HFBoards Top 31 NHL Defenders

[ccman68]

Agreed - he seems to have a very loyal following around here. Put Werenski on Boston with Bergeron, Marchand, Krecji, Chara, Rask etc and I think he gets a better reputation defensively. Offensively, they aren't even in the same ballpark - Werenski looks like a young John Klingberg out there, he can create plays out of nothing.



I look at that list and I see players that could have been centermen in different hockey programs. Great skaters, cerebral, good hands, good offensive instincts...It seems like Sweden really embraces defence differently, in a way that discourages defencemen from turning into players that back into their own slot and block shots.

Personally, I love it. I am much more entertained watching Karlsson or Carlson than I am Carlo or McDonagh.

Mcavoy was on pace for 42 points whereas Werenski had 44. Doesn’t seem to be much of a difference offensively.

And I’m just gonna assume you were joking saying Werenski would be anywhere near Mcavoy’s level defensively if he was on Boston.

 

[ohcomeonref]

Nice to see "top-4 d-man" Lindholm getting some love here.

 

[QJL]

I know, most of this board would, that's why he got voted as a top 31 NHL defender.

Do people think Keith is no longer a #1 D? The defencemen around him are trash and he's doing a decent job of holding it together. I would take my chances with a 35 year old Keith than Krug going into the playoffs. Krug has been in 2 finals, no ring. And we just watched his team lose to the Blues, not much offence on their d-core ironically.

Something has to be said for Hedman, Karlsson, Burns and Josi not being able to win a ring despite being on contenders for several years. Every cup champion has a defencemen they can put out every other shift in the playoffs; Doughty, Keith, and Letang. But also, Chara in 2011, Carlson and Pietrangelo recently.

The guys who get a lot of points usually don't end up winning a chip. A #1 D-man is out there for basically half the game or more in the playoffs. They have significant influence on the outcome of the game, so can Krug play 30 minutes effectively? Never seen it. Keith hasn't declined enough for me to take a 2nd-pairing defencemen over him.

No offense, but the Keith decline has been significant. That is not just my opinion, it’s a fairly consistent one even with the Hawks fan base. Anyone who watches him on a regular basis can see that he’s a #3 defender a best. He was terrible last season. You are predicting quite a bounce back if you have him pegged as a #1.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

Byfuglien should be closer to 10 or 11

Klingberg, Subban, Letang, Weber and McDonagh are all too high.

Letang is too high? The guy who just finished 6th in Norris trophy voting despite missing 17 games, who has finished Top 10 in Norris trophy voting six times this decade, and who is a lock to score 50+ points per season, is ranked too high at #13?

When healthy, he's pretty much a lock to finish somewhere in the Top 10 in Norris voting. Yet you think him being ranked 13th, behind guys who don't have his history, makes him too high.

 

[Jeti]

Letang is too high? The guy who just finished 6th in Norris trophy voting despite missing 17 games, who has finished Top 10 in Norris trophy voting six times this decade, and who is a lock to score 50+ points per season, is ranked too high at #13?

When healthy, he's pretty much a lock to finish somewhere in the Top 10 in Norris voting. Yet you think him being ranked 13th, behind guys who don't have his history, makes him too high.

Norris voting is notoriously stupid. Don't let other people think for you.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

Norris voting is notoriously stupid. Don't let other people think for you.

Fantastic argument for why Letang should be lower than 13th.

 

[Jeti]

Fantastic argument for why Letang should be lower than 13th.

You didn't present an argument other than appealing to sports journalists.

 

[Machinehead]

I'm very here for Krug finishing ahead of Trouba.

 

[Sempiternal]

Torey Krug should be in the low 20s.

 

[ziggyjoe212]

Letang is far too low. He was in the Norris discussion the entire season until he got hurt in February. He is really underrated around the league for some reason.

 

[CanuckistanFlyerfan]

Letang is far too low. He was in the Norris discussion the entire season until he got hurt in February. He is really underrated around the league for some reason.

It's because of his injuries. He's played one full season in a 12 year career. When healthy he's great. He's just not healthy enough.

I think most people who watch hockey know what he can do.

 

[Addison Rae]

Nate Schmidt not being here is laughable

 

[BlueMed]

This is such a stupid argument given what Burns and Karlsson have accomplished in the playoffs.

Which is what exactly? How many cups do they have combined? I am not suggesting that one player can win a cup by himself, but a real #1 defensemen is exactly what the poster was describing; a 30 minute 2-way workhorse who can shut down other team's top forwards and quarterback an offense effectively. Neither Karlsson or Burns fit that description because defensively, they are trash and cannot stabilize their own end whatsoever. And who does fit that description? Keith at least use to. Doughty can. Pietrangelo can. Those 3 guys collectively have won 6 cups...

 

[Ducks in a row]

Which is what exactly? How many cups do they have combined? I am not suggesting that one player can win a cup by himself, but a real #1 defensemen is exactly what the poster was describing; a 30 minute 2-way workhorse who can shut down other team's top forwards and quarterback an offense effectively. Neither Karlsson or Burns fit that description because defensively, they are trash and cannot stabilize their own end whatsoever. And who does fit that description? Keith at least use to. Doughty can. Pietrangelo can. Those 3 guys collectively have won 6 cups...

That is a hall of fame defenseman a defenseman doesn't have to be hall of fame level players to be a true #1D

 

[boredmale]

And I’m just gonna assume you were joking saying Werenski would be anywhere near Mcavoy’s level defensively if he was on Boston.

I do think the system you play in can make a huge difference on how good you look defensively. Just using my Islanders as an example both Pulock and Mayfield looked 100 times better under Trotz then they did under Weight where both looked like chickens with their heads chopped off. Now that is an extreme example (of a great defensive coach vs a terrible one) but yes some teams do a better job protecting players flaws then others

 

[TomasHertlsRooster]

Which is what exactly? How many cups do they have combined? I am not suggesting that one player can win a cup by himself, but a real #1 defensemen is exactly what the poster was describing; a 30 minute 2-way workhorse who can shut down other team's top forwards and quarterback an offense effectively. Neither Karlsson or Burns fit that description because defensively, they are trash and cannot stabilize their own end whatsoever. And who does fit that description? Keith at least use to. Doughty can. Pietrangelo can. Those 3 guys collectively have won 6 cups...

Burns in the 2016 playoffs: 24 points in 24 games, 71.43% 5-on-5 goals for percentage, 75% 5-on-5 goals for percentage in the series his team lost

Karlsson in the 2017 playoffs: 18 points in 19 games, 67.65% 5-on-5 goals for percentage, 69.23% 5-on-5 goals for percentage in the series his team lost.

Both of them were excellent throughout the entirety of their team’s deep runs, and in the series that their teams lost, they lost entirely because of things that happened when they were not on the ice. Anybody criticizing them based on their lack of team success in the playoffs is cherry picking.

 

[WJCJ]

I'm going to assume Letang's ranking is due to him being an injury risk. Otherwise, based on actual performance when he's healthy, he's too low.

Serious question, has he been injured for a couple of seasons? From what I saw he wasn't anywhere near the player he used to be but I probably only saw him about 20 times during the last couple of regular seasons. He looked very bad defensively on a few occasions that I saw him. Has he just been battling an injury? Either way I couldn't even put him on this list at all from what I saw.

I feel that this list puts way too much emphasis on scoring stats for many of these guys. I'm a Bruin's fan and I feel that Krug is probably 15 spots too high. I am pretty sure that I would take Brandon Carlo over Krug if I had to choose one of the guys on that D pairing. Krug is a very good player but he has big holes in his defensive game although he seems to improve every year and gets better as the season goes on and plays his best in the playoffs so he is a very important player. I just don't think he would make my top 30 like he did here.

 

[VoluntaryDom]

why on earth does this site still think doughty>giordano, even after the norris?

 

[The Macho King]

Which is what exactly? How many cups do they have combined? I am not suggesting that one player can win a cup by himself, but a real #1 defensemen is exactly what the poster was describing; a 30 minute 2-way workhorse who can shut down other team's top forwards and quarterback an offense effectively. Neither Karlsson or Burns fit that description because defensively, they are trash and cannot stabilize their own end whatsoever. And who does fit that description? Keith at least use to. Doughty can. Pietrangelo can. Those 3 guys collectively have won 6 cups...

Just curious - in 1999 were you arguing that Ray Bourque wasn't a #1 Dman because he had never won the Cup?

 

[LarKing]

The sad thing about these polls is that they don't actually produce the correct results. (= They don't really even rank players in the right order, not even in the order HFBoards members would actually rank them)

The worst results come when there are a lot of pretty equal options/choices/players. Then the votes split, and usually the player/team etc with the most blind fanboy-followers wins, even though 75% of the HfBoarders think that someone else is better than them.

For example if 75% of voters rank the remaing players in the order of 1. Personal favorite X 2. Weber 3. Subban, Subban might still win the vote if the rest (25%) rank Subban first - even though 75% still think Weber is better than Subban

That is why - for the credibility of these god damn polls - you should go to a different kind of voting. Rankings, or points to remaining candidates. If that is impossible with the UI of HfBoards, then you should just vote multiple "tie-brakers" or second-rounds on each position in which a player gets less than 50%

For example, if the poll is considering the 10th best D-man, and top vote getters are Carlson 25% - Klingberg 20% - Subban 20%, you should just hold separate polls considering just them

I agree completely but that’s a ridiculous amount of polls to do. I’d suggest doing that method yourself if you ever want to see it done.

 

[LarKing]

why on earth does this site still think doughty>giordano, even after the norris?

This site has a love affair with Doughty.

 

[BlueMed]

Just curious - in 1999 were you arguing that Ray Bourque wasn't a #1 Dman because he had never won the Cup?

No. I’m saying that a number 1 defenseman is basically a 30 minute 2 way defenseman. Bourque was that. And not all number 1 d win Stanley cups. It obviously depends on the rest of the team too, but having a number 1 d contributes significantly towards winning a Stanley cup.

 

[BlueMed]

This site has a love affair with Doughty.

because of his contributions on 2 Stanley cup runs

 

[Tkachuky]

I know it’s preseason but boy does Gio look good. He was voted most in shape flames player in camp this year. Imo he will contend for the Norris again.

 

[tarheelhockey]

So I see you have made a list of defensemen, but all of them do not play for Carolina.

Trying to understand how this could happen