HFBoards Top 31 NHL Defenders - #13

Who is the 13th best defender in the NHL?


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    126
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LT

Global Moderator
Jul 23, 2010
41,542
12,919
RankPlayerAgeTeamCountryGPGAP%
#1Victor Hedman28:bolts
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7012425461.8%
#2Erik Karlsson29:sharks
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533424549.2%
#3Drew Doughty29:kings
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828374533.8%
#4Brent Burns34:sharks
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8216678333.8%
#5Mark Giordano35:flames
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7817577546.5%
#6Seth Jones24:cbj
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759374648.4%
#7Alex Pietrangelo29:blues
3.png
7113284136.1%
#8Roman Josi29:nashville
10.png
8215415635.4%
#9Morgan Rielly25:leafs
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8220527232.4%
#10John Carlson29:caps
6.png
8013577026.5%
#11John Klingberg27:stars
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6410354519.3%, 65.7% (TB)
#12P.K. Subban30:devils
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639223119.9%, 34.3% (TB)
#13
#14
#15
#16
#17
#18
#19
#20
#21
#22
#23
#24
#25
#26
#27
#28
#29
#30
#31
[TBODY] [/TBODY]
Rank hyperlinks direct to the corresponding voting thread.
Player hyperlinks direct to the corresponding player's hockey-reference.com page.


Suggested Additions:
Mathew Dumba
Aaron Ekblad
Erik Gustafsson
Torey Krug
Brett Pesce
Jeff Petry
Zach Werenski
Keith Yandle
 
Last edited:

bert

Registered User
Nov 11, 2002
35,978
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Visit site
Not even close.

But then again Klingberg went #11, so who cares?

Very close if Klingberg and Carlson already got picked. Chabot is already better than both of them. 55 points in 70 games (8th in ppg for d men) -12 on a team with -60 goal differential playing 24+ minutes a night against the other teams best players on the worst team in hockey. He is pretty damn good, if you tune into a game it doesnt take long to identify how elite he is. Oh yeah his d partner was Demelo. As a fan from the western conference id imagine you would understand what that means for him.
 

LetsGoBLUES91

Registered User
Jan 8, 2013
9,158
3,095
This is tough. The 10-25ish best in the league are all basically the same value.

Going with Slavin, but you could make a case for almost everyone that is currently an option.
 

blinds

Registered User
Jan 5, 2012
3,111
526
I still like Weber here. Guy's been injured and pretty quiet since he went to Montreal but he's still capable of being a true 1D while some of these other guys are more role players.

I'll always think Letang is overrated. Playing on a powerplay with Crosby and Malkin tends to inflate your point totals, although not to say that he doesn't contribute to it.
 

Get North

Registered User
Aug 25, 2013
8,472
1,364
B.C.
It is so weird to see how a list changes after 1 year. Letang has been anchoring the Pens defence to 3 chips. Meanwhile you have Klingberg and Rielly who can’t get past the 1st round on just as strong teams. Letang’s defence is still underrated.
 

TomasHertlsRooster

Don’t say eye test when you mean points
May 14, 2012
33,360
25,417
Fremont, CA
I went with Letang, but this is getting into Colton Parayko territory. He’s the best defensive defenseman in the league by a decent margin.
 

stl76

No. 5 in your programs, No. 1 in your hearts
Jul 2, 2015
9,003
8,262
Very close if Klingberg and Carlson already got picked. Chabot is already better than both of them. 55 points in 70 games (8th in ppg for d men) -12 on a team with -60 goal differential playing 24+ minutes a night against the other teams best players on the worst team in hockey. He is pretty damn good, if you tune into a game it doesnt take long to identify how elite he is. Oh yeah his d partner was Demelo. As a fan from the western conference id imagine you would understand what that means for him.
That's all well and good, I'm not saying Chabot is not a good player. Klingberg going that early is pure clown shoes, and I think you are underrating Carlson a bit...but these comparisons are really beside the point.

The scoring is great and he did fantastic considering the team around him, but you're talking about a 70 game sample size in which Chabot didn't even kill penalties. He was 6th out of 6 defensemen on his team in shTOI per game. At 5v5, Chabot's TOI%QoC (28.44) was lower than Borowiecki (29,28), Ceci (29.12), Jaros (29.04), Lajoie, (29.02), Harpur (28.97), and Demelo (28.53). For reference, Klingberg (29.3) and Carlson (29.19) both played significantly tougher QoC than Chabot.

Chabot played a lot of minutes, but they were relatively soft minutes (no PK, usually not against opponents top lines 5v5). He has not proven enough to be seriously considered at this point in the poll IMO.
 

NetflixandPhil

Registered User
May 7, 2016
622
266
Lindholm's great analytics should start translating into results before he's considered a top 20 defencemen. I'd have him around #30
 

bert

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Nov 11, 2002
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Visit site
That's all well and good, I'm not saying Chabot is not a good player. Klingberg going that early is pure clown shoes, and I think you are underrating Carlson a bit...but these comparisons are really beside the point.

The scoring is great and he did fantastic considering the team around him, but you're talking about a 70 game sample size in which Chabot didn't even kill penalties. He was 6th out of 6 defensemen on his team in shTOI per game. At 5v5, Chabot's TOI%QoC (28.44) was lower than Borowiecki (29,28), Ceci (29.12), Jaros (29.04), Lajoie, (29.02), Harpur (28.97), and Demelo (28.53). For reference, Klingberg (29.3) and Carlson (29.19) both played significantly tougher QoC than Chabot.

Chabot played a lot of minutes, but they were relatively soft minutes (no PK, usually not against opponents top lines 5v5). He has not proven enough to be seriously considered at this point in the poll IMO.
Everyone reverts to these corsi arguments now its so lazy. Did you watch the player for a single game? He makes jaw dropping plays and is a human breakout. Not only that but the difference in those corsi numbers is TINY. Did you even review them or just saw that the difference was slightly higher. IT WAS .4 of a percentage..... His d partner was Demelo but then you say he took harder matchups... What are you talking about?!?

If the player is playing 24:20 game and FAR better at even strength and the pp than his teammates what coach in the world would reduce that icetime for pk time?... Terrible argument on your behalf. Chabot at even strength and the PP is a top 10 d man in hockey easily.

Not proven in your opinion for sure but if you have the ability to actually watch a player and identify elite abilities in their game that goes alot further than going to a website and cherry picking one advanced stat to try and make your argument. There are far more telling advanced stats that show how good Chabot was relative to his teammates that paint a far more accurate picture. You know, like the ones that show how he actually faired against the hard matchup not just measuring the volume. The sens were trying to win of course they played him to his strengths. Holding that agaist the player is a lazy argument.
 

stl76

No. 5 in your programs, No. 1 in your hearts
Jul 2, 2015
9,003
8,262
Everyone reverts to these corsi arguments now its so lazy. Did you watch the player for a single game? He makes jaw dropping plays and is a human breakout. Not only that but the difference in those corsi numbers is TINY. Did you even review them or just saw that the difference was slightly higher. IT WAS .4 of a percentage..... His d partner was Demelo but then you say he took harder matchups... What are you talking about?!?

If the player is playing 24:20 game and FAR better at even strength and the pp than his teammates what coach in the world would reduce that icetime for pk time?... Terrible argument on your behalf. Chabot at even strength and the PP is a top 10 d man in hockey easily.

Not proven in your opinion for sure but if you have the ability to actually watch a player and identify elite abilities in their game that goes alot further than going to a website and cherry picking one advanced stat to try and make your argument. There are far more telling advanced stats that show how good Chabot was relative to his teammates that paint a far more accurate picture. You know, like the ones that show how he actually faired against the hard matchup not just measuring the volume. The sens were trying to win of course they played him to his strengths. Holding that agaist the player is a lazy argument.
Ironic that you call my “corsi argument” lazy, yet your argument basically boils down to “watch him, he gud.” For the record, my argument has absolutely zero to do with corsi.

The difference in those TOI%QoC numbers is the difference between playing top pairing competition at 5v5 (Carlson, Klingberg, Borowiecki and Ceci) and playing second pairing competition (Demelo and Chabot). The small difference between Demelo and Chabots numbers is probably explained by Demelo taking shifts away from Chabot after Chabot’s PP shifts. After all, Chabot averaged nearly three minutes a game on the PP.

Chabot’s raw advanced stats are ok, his relative stats are outstanding. This makes sense given the team around him (poor team probably dragged down his raw totals a bit and may have inflated his rel stats as well). Chabot’s a very good young defensemen, but he has a ton more to prove before he belongs in the convo of top 10-15 d. It’s not an insult. Top 10-15 dmen need to play big minutes in all situations against opponents top lines. Chabot simply hasn’t had a chance to do this yet.

Feel free to post the advanced stats that show Chabot played top competition. You might find it difficult tho, because he did not.
 

Merrrlin

Grab the 9 iron, Barry!
Jul 2, 2019
6,768
6,925
I was struggling with Parayko, Morrissey and Lindholm until I saw Slavin was still on the list. I would take all 4 of them over Subban, to be honest.
 
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