Proposal: How Boston Retools and Stays A Contender

[Merrrlin]

Ya I think I will wait until UFA season is over before doing our 2nd installment.

 

[Horton Hears A Woo]

I think you're ignoring the inclusion of Brady Tkachuk here. He himself was a #4 pick, who's still holds that kind of value.

Im not ignoring that at all it’s just not relevant. BT while young and good is nowhere near pasta and will probably never have a ceiling like him let alone a chance on a prospect that is never a guaranteed while also moving another young lw in JD is just plain crazy.

 

[blankall]

Im not ignoring that at all it’s just not relevant. BT while young and good is nowhere near pasta and will probably never have a ceiling like him let alone a chance on a prospect that is never a guaranteed while also moving another young lw in JD is just plain crazy.

Great....but the trade is for BT and the #3 overall. That's a huge package. Boston fans keep valuing each asset individually and comparing it to Pastrnak. While agreed that either asset isn't worth Pastrnak, the combination of both BT and the #3 overall is worth more than BT, and Debrusk is of a lower asset class that does not close that gap.

 

[Horton Hears A Woo]

Great....but the trade is for BT and the #3 overall. That's a huge package. Boston fans keep valuing each asset individually and comparing it to Pastrnak. While agreed that either asset isn't worth Pastrnak, the combination of both BT and the #3 overall is worth more than BT, and Debrusk is of a lower asset class that does not close that gap.

I’m sitting here and telling you it’s not worth more than DP and JD how is that hard to understand? The bruins could
Surely do better. Your
Overvaluing the 3rd overall greatly

 

[KillerMillerTime]

That's not what it means. That's what people who make bad offers say that it means.

What it actually means is both teams hate it without any value judgment attached.

I have huge questions for those who say Boston wins by trading an established superstar who is making probably 40% less than his play would imply who is 24.

What do you mean no value judgement? Its precisely because both sides feel they are getting hosed (i.e. no value). Come on man you can't be serious, they can't both be right.

The other side gets all the vulue to them which is rediculous in this case.

 

[Horton Hears A Woo]

What do you mean no value judgement? Its precisely because both sides feel they are getting hosed (i.e. no value). Come on man you can't be serious, they can't both be right.

The other side gets all the vulue to them which is rediculous in this case.

Are you claiming that the bruins get all the value in this trade? Because that is nuts the 3rd overall and BT is not worth Pasta and Debrusk.

 

[doomscroll]

More....like a recent 4th overall pick who's transitioned well to the NHL in Brady Tkachuk? The trade isn't just for the 3rd overall. It also includes Tkachuk, who himself is a huge asset.

I mentioned that in my original post about Pastrnak and the 3rd overall, but everyone just assumed I was saying Pasta was not worth the 3rd pick.

 

[nbwingsfan]

I disagree.

3OA is worth more because of3 yrs ELC so the ROZi would be greater because it’s a $1M vs $6Zm salary.

You don't really have any idea what you're talking about then.

There's a good chance that whoever is picked at #3 doesn't even play in the NHL next season... Let alone come anywhere close to the ~50G/100pts Pastrnak will put up.

 

[Lil Sebastian Cossa]

What do you mean no value judgement? Its precisely because both sides feel they are getting hosed (i.e. no value). Come on man you can't be serious, they can't both be right.

The other side gets all the vulue to them which is rediculous in this case.

Boston doesn't want to do this because they don't want to trade the best player on their roster with the best contract on their roster for anything but a better player on an equivalent type contract. Why on Earth would you deal Pastrnak as Boston for a chance at getting Pastrnak?

Ottawa doesn't want to deal two pieces of its future who are very good for one winger, no matter how good he is.
Teams not wanting to trade their guys has nothing to do with the value going either way. Teams overvalue their own asset and undervalue what they're trying to acquire. The point of this trade is that both teams get a good amount of value... but the value they get runs counter to what they want or need, so they feel like they're being hosed.

Boston doesn't need to deal a 24 year old elite player so they can push back their window slightly. If they were looking to deal for futures and the continuity of their roster, they'd be trading basically anyone on their roster not named Pastrnak or McAvoy.

Ottawa has a bunch of young pieces that aren't ready to make the jump to contenders yet. So they've got no need to deal Tkachuk and another potentially skilled young asset for a guy who is going to be too rich for them in two years.

That is why fans of both teams feel like they are being hosed. It's not because it is fair value.

 

[BigBadBruins7708]

yes, you totally start a retool by trading a 23yr old Rocket winner who has 4 full seasons age 20-23 of:

34-36-70 in 75 (0.93 ppg)
35-45-80 in 82 (0.98 ppg)
38-43-81 in 66 (1.23 ppg)
48-47-95 in 70 (1.36 ppg)

Christ, that 1st transaction was dumb enough to negate any word you typed after it

 

[Djp]

You don't really have any idea what you're talking about then.

There's a good chance that whoever is picked at #3 doesn't even play in the NHL next season... Let alone come anywhere close to the ~50G/100pts Pastrnak will put up.

If he doesn’t next year, he will the following year.

His cap hit is $6.67M. Say he scores 90 pts. How many pts does a player need to ear ehrn making $1M to be an equivalent ROI? 14 pts is the same $/pt value when comparing the salaries.

 

[KillerMillerTime]

yes, you totally start a retool by trading a 23yr old Rocket winner who has 4 full seasons age 20-23 of:

34-36-70 in 75 (0.93 ppg)
35-45-80 in 82 (0.98 ppg)
38-43-81 in 66 (1.23 ppg)
48-47-95 in 70 (1.36 ppg)

Christ, that 1st transaction was dumb enough to negate any word you typed after it

Try reading some of my responses, its clear what my intent is. You can't evaluate one trade and try to pick it
apart.

It's an effort to keep Boston an elite contender by
adding AP, Hall and Cirelli AND begin a transition
to keeping them a winning team with really good young talent. Here are the players taken #3 since 2014.

2014 - Draisaitl
2015 - Strome
2016 - Dubois
2017 - Heiskanen
2018 - Kotkaniemi
2019 - Dach

Byfield and Strutzle are high end players and Tkachuk
is an upgrade over DeBrusk.

A poster made a good point. Whats Pastrnak's production going to look like in 3 years when
Bergeron is probably done and Marchand is 35?

Here would be Boston's young talent group (23 & under) after it is all said and done.

D - McAvoy, Lauzon, Vaak

C - Cirelli, Byfield(Struetzle), Beecher, Frederick

RW - Studnicka

LW - Tkachuk

 

[BlackFrancis]

If he doesn’t next year, he will the following year.

His cap hit is $6.67M. Say he scores 90 pts. How many pts does a player need to ear ehrn making $1M to be an equivalent ROI? 14 pts is the same $/pt value when comparing the salaries.

Never heard of ELC bonuses, then?

 

[KillerMillerTime]

You don't really have any idea what you're talking about then.

There's a good chance that whoever is picked at #3 doesn't even play in the NHL next season... Let alone come anywhere close to the ~50G/100pts Pastrnak will put up.

That's why I have them signing Hall. To help mitigate
Pastrnak's void, come on man, read what I proposed.

Boston isn't beating TB next year w/o the addition
of Hall AND AP. The proposals by Bruin fans is strictly
re-arranging deck chairs on The Titanic. Hall alone isn't
closing the gap. AP alone IMO will close it more than just Hall.

 

[KillerMillerTime]

yes, you totally start a retool by trading a 23yr old Rocket winner who has 4 full seasons age 20-23 of:

34-36-70 in 75 (0.93 ppg)
35-45-80 in 82 (0.98 ppg)
38-43-81 in 66 (1.23 ppg)
48-47-95 in 70 (1.36 ppg)

Christ, that 1st transaction was dumb enough to negate any word you typed after it

Why do you think I have them signing Hall? Come on
man how about you read what I proposed instead
of throwing insults around?

 

[Horton Hears A Woo]

Why do you think I have them signing Hall? Come on
man how about you read what I proposed instead
of throwing insults around?

It doesn’t matter who they sign. Pasta isn’t going anywhere period. And your taking abo so called point production going down after he loses 37 and 67 but who’s to say he can’t do it without them? Pasta is elite at play making and scoring and the bruins down grab by moving pasta and JD for a pick that is all chance and BT

 

[kk87]

Yeah sorry DeBrusk+Pastrnak doesn't return Tkachuk+#3 pick Pastrnak is good but come on that's insane.

Wait... what? I loathe Boston and even I can admit this would be a fleecing for Ottawa. Pastrnak's already a top 5 winger in the league and far more valuable than any of the other pieces

 

[Hookslide]

I am confused ,the 3rd pick might turn out to be a superstar but many third picks have been busts so why you trade a a 23 year old 40 to 50 goal scorer.? Why are the Bruins "retooling" is another question I ask . Yes they have some older players that are core, but they also have some young very talented players. Maybe instead of using the term "retooling " why don't we try "tweaking" this roster.......just a thought

 

[nbwingsfan]

That's why I have them signing Hall. To help mitigate
Pastrnak's void, come on man, read what I proposed.

Boston isn't beating TB next year w/o the addition
of Hall AND AP. The proposals by Bruin fans is strictly
re-arranging deck chairs on The Titanic. Hall alone isn't
closing the gap. AP alone IMO will close it more than just Hall.

I read what you proposed it just wasn't any good.

I can guarantee the secret to beating Tampa definitely isn't trading away your best player on your best contracts who's only 24 while signing a much older, worse and injury prone player for even more money...

 

[Fig]

Wait... what? I loathe Boston and even I can admit this would be a fleecing for Ottawa. Pastrnak's already a top 5 winger in the league and far more valuable than any of the other pieces

This still doesn't make sense for Ottawa though. Brady is a former 4th OA pick and there's a 3rd OA added in. Pasta is a great winger, no doubt, but he also has a supporting cast in Boston. What the heck is Ottawa going to with Pasta and DeBrusk with a roster that's basically Colin White, Connor Brown, JGP, Tierny and Anthony Duclair without BT? That's basically getting an F1 engine to install into a rusty pickup truck. The engine is probably going to run great, but it's everything else that's going to fall apart.

Pasta and DeBrusk together are a great pair of talent to add to most teams, but a team like Ottawa wouldn't be able to properly utilize that package at all IMO. Boston is better off trying to talk to a team like Buffalo or Edmonton which are teams looking to add wingers to complement their talented forward core.

Trading Pasta/Debrusk for BT and 3OA punches a bigger hole than you're filling in a retool situation. Value aside, it's much more a rebuild type trade than retool.

 

[PatriceBergeronFan]

Yeah sorry DeBrusk+Pastrnak doesn't return Tkachuk+#3 pick Pastrnak is good but come on that's insane.

Boston definitely would not make this trade.

 

[Fatass]

If the B’s were rebuilding, I could see them making this deal. But not if the purpose is retooling. Retooling is keeping Pasta, and using him and McAvoy as cornerstones.

 

[Ledge And Dairy]

No on agrees with you on this. What if Byfield doesn't end up being good? What if Tkachuk never breaks out and is just a good 2nd line player?

Imagine trading a young 100pt player on one of the best contracts in the world for a couple 40-50pt players

Oh were playing that game, you forgot the most likely "what if" of all. What if Pastrnak decides to walk in 3 years because he wants to win a cup and Ottawa is still rebuilding?

 

[BergyWho37]

This thread has took a left turn down a one way road ...

Don’t worry Ottawa your not getting Pasta and just a heads up just coz a player is draft 4th overall doesn’t mean he’s better then someone that’s drafted 25th

 

[nbwingsfan]

Oh were playing that game, you forgot the most likely "what if" of all. What if Pastrnak decides to walk in 3 years because he wants to win a cup and Ottawa is still rebuilding?

Then you trade him for a metric shit ton.