Trade: [HOU/TOR] Roberto Osuna for Ken Giles, David Paulino, and Hector Perez

[Marcobruin]

Yes, Shatkins has been an utter disaster. I firmly believe the Blue Jays would still be a playoff team had Rogers not made the stupid decision to hire Shapiro. Or if they had been able to get Duquette / Williams.

Always was fond of Duquette ..Hé is indeed a good baseball man

 

[Marcobruin]

Anthopolous mortgaged the future for a monster two-year run that ultimately fell short, even if it was a hell of a ride.

Shapiro and Atkins were brought in to try and restructure while remaining competitive, which they have so far been unable to do.

I'm honestly not sure if the Jays are any further ahead than they are now, had AA stuck around for a few more years. Perhaps he would've pulled the trigger on trading Donaldson in the offseason, which is where I feel Shapiro/Atkins made their biggest mistake thus far in keeping him around. That could've come from higher up though, Rogers being worried about ticket sales so they ordered management to keep the star attraction. What a disaster there, though.

The disaster as I've mentioned few times was clear at season's start. This team is plain bad and it was so evident(good way to thank fans for. Drawing over 3m last season)
I'll take Anthopolous anytime over these 2 clowns.. Of course trading Syndergaard hurts but give Alex credit he wanted to win and they did reach the playoffs which is more then these 2 lost cases will ever do.
The Donaldson trade was a steal.Barreto hasnt done anything yet. I felt the Norris trade would also hurt but he too hasn't done much. Alex while in Toronto did a wonderful job with the draft and minors.
The biggest loss is Syndergaard after that
Really no loss at all and Noah is constantly injured.
Toronto were in way better shape with Alex then Shapiro and Atkins. No playoffs in Toronto anytime soon

 

[PBandJ]

Anthopolous jumped ship once his gambits failed and he realized he had nothing let to build with. Good riddance to him.

I like this trade. Get a clubhouse distraction out of there and get some pieces to work with.

 

[Reality Check]

Toronto should be happy they got anything for this scumbag.

Verlander didn't look quite pleased to say the least after learning about this trade.

 

[TheMoreYouKnow]

There's no character test required to play pro sports. If you believe otherwise, you're either naive or a grandstanding journalist.

 

[le_sean]

There's no character test required to play pro sports. If you believe otherwise, you're either naive or a grandstanding journalist.

There’s a level of dignity I expect from an organization I’m throwing money at.

 

[TheMoreYouKnow]

There’s a level of dignity I expect from an organization I’m throwing money at.

I remember the Vick story, and I also remember that the media about 3 games into his stint with the Eagles decided to forget it ever happened and treated it like a great comeback story.

I remember when Ricky Manning and Maurice Drew (along with another teammate) beat up a kid - who they didn't know at all - pretty badly in a Starbucks for no good reason. And when Manning played his first game after that, the sideline reporter talked to him about how much it meant to come back after that adversity. Note that Manning inflicting serious bodily harm to a stranger was seen by the TV folks as adversity for Manning.

Those things stuck to me. Nobody in sports cares about this stuff. It's all neatly compartmentalized. They cover up for the rapists, the wife beaters, the drunk drivers, the drug dealers etc. If you can play, you'll get a pat on the back.

That's what makes that Twitter controversy so absurd. You've got these guys put in a corner as bad guys for dumb stuff they said as HS kids when actual violent criminals get 'second chances' left and right.

 

[Say Hey Kid]

There’s a level of dignity I expect from an organization I’m throwing money at.

Agreed. Chemistry is a delicate thing. It's impossible to prove this, but with Sale hurt, this could cost them the WS.

 

[Dr Pepper]

Might as well use this thread to update on Osuna's legal troubles.

Roberto Osuna's lawyer says his client will plead not guilty | The Guardian

His court date was delayed AGAIN, for I think the third time. Pushed back another month.

Looks like Houston's destined to go into the playoffs with this dark cloud looming overhead, since Osuna's lawyers don't seem interested in this court case ever actually taking place.

 

[GIN ANTONIC]

The more I think of it the more I'm fine with this trade as a Jays fan. Someone else's headache now. Maybe Giles can be fixed and we'll see if anything comes from the other pieces but pitching depth was needed.

 

[Bjorn Le]

Osuna with a great debut and the narrative is already starting to change. No one will be talking about this case by next spring training, and the Jays traded a generational closer for scraps.

 

[Dr Pepper]

Osuna with a great debut and the narrative is already starting to change. No one will be talking about this case by next spring training, and the Jays traded a generational closer for scraps.

Let's pump the brakes on that kind of rhetoric.

Yes, Osuna had a meteoric rise, fastest closer to ever hit 100 saves if I recall correctly.

Good for him.

But basically calling him the next Mariano Rivera is a bit much, wouldn't you say?

Also, the Jays' hands were tied on this one. Osuna's lawyer is dragging this out for as long as he possibly can, and we can only hope that Osuna is actually innocent of the charges against him. The optics remain terrible, exponentially so if more damning information comes out. They couldn't let him pitch in Toronto again, the blowback would be immense.

Imagine if Mitch Marner had a rape charge pending against him and the league/Leafs still allowed him to suit up for a regular season game. I get that this basically happened with Patrick Kane already and he got through it, but it's not a great look. I don't blame the Jays one bit for moving on from Osuna. The team is forever bigger than the player.

 

[Bjorn Le]

Let's pump the brakes on that kind of rhetoric.

Yes, Osuna had a meteoric rise, fastest closer to ever hit 100 saves if I recall correctly.

Good for him.

But basically calling him the next Mariano Rivera is a bit much, wouldn't you say?

Also, the Jays' hands were tied on this one. Osuna's lawyer is dragging this out for as long as he possibly can, and we can only hope that Osuna is actually innocent of the charges against him. The optics remain terrible, exponentially so if more damning information comes out. They couldn't let him pitch in Toronto again, the blowback would be immense.

Imagine if Mitch Marner had a rape charge pending against him and the league/Leafs still allowed him to suit up for a regular season game. I get that this basically happened with Patrick Kane already and he got through it, but it's not a great look. I don't blame the Jays one bit for moving on from Osuna. The team is forever bigger than the player.

If anyone has a chance of breaking Mo's save record, it's Osuna. What he's done in his career so far suggests he's a tier above the other elite closers. Don't know what that would be if it isn't generational.

I don't know if the Jays hands were actually tied. The league suspended him for 75 games, they didn't kick him out of the league. We don't know the outcome of the court case yet either, so it's hard to jump to conclusions. The Jays could have at least waited, either held him out pending the court case or brought him back, like they said as recently as a few weeks before he was traded they would do.

Perhaps because Rogers is a publicly traded company ownership wanted them to move on, but history shows us in sports that people have a short memory regarding these incidents. Bobby Hull still does events even though he's a known wife-beater. Aroldis Chapman and Jose Reyes are both back in the league despite similar incidents.

 

[Dr Pepper]

Meh, the way I see it the Jays are in rough enough shape as it is with regards to the on-field product and ensuing ticket sales. Fielding an alleged domestic abuser was obviously something Rogers wasn't keen on doing. Maybe they forced Shapiro's hand when he wanted to keep Osuna around, who knows.

What's done is done, I'm looking forward to the fallout and HOPEFULLY some upcoming closure on this much-delayed court case. If, in the meantime, Osuna helps the Astros get another ring, hey, kudos to him and his new stacked team.

 

[Bjorn Le]

Meh, the way I see it the Jays are in rough enough shape as it is with regards to the on-field product and ensuing ticket sales. Fielding an alleged domestic abuser was obviously something Rogers wasn't keen on doing. Maybe they forced Shapiro's hand when he wanted to keep Osuna around, who knows.

What's done is done, I'm looking forward to the fallout and HOPEFULLY some upcoming closure on this much-delayed court case. If, in the meantime, Osuna helps the Astros get another ring, hey, kudos to him and his new stacked team.

What were they going to do if there were no biters though? Release him? Teams were interested, just not if they had to be the first to bear the attention. The Jays were in the best place to do that but what’s done is done.

 

[Filthy Dangles]

Jays are owned by Rogers and their brand name is pervasive through the organization so it's easy to see why he'd never play for BJs again. Astros don't have the same financial steak as Rogers. They are trying to repeat as WS champs.

 

[chaosrevolver]

Osuna with a great debut and the narrative is already starting to change. No one will be talking about this case by next spring training, and the Jays traded a generational closer for scraps.

If he is actually guilty, people will still be talking about this case imo.

 

[Bjorn Le]

If he is actually guilty, people will still be talking about this case imo.

Maybe, it’s rare that athletes who face these charges are actually convicted. But he has to get convicted first.

 

[qmjhlisles]

The fans saying the Jays gave Osuna away for scraps.. Giles is every bit as good of a closer as Osuna. Osuna shouldn’t even have a place in this league

 

[Quid Pro Clowe]

Lol. No one has ever called Giles crap. He's pitched like crap this year, but he isn't garbage. He had a few elite seasons prior. He was traded due to his relationship with AJ Hinch.

 

[King Mapes]

The fans saying the Jays gave Osuna away for scraps.. Giles is every bit as good of a closer as Osuna. Osuna shouldn’t even have a place in this league

No he isn't and there's like a 5 year age gap.

No place on the league? He's one of the best young relievers...

 

[MMC]

The fans saying the Jays gave Osuna away for scraps.. Giles is every bit as good of a closer as Osuna. Osuna shouldn’t even have a place in this league

No way

 

[bluesfan94]

Looks like Houston's destined to go into the playoffs with this dark cloud looming overhead, since Osuna's lawyers don't seem interested in this court case ever actually taking place.

Or this is just the normal way the law works.

 

[Quid Pro Clowe]

No he isn't and there's like a 5 year age gap.

No place on the league? He's one of the best young relievers...

I suspect he means from a morality standpoint.

 

[Cassano]

Lol. No one has ever called Giles crap. He's pitched like crap this year, but he isn't garbage. He had a few elite seasons prior. He was traded due to his relationship with AJ Hinch.

Nah I called him crap throughout the season. He sucks and is a mental midget.