HOHHOF - Early Era - Round 1 !

Discussion in 'The History of Hockey' started by MXD, Jan 12, 2011.

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  1. MXD

    MXD Original #4

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    The first round for the Early Era HOHHOF begans now. Each voter will have 4 votes at his disposal, that he MUST cast, and the deadline will be Sunday, January 23rd.
    If a player gets 80% of the total possible votes, he'll get induced in the HOHHOF. The votes are to be cast at

    [email protected]

    The eligible players can be found on this thread : http://hfboards.com/showthread.php?t=847482

    Click on the link beside the player for additionnal info.

    This is the thread for Round 1 of the discussion. Feel free to advocate for the players that you deem worthy.

    Here's a few "mandatory" rules :

    - At all time, and in every round you can cast a write-in vote. This said, if you cast a vote for a non-eligible player (ex.: Josef Malecek in this one) in any round, your vote will be voided.
    - Every guy getting a write-in vote will be added to the ballot for the whole Early Era Rounds.
    - The players will remain on the Early Era ballots until the end of the rounds, or until when they're inducted.
    - As of now, there will be TEN (10) rounds. That number MIGHT be "reviewed" for a few more rounds (not less).
    - The Early Era guys will be eligible for write-ins in the "Chronological" rounds. It's a bit useless to bother about write-in rules at this point (since this is basically an open ballot with 80+ names), but if a guy is written in, he'll remain on the ballot for the reminder of the Early Era Rounds.
    - When you send your E-Mail, use the following format for the title
    HOHHOF ROUND x (in this case, 1), "hfboards usename" ballot

    So, for me, it would look like : HOHHOF Round 1, MXD ballot.

    The idea is to make the job easier for us when we count the votes.

    - Keep it civil and polite.

    Here's a suggestion :

    - Try to vote for the more "deserving guys", the players you think are the really best in that crop. Example : I really think Hod Stuart is worthy of the HOHHOF, and I sorta like his personnal story. This said -- I recognize there are AT LEAST four more "worthy" guys than him at this point. In this said, I'll restrain from voting for Hod Stuart in the 1st round. The idea is to get is to not get stuck with a few players that we all think are worthy, but that we disagree on the order of their induction.



    And a few others messages that aren't related to the Early Era voting rounds

    - Still looking for another trustee.
    - We need to start the "research" for the "Post-merger and Depression era" Keep in mind that the voting will start in 1940, with a 3 year "waiving" period (well, 3 seasons actually). So every player retiring in 1936-1937 or earlier will be eligible for the first round, and the other will be eligible in subsequent rounds.
     
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2011
  2. Dreakmur

    Dreakmur Registered User

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    Should we be discussing these before we vote?

    I can only see 2 guys getting in this round. The rest, I think, will be too spread out.
     
  3. EagleBelfour

    EagleBelfour Registered User

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    I'll start the ''ball''.

    Is there any way Fred ''Cyclone'' Taylor not getting inducted in the first round?

    ''He was as near perfection as we shall probably ever see. He had the speed of Morenz, the grade of Bun Cook, the poke check of Frank Boucher, the shot of Tom Phillips.'' - Lester Patrick

    Taylor is the All-Time PCHA producer in passing and points, while being 3rd in goals. He's an charter member of the original HOF and widely regarded as the best player of All-Time, until Howie Morenz.

    I could go on, but I feel it's unnecessary, unless anyone think he dosn't deserve to be selected in the first round.

    ------------

    Also, I don't think we have made a decision on what are the voting criteria. Example in hand: Hobey Baker.
     
  4. KingGallagherXI

    KingGallagherXI Registered User

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    I got the three offensive stars of the early era (NHL): Denneny, Dye and Malone, and Sprague Cleghorn.

    Denneny would have 1 Ross and 1 Richard (and 7 times top 3 in points), Dye 2 Ross and 3 Richard (and 1 retro Conn Smythe), Malone 2 Ross and 2 Richard and was considered the fastest skater of his era.

    Cleghorn was not only a top defenseman offensively, but also one of the meanest, toughest and feared dman.

    So many good choices though...

    And who would they be?
     
  5. EagleBelfour

    EagleBelfour Registered User

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    Can you elaborate as to why Babe Dye is a better candidate than Cyclone Taylor?
     
  6. DaveG

    DaveG Global Moderator

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    My guess would be Taylor and Lalonde, but as you said there are so many good choices out there.

    Both of those are on my list as of now, as is Malone and Benedict.
     
  7. MXD

    MXD Original #4

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    One my few interventions :

    Two sure guys, one 85%, and the other is up in the air.
     
  8. Dreakmur

    Dreakmur Registered User

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    The only two that I can see getting 80% are Frank Nighbor and Cyclone Taylor.

    After them, there are just too many guys with legit cases, and the votes will all get split. Sprague Cleghorn is the best defenseman, but do you account for his personality issues? Clint Benedict is clearly the best goalie, but is he really more dominant that some of the remaining forwards? Newsy Lalonde and Russell Bowie are both dominant offensive forwards, but do we want to induct all forwards? Outside of those guys, I really don't see anybody else getting any votes.... but even so, the split will ensure none get in.
     
  9. Dreakmur

    Dreakmur Registered User

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    Newsy Lalonde, Joe Malone, and Frank Nighbor all played at the same time, and Nighbor was by far the best of those 3. He was just as good offensively, and he might just be the best defensive forward who ever lived.
     
  10. Dreakmur

    Dreakmur Registered User

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    Nice to see that Lester Patrick quote I found is getting some use. I thought it was amaing too!! :nod:

    You're right on Taylor. He should get almost 100% here.
     
  11. EagleBelfour

    EagleBelfour Registered User

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    Really? You're throwing my off guard there Dreakmur. I value your opinion, but my pre-conceive thought on those three is that Lalonde over Nighbor over Malone. When I read that Frank Nighbor is 'far and away' the best of those three, I have yet to hear a good argument (Might not have looked at the right place).

    Frank Nighbor made a long way, since he was selected outside the Top-100 in the ATD, but I thought he founded his 'niche' between 40 and 55.
     
  12. reckoning

    reckoning Registered User

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    I can only see one player as a shoo-in to get in this round. After that, there's just so many other candidates out there that it's not inconceivable that they would all be left off at least 20% of the ballots.

    My top three picks for this round were fairly easy, but I'm having a hard time settling on the fourth one because there's six players who are very close in my mind.
     
  13. DaveG

    DaveG Global Moderator

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    You may be right, god knows more research on selecting between these three would never be a bad thing. I've always understood that it was close between the three and that Lalonde and Malone were generally regarded as being the flashier players.
     
  14. finchster

    finchster Registered User

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    I am not decided on my vote but I have ideas of how I am leaning. Hockey is a team sport and the first ballot should honour based on position. It is almost impossible to vote one player over another when they played different positions especially when many are worthy. I am leaning towards voting for the best players based on position, the best remaining forward, goaltender, defenseman and one extra player (or in this era rover). I will not always stick to this method but when in doubt like this first vote I think it would be useful.

    I am leaning towards voting for

    Taylor
    Lalonde
    Benedict
    Cleghorn

    I think for the first vote this makes the most sense but I am not 100% satisfied with these picks for various reasons.
     
  15. Dreakmur

    Dreakmur Registered User

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    Perhaps you are right about him not bing "far and away" the best. I think I'll actually back off that. While I will agree it may not be by a large margin, I do beleive that Nighbor was clearly better than both Lalonde and Malone.

    He is the 3rd best offensive player of them, but he's not too far behind. His defensive game is just so far ahead of theirs that I think it, not only closes the gap, but gives him an edge. I have him ahead of them for the same reasons I have Bobby Clarke and Bryan Trottier ahead of Phil Esposito.

    Also, the fact that he was the key player on so many championship teams means a lot to me.
     
  16. Dreakmur

    Dreakmur Registered User

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    If we're going to look at the flashiest players or best scorers, Russell Bowie should be on everyone's list.

    He spent a decade as a top-3 scorer every year, and was, by an absolute canyon, the best player over that span.
     
  17. The Cheat

    The Cheat Habitual Linestepper

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    what the hell is a hohhof. I don't see any description of what the acronym is
     
  18. Dreakmur

    Dreakmur Registered User

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    I would assume it stands for History of Hockey Hall of Fame
     
  19. Leafs Forever

    Leafs Forever Registered User

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    It's the history of hockey (board) hall of fame. Our own version of the hall of fame- you can probably dig up a thread where things kicked off.



    Anyway, I'll campaign for Russel Bowie here. Shouldn't a player considered the best player ever for as long as he was, the first player to absolutely annialate the competition, be amongst our first inductees? Going by more of an ATD ranking system, is he a top-4 guy? Perhaps not. Is he a top-4 guy in historical significance? I think so.
     
  20. seventieslord

    seventieslord Student Of The Game

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    I see major vote-splitting potential beyond Cyclone Taylor. Thing is, I don't think everyone even agrees Taylor was better than Lalonde, and by extension, Nighbor.
     
  21. Nalyd Psycho

    Nalyd Psycho Registered User

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    Except the four year span when Frank McGee was better.

    That's my take on Nighbor as well. He is his era's Clarke/Trottier type. He should absolutely be above Malone. Lalonde there is room for debate.
     
  22. seventieslord

    seventieslord Student Of The Game

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    Oh yeah. I think we are well beyond any Malone/Nighbor debate.
     
  23. Dreakmur

    Dreakmur Registered User

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    Bowie actually outscored McGee by a pretty wide margin in those 4 years. I'll ave to double check, but I'm pretty Bowie had him beat by like 50%.

    Was McGee a better overall player over just those 4 years? I'd probably say yes.

    I was talking about Bowie's decade of dominance though, and, when you look at the whole decade, he's by far the best.

    I'd agree that Lalonde is closer to Nighbor than Malone is. Lalonde has the physical edge, that's for sure.
     
  24. seventieslord

    seventieslord Student Of The Game

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    a couple of those years McGee was also in the easier FAHL too.
     
  25. KingGallagherXI

    KingGallagherXI Registered User

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    Can anyone explain why Denneny isn't included in the discussion? His numbers are pretty impressive, more than Lalonde IMO.
     

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