Holland Finally Admits Wings are Rebuilding

newfy

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If you've been listening for the last year I'm sure you could find plenty of interviews that share this same notion. Holland has said plenty theyre going younger and made moves at the deadline that reflected that.
 
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A Few Good Males

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If you've been listening for the last year I'm sure you could find plenty of interviews that share this same notion. Holland has said plenty theyre going younger and made moves at the deadline that reflected that.
I've probably listened to every word he's spoken publicly in the last year and do not recall him saying the words "we are rebuilding." Quite the opposite actually, earlier this summer he said he wants to put a competitive team on the ice, a sentiment actualized by Vanek and Green singings. He's said "going younger" a few times, sure, but admitting to rebuilding signals (to me, at least) that they are not focused on contending this year and instead primarily intent on procuring high-end future assets.
 
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Henkka

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If you've been listening for the last year I'm sure you could find plenty of interviews that share this same notion. Holland has said plenty theyre going younger and made moves at the deadline that reflected that.

Yep. It has been going on a while.

Last season-ending press conference was imo the first one.
 

Henkka

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I've probably listened to every word he's spoken publicly in the last year and do not recall him saying the words "we are rebuilding." Quite the opposite actually, earlier this summer he said he wants to put a competitive team on the ice, a sentiment actualized by Vanek and Green singings. He's said "going younger" a few times, sure, but admitting to rebuilding signals (to me, at least) that they are not focused on contending this year and instead primarily intent on procuring high-end future assets.

Signing veterans are part of the rebuild. They are mentors for kids to maximize the kids development, so the rebuild will be as succesful as possible. Looks like that message isn't going through.

Also he has talked about playing meaningful games. That also isn't an act against a rebuild. Those things will work together and they want to avoid scortched earth rebuild, because Holland thinks and has said many times, that it doesn't work.

How hard is that to understand?

People seem to think that you have to be hard left or hard right for one direction, and no compromise between that is not an option. Too much fundamentalism in here.
 
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A Few Good Males

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Signing veterans are part of the rebuild. They are mentors for kids to maximize the kids development, so the rebuild will be as succesful as possible. Looks like that message isn't going through.

Also he has talked about playing meaningful games. That also isn't also an act against a rebuild. Those things will work together and they want to avoid scortched earth rebuild, because Holland thinks and has said many times, that it doesn't work.

How hard is that to understand?

People seem to think that you have to be hard left or hard right for one direction, and no compromise between that is not an option. Too much fundamentalism in here.
My point is that the guy has avoided saying the Red Wings are rebuilding. He always uses half-ass terms like re-tooling, which insinuates the core we have is good enough to compete, if we acquired better secondary players. That clearly is not the case.

I understand having veterans to teach young guys is critically important and fully support the notion of maintaining a strong culture through the down years. I have no problem with that, although it is contradictory of "going young."

All I'm saying is that it is satisfying to hear the GM fully admit we are rebuilding after we finished with the 5th worst record in the league, that is all. Because for the Wings to become a legitimate contender again, my opinion is we need one or two more top-ten draft talents. I guess I struggle to see how this is a fundamentalist stance.
 

Henkka

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My point is that the guy has avoided saying the Red Wings are rebuilding. He always uses half-ass terms like re-tooling, which insinuates the core we have is good enough to compete, if we acquired better secondary players. That clearly is not the case.

That is just not true.

Ken Holland: Detroit Red Wings determined to rebuild with youth

Red Wings' Ken Holland discusses Jeff Blashill's future
"Obviously very disappointing season," general manager Ken Holland said. "The theme going forward is the future, it's rebuild, it's young kids. But young kids put into the lineup when they are ready to play at this level. I believe that you need to have some veterans on the club that are good role models. We've got those."

This was on April.

Maybe that video is fake and somebody else put those words on his mouth.
 

The Zetterberg Era

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The Zetterberg Era

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he's been using the word "rebuild" in some capacity since 2013 or so with his rebuild on the fly crap. He wasn't willing to make the moves actually necessary for that to have any real shot at happening. We've yet to see if he can follow through on this.

We have drafted more players than any team in the NHL over the last two years. We have kids competing for jobs straight out of camp and it would seem both Zadina and Rasmussen are going to see some time, Ras should be up all year. Our best player is now our young future captain. Holland has to come up with a plan with the defense and I know why people are concerned there. But he has been committed to a rebuild for the last couple years at least in terms of his actions. So much so I am confused why people are making attempts at that isn't what he is up to. He is trading for future assets and collecting a lot of them.

We are going to be really bad this year in my opinion. I think they all know it, they aren't going to put it that way. But, I doubt seriously guys like Devellano and Holland actually think this is going to be super competitive. Again the message even on a Vanek and Green are that they help the young kids score and gain confidence in the league. We will see, but he has followed through on a pretty big rebuild the last couple years and seems committed to it. Only thing I think would stop it immediately is a top 5 pick and Karlsson coming in Free Agency.
 

Steve Yzerlland

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Liked the interview hopefully we can move some of these contracts at the deadline once we know we are out of the playoffs
 

Tirekicker

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We have drafted more players than any team in the NHL over the last two years. We have kids competing for jobs straight out of camp and it would seem both Zadina and Rasmussen are going to see some time, Ras should be up all year. Our best player is now our young future captain. Holland has to come up with a plan with the defense and I know why people are concerned there. But he has been committed to a rebuild for the last couple years at least in terms of his actions. So much so I am confused why people are making attempts at that isn't what he is up to. He is trading for future assets and collecting a lot of them.

We are going to be really bad this year in my opinion. I think they all know it, they aren't going to put it that way. But, I doubt seriously guys like Devellano and Holland actually think this is going to be super competitive. Again the message even on a Vanek and Green are that they help the young kids score and gain confidence in the league. We will see, but he has followed through on a pretty big rebuild the last couple years and seems committed to it. Only thing I think would stop it immediately is a top 5 pick and Karlsson coming in Free Agency.

Well said. The Wings have been in rebuild mode since the 2016 trade deadline.
 
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I mean, what is location, really
We have drafted more players than any team in the NHL over the last two years.
Let's not make this into some kind of accolade. A disproportionate number of those players are late rounders with little chance of making it. I'd agree with this if those picks had come in the first three rounds or so.

And also perhaps if we hadn't used so many on low skill players...
 

The Zetterberg Era

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Let's not make this into some kind of accolade. A disproportionate number of those players are late rounders with little chance of making it. I'd agree with this if those picks had come in the first three rounds or so.

And also perhaps if we hadn't used so many on low skill players...

15 of those happened in the first 100 picks of each draft. I would guess Montreal's 12 might be next closest but I would have to dig into each team.

Lindstrom and Kotkansalo might not be the flashiest prospects but they are good players. They have talent to now be consistently rated by outside sources as a top 10 farm system. So really I disagree with your entire post.
 
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BinCookin

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"we're going younger, we're gonna rebuild this team"

-signs Thomas Vanek
-signs Mike Green

With all due respect... this is idiotic.

You (and some others) want this Prospect Team game playing in the NHL full time?... having all their confidence destroyed? You will destroy your prospects this way. Imagine putting Berrgren in the NHL on the 2nd line right now playing 16 min a night...

He will be injured or mentally destroyed in 2 months.

I'm sorry but SOMEONE has to actually teach Cholowski/Hronek some stuff. And yes, a less skilled player CAN teach them something...

Some of you are extremists... and more so... your comments do not have a lot of thought behind them.
 

jkutswings

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With all due respect... this is idiotic.

You (and some others) want this Prospect Team game playing in the NHL full time?... having all their confidence destroyed? You will destroy your prospects this way. Imagine putting Berrgren in the NHL on the 2nd line right now playing 16 min a night...

He will be injured or mentally destroyed in 2 months.

I'm sorry but SOMEONE has to actually teach Cholowski/Hronek some stuff. And yes, a less skilled player CAN teach them something...

Some of you are extremists... and more so... your comments do not have a lot of thought behind them.
Abdelkader
Daley
DeKeyser
Ericsson
Glendening
Helm
Howard
Kronwall
Nielsen
Nyquist
Zetterberg

Prior to signing Green and Vanek, that was the list of veteran players to mentor the kids.

I agree that SOME experience is useful...but how much is too much?
 

TheOtherOne

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Guys everybody knows it's impossible to improve until the gm says the exact words "we are rebuilding" in that specific order.
 

kliq

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Abdelkader
Daley
DeKeyser
Ericsson
Glendening
Helm
Howard
Kronwall
Nielsen
Nyquist
Zetterberg

Prior to signing Green and Vanek, that was the list of veteran players to mentor the kids.

I agree that SOME experience is useful...but how much is too much?

I see your point, we do have a lot of vets.
In Green, I completely get the signing. We really don't have any D other then him that can help mentor the youth when it comes to the offensive side of their games outside of maybe Kronwall, but who know what we are going to get out of him this year.

Vanek, I wouldnt have signed him, but I dont hate the move either. At least compared to the other vets on that list, he can also help the kids with the offensive side of their games. Obviously Zetterberg can do that, but who knows if he even plays. I don't know if Nyquist is really a good leader in that regard.

With that said, if we could move out the majority of that list, I would do it in a heartbeat.
 
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Claypool

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Abdelkader
Daley
DeKeyser
Ericsson
Glendening
Helm
Howard
Kronwall
Nielsen
Nyquist
Zetterberg

Prior to signing Green and Vanek, that was the list of veteran players to mentor the kids.

I agree that SOME experience is useful...but how much is too much?

As many as five of those players will likely be gone by the end of the season, six if you count Zetterberg. I'm not sure what you're point is.
 

newfy

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As many as five of those players will likely be gone by the end of the season, six if you count Zetterberg. I'm not sure what you're point is.

Yep. I think there will be at minimum, 3 higher end young guys inserted in the line up this year for a good chunk of games with Zadina, Rasmussen and Hronek. I also think that Cholowski will get at the very least some games (a noticeable amount) and its starting to sound like the wings have hopes Givani Smith can play a bit this year.

Probably 5 guys making their debut this year, with the top 2 players on the team likely being Larkin and Mantha around 23 years old. The wings should cut even more vets to make room for all these young guys getting held back....
 

Winger98

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We have drafted more players than any team in the NHL over the last two years. We have kids competing for jobs straight out of camp and it would seem both Zadina and Rasmussen are going to see some time, Ras should be up all year. Our best player is now our young future captain. Holland has to come up with a plan with the defense and I know why people are concerned there. But he has been committed to a rebuild for the last couple years at least in terms of his actions. So much so I am confused why people are making attempts at that isn't what he is up to. He is trading for future assets and collecting a lot of them.

We are going to be really bad this year in my opinion. I think they all know it, they aren't going to put it that way. But, I doubt seriously guys like Devellano and Holland actually think this is going to be super competitive. Again the message even on a Vanek and Green are that they help the young kids score and gain confidence in the league. We will see, but he has followed through on a pretty big rebuild the last couple years and seems committed to it. Only thing I think would stop it immediately is a top 5 pick and Karlsson coming in Free Agency.

What has Holland done before a season went all to hell that screams rebuilding? Yeah, we've had a lot of picks the past few years because Holland sold after it became clear our seasons had gone to the dogs. You're not going to win me over with this argument that Holland is blowing over $80 million every year just to shelter the kids. He was hoping Zetterberg would be there this fall, and he signed Vanek and Green not to cushion the load for the kids, but to keep trying to push this club back to the playoffs.

When it became apparent Z was going to miss the season, I'm sure those expectations took a massive hit - at least partially because they have zero faith in their younger players. And now I'm sure their message is going to shift a bit. In the end, I don't think Holland has a choice, though. He screwed up the three or so years before missing the playoffs with how he handled the roster and contracts, the time he could have legitimately softened the hard rebuild we're going to have sit through now as we wait for the junk deals to come off the books and higher picks to accumulate.

Which is where I say we're going to have to wait and see how Holland manages it, because dreams are just dreams for a reason. At some point, blowing past the cap for any and all help he can find is going to result in a club that's not a tire fire, and when we could be using another top5 pick or two, we're going to be in the teens, with a club just decent enough to not draft high enough for the help it actually needs.
 

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