Theokritos
Global Moderator
- Apr 6, 2010
- 12,541
- 4,934
Huge difference Theo. What are you talking about?
I was only referring to speed. The notion that players of yesterday wouldn't be able to keep up with the players of today.
Huge difference Theo. What are you talking about?
That's what I think, too. When I watch clips from the 80s, I see players going all out at exactly the same speed (in some cases faster) than today's players. But the difference is that players of that era had longer shifts and needed to pace themselves, so they weren't going all out all the time.If shifts had to be a minimum of 2 minutes, the game today would look more like it was in 1960 than it does today.
Gordie Howe used to talk about how he paced himself through a shift, so he would have something in the tank when it mattered most.
If you want to reverse the comparison, Jesse Owens at full sprint was certainly faster than todays 400 metre runners.
This is a very weak argument.
How many total players to NS, Germany, Denmark, and Switzerland contribute, praytell?
It's like saying Slovenia has players in the NHL now.. yeah.. Kopitar.
USA is way up.. Finland is up for goalies.. but have a look at how many countries have dropped their contribution since the late 90s early 2000s and get back to me.
It is way more nuanced than you think.
Certain countries may ebb and flow, but the overall trend is undeniable; particularly in light of Canada’s gradual declining numbers.
This is a very weak argument.
How many total players to NS, Germany, Denmark, and Switzerland contribute, praytell?
It's like saying Slovenia has players in the NHL now.. yeah.. Kopitar.
USA is way up.. Finland is up for goalies.. but have a look at how many countries have dropped their contribution since the late 90s early 2000s and get back to me.
It is way more nuanced than you think.
It takes a simple 15 minute search on hockey reference places of birth section to sort through this, yet the denial is so intense?
There is way more nhl players than in previous era, while the hockey age Canadian born population - Canadian youth population playing organized hockey did not necessarily catched up, making the larger presence of outside talent in proportion in the league not that obvious show that the average talent got higher.
Look how much Canada dominated the world cup, last 2 olympics versus the 80s-90s-00s for example. USA didn't offer a bigger competition to Canada in the last world cup than in 1996 Canada cup, US top end talent was quite high early 90s arguably higher than now despite not having today deep level.
NHL Talent now is better than a diluted era like the 70s with 2 pro leagues probably, but the average talent in the nhl this season is not necessarily higher than during the 88-94 NHL, a time when Sakic had a hard time making the all-star team vs when an older Sakic was arguably the best player in 2001.
15-35 year's after the peak of the baby boom could have been the peak of hockey talent, not just because of the volume of youngs people, but because of the hockey popularity in Canada at the time versus now.
How exactly does one measure which players are smarter?
Time and space also has diminished over time, which are probably the 2 biggest factors that diminish smart players as they go up different levels of hockey development.
Being programmed to do something is different than growing the innate ability to process the game organically...
Yes, in soccer the difference is like night and day. In hockey? Not so much. If you account for shift lenght and skates, what difference is there at all?
Add rule changes and standadurdized - faceoffs venues procedures,faceoffs.
I'll respond here to your comment in the locked thread.
No one is projecting anything for current players, heck we aren't even taking into account this season but only up till the end of the last one.
And yes the evaluation can be done for current players the same as retired ones.
Why would this not be so?
Like it? I love it, keeps the lights on haha
You are not wrong. But rarely does a binary situation exist. There's a give and take to it...
The game is faster but there's organic fast brought about by innate ability and skill...and there's artificial fast, brought about by destruction...
We're deep in the Ricky Bobby stuff right now because it's the only way to put Ovechkin on an unholy pedestal while stepping on more complete players, but the "I wanna go fast" mindset doesn't always mean what you want it to...I do believe we are coming out of that, I believe there is more skill utilized in the game now than there was maybe eight years ago let's say...but it has taken adaptation to get there, the 2006 artificial speed is markedly different than this speed. It's necessary, in my opinion, to notate that...
On a personal matter, I was a destroy coach for a while...I would tell my players we're gonna try to win 1-0 because this league won't let us win 0 to negative one...that changed about five-ish years ago or so...now I have a lot of Tarasov principles implemented in our game and we play on our toes instead of our heels...I think we're riding a wave of that right now...if you ask me to put a time when I think it hit majority, I think it was Tampa's run to the 2015 Stanley Cup Final. I think if you got it any later than that, you were late to the party...
Fast. Speed. The quickness component gets forgotten all the time.
Ovechkin does not execute his shot quickly before the goalie makes his reads. Lost skill.
I guess that would explain his poor goal scoring finishes then huh?
Ovechkin does not execute his shot quickly before the goalie makes his reads. Lost skill.
Like it? I love it, keeps the lights on haha
You are not wrong. But rarely does a binary situation exist. There's a give and take to it...
The game is faster but there's organic fast brought about by innate ability and skill...and there's artificial fast, brought about by destruction...
We're deep in the Ricky Bobby stuff right now because it's the only way to put Ovechkin on an unholy pedestal while stepping on more complete players, but the "I wanna go fast" mindset doesn't always mean what you want it to...I do believe we are coming out of that, I believe there is more skill utilized in the game now than there was maybe eight years ago let's say...but it has taken adaptation to get there, the 2006 artificial speed is markedly different than this speed. It's necessary, in my opinion, to notate that...
On a personal matter, I was a destroy coach for a while...I would tell my players we're gonna try to win 1-0 because this league won't let us win 0 to negative one...that changed about five-ish years ago or so...now I have a lot of Tarasov principles implemented in our game and we play on our toes instead of our heels...I think we're riding a wave of that right now...if you ask me to put a time when I think it hit majority, I think it was Tampa's run to the 2015 Stanley Cup Final. I think if you got it any later than that, you were late to the party...