age 27 and only 2 full seasons past age 23. Likewise Steve Payne and Tom McCarthy had their careers ruined by injury and were done by 30.

3) the blown opportunity of the Brian Lawton pick.

The two best players on those early '80s North Star teams (by a mile) were Smith and Hartsburg, and by 1987 they had nothing to show for Smith (who was still a star at age 29) and Hartsburg was permanently injured. Hard to recover from that.
 

Iron Mike Sharpe

Registered User
Dec 6, 2017
947
1,120
In a move fitting the Minnesota sports scene circa 2000s, Smith forced his way out of town a year and a half later.
A coaching change brought Bill Mahoney's defensive system, and Smith fell out of favor. He was demoted to the fourth line and saw his ice time cut.

Ironically, Smith would end up in Jacques Lemaire's defensive system & see his offensive production fall off.
 

Iron Mike Sharpe

Registered User
Dec 6, 2017
947
1,120
1) Bobby Smith trade.

2) Injuries destroying the potential HHOF career of the tremendously underrated Craig Hartsburg, who played ~50 games past age 27 and only 2 full seasons past age 23. Likewise Steve Payne and Tom McCarthy had their careers ruined by injury and were done by 30.

3) the blown opportunity of the Brian Lawton pick.

The two best players on those early '80s North Star teams (by a mile) were Smith and Hartsburg, and by 1987 they had nothing to show for Smith (who was still a star at age 29) and Hartsburg was permanently injured. Hard to recover from that.

Yeah, Hartsburg was a big "what if," I think he was a step above contemporaries like Doug Wilson, Dave Babych, Randy Carlyle in the talent department... not quite Denis Potvin or Ray Bourque level, but he was an elite guy. With Hartsburg & Smith the North Stars basically had two big franchise cornerstone pieces. The Tom McCarthy-Neal Broten-Dino Ciccarelli line that Sonmor put together when he called up Ciccarelli turned out to be one of the most exciting lines to watch in the league. With Payne-Smith-Young/Bellows/etc. the North Stars had a strong 1a-1b forward line punch. The core D behind Hartsburg - Gordie Roberts, Curt Giles, Brad Maxwell - were as strong as any in the league, & Don Beaupre emerged as a decent starter. Smith gone, Hartsburg out - even with Payne & McCarthy out, & Lawton as a bust, too, you'd think that group of Broten, Ciccarelli, Beaupre, Roberts, Maxwell - with Bellows emerging to be a key player - plus the solid veterans they brought in like Dennis Maruk, Kent Nilsson, Keith Acton, Willi Plett - they should've done a lot better than they did. I remember always expecting more from that group.
 

streitz

Registered User
Jul 22, 2018
1,258
319
Ironically, Smith would end up in Jacques Lemaire's defensive system & see his offensive production fall off.



The article mentioned he was upset with his ice time on the 4th line, which is strange to me because Smith was always good defensively.


Either way in Lemaires defensive system and Peron/Burns Smith was always on the 1st or 2nd line with plenty of ice time.
 

a79krgm

Registered User
Jul 15, 2006
1,545
372
White Bear Lake
www.northstarshockey.com
Some relevant threads:

Question for those who actually watched the team, what would you describe their team style as being?

Some of my random thoughts …

At first they tried to be a fast skating team like the Oilers, but they got their butt kicked in the '84 semi finals trying to out skate them. New plan?

… Nanne had some kind of fear complex that led him to believe the team was always being pushed around. In came a steady flow of big slow tough guys like Jack Carlson, Dave Richer, Willie Plett, Paul Holmgren, Ed Hospodar, Larry Depalma. With the exception of Willi, they were a drag on the team.

… Fans once thought that Lou's secret trip to Czechoslovakia to bring back Fran Musil would turn the team's fortunes around. The next Borje Salming perhaps? Not!

… Glen Sonmor had a way of getting the team's emotions up for the playoffs, but overall they didn't play consistent enough for him.
 

Ad

Upcoming events

Ad

Ad