Post-Game Talk: Hellebuyck and the Paper Jets beat leafs 4-3

[Kiwi]

Yeppers

I didn't think it was the greatest argument @KIWILEAFFAN has ever used

 

[TheGoldenJet]

We played a damn good game.

Time to make a decision, Dubes.

What’s a Dubes?

(Did you mean Doobler?)

 

[Zybalto]

How are those stats over the last 3 games?

About as bad as Helle was from March 1st -6th getting pulled against the Habs and sporting an .863 save % in 3 starts.

Only a fool would make a big deal about it though as he's an elite goalie and was due a bounce back.

 

[The Hanging Jowl]

The most learned comment on goaltending that I've heard on social media this year.

No idea if you're agreeing with me or mocking. I'm gonna like the comment whether way.

 

[Critical13]

We play like last night often enough, and the team's ceiling is quite high. Dominated the Jets in every department except goaltending. Ours wasn't awful, but theirs was Vezina tier.

Not really scared of Winnipeg winning a Cup with the current line up, to be honest. Better teams will punish them for that level of play.

 

[Maplebeasts]

still trying to figure out which of the goals Peg scored posters believe were soft ?

both goalies let in exactly the same type of goals

-both goalies let in a goal off the rush from piss poor coverage
-both goalies let in a deflection
-both goalies let in a goal from a wide open player 3 feet out from off a beauty set up

the only difference was Freddie let in an extra goal from a sweet foot wedge by Mathews

but hey we lost so lets blame the goalie , lol , guess we can't expect Capt Mumbles to show up and win us a game for 11m per

Leafs were ahead of the Jets in xG 4.97-2.62. Andersen shit the bed and Hellebuyck was good. 'Nough said.

 

[JT AM da real deal]

Exactly, there's been stretches where he's been good, stretches where he's been awful but overall he's not the goalie you can win a cup with. There's no consistencies with him, you never know which Freddy you're going to get. And just overall, his average level of play is not very good. Taking a look at past cup winners, all have had very good starting goaltenders.

Vasilevsky, Binnington, Holtby, Murray, Crawford, Quick, Thomas, Niemmi, Fleury, Osgood, Ward. All those guys were playing GREAT hockey, if we want to be in the conversation with legitimate contenders, it is an area that needs to be addressed asap. We have the best defensive structure we've ever had, the best team since as long as I can remember, and yet his play and numbers are both very underwhelming.

7 Canadians
2 Americans
1 Russian
1 Finlander
These are hockey countries where kids when growing up can play elite hockey from time they are 6 ... when you miss 1,000 competitive games and try to become a goaler or even a player it is very very hard ... da support and knowledge and learnings are just not automatic ingrained in someone ... quite frankly i think it is a bloody miracle Freddy has come as far as he has

 

[hotpaws]

Leafs were ahead of the Jets in xG 4.97-2.62. Andersen shit the bed and Hellebuyck was good. 'Nough said.

wow xg , i guess you told me

i guess us outplaying them had nothing to do with them sitting back when they were leading and us making a push to come back , it seems that only gets mentioned when we're ahead and sit back and play safe

i'm wondering how you missed when they were outplaying us out of the gate only to have Helle give up a brutal muffin to Hyman which would have crashed HF if Andy let that in . lol

 

[Maplebeasts]

wow xg , i guess you told me

i guess us outplaying them had nothing to do with them sitting back when they were leading and us making a push to come back , it seems that only gets mentioned when we're ahead and sit back and play safe

i'm wondering how you missed when they were outplaying us out of the gate only to have Helle give up a brutal muffin to Hyman which would have crashed HF if Andy let that in . lol

The Jets were better out of the gate only, not most of the game. I will never understand people that think every medium to high danger chance against should result in a goal and that a .903 on the season playing for a team that is upper echelon defensively.

 

[hotpaws]

The Jets were better out of the gate only, not most of the game. I will never understand people that think every medium to high danger chance against should result in a goal and that a .903 on the season playing for a team that is upper echelon defensively.

Helle let in the exact same goals yet people on here are acting like he stoned us because he stopped a bunch of added muffins , lol

the difference in this game was AM's sweet foot deflection into our net and not Andy

and as i said , i have no problem upgrading from Andy but that's going to be a lot harder to do than people believe

 

[Maplebeasts]

Helle let in the exact same goals yet people on here are acting like he stoned us because he stopped a bunch of added muffins , lol

the difference in this game was AM's sweet foot deflection into our net and not Andy

and as i said , i have no problem upgrading from Andy but that's going to be a lot harder to do than people believe

Hellebuyck faced way more rubber and high danger chances. They weren't added muffins at all.

 

[hotpaws]

Hellebuyck faced way more rubber and high danger chances. They weren't added muffins at all.

let's be consistent , they'd be all muffins if those shots were on Andy

 

[Maplebeasts]

let's be consistent , they'd be all muffins if those shots were on Andy

That's not what happened though. You can't just flip the script for convenience's sake. The Leafs generated significantly more and better chances than the Jets and thus should have won. Why should I be making excuses for Andersen, especially when this happens too often?

 

[hotpaws]

That's not what happened though. You can't just flip the script for convenience's sake. The Leafs generated significantly more and better chances than the Jets and thus should have won. Why should I be making excuses for Andersen, especially when this happens too often?

what happened was they came out of the gate and outplayed us , Andy kept it scoreless and then Helle let in a muffin to Hyman

if the script was flipped many of our fan base would have f***ing lost it at that point

Andy is far from the best goalie in the league but he's no where near as bad as some are making him out to be

it wasn't so long ago people were shitting on Riems and pleading to have Johnny Burns play every game , i wonder how that turned out , lol

and at the end of the day there isn't a goalie who's ever played who would make this fan base happy since the expectations they've placed on the position are unrealistic

 

[Arthur Morgan]

If this was a one off game for Freddy, it wouldn't be a big deal. Good goalies have bad games. But Freddy has been bad for a year and a half now. 909 last year was not good enough. 903 this year is awful, especially considering that our defense is doing so well. We put 40 scoring chances on Hellebucyk last night at 5v5. 15 high danger chances. Those are absolutely insane numbers. We allowed 15 chances and 6 high dangers. The team played their butts off and our goalie lost. Lots of stuff for the defense to learn, Winnipeg is the only other elite offensive team in the division and we can't be giving them some of those chances. But we dominated play and the team should feel good about that.

I am getting a little concerned that this team is starting to chew up goalies. Sparks and Hutchinson were run out of town with the hounds at their heels, and it feels like Freddy is in line to follow suit. We've got a real opportunity to go deep in the playoffs this year and we need strong goaltending. I love Campbell as much as you guys, but he's played 9 games for us. Ultimately, I don't care if it's Freddy in net, Campbell, or some random that we trade for, I just want a .915 goalie for the rest of the season and the playoffs.


This is why I don't do fantasy. I did a pool with money one year, won $150 or so, hated every minute of it.

Im in a 31 team dynasty league using all players and prospects. including doing all drafts. too addicted to give it up lol.
I own Matthews though. he wasnt cheap but I acquired him lol

 

[Maplebeasts]

what happened was they came out of the gate and outplayed us , Andy kept it scoreless and then Helle let in a muffin to Hyman

if the script was flipped many of our fan base would have f***ing lost it at that point

Andy is far from the best goalie in the league but he's no where near as bad as some are making him out to be

it wasn't so long ago people were shitting on Riems and pleading to have Johnny Burns play every game , i wonder how that turned out , lol

and at the end of the day there isn't a goalie who's ever played who would make this fan base happy since the expectations they've placed on the position are unrealistic

Right and then the rest of the game happened, where Hellebuyck was a stone wall and Andersen failed to keep up. I don't care about Reimer or Bernier. Neither are Leafs and both suck. It is also plenty realistic for your goalie to do well enough to win games where you significantly out chance the opposition. Since 2018 Andersen has not been that goalie.

 

[hotpaws]

Right and then the rest of the game happened, where Hellebuyck was a stone wall and Andersen failed to keep up. I don't care about Reimer or Bernier. Neither are Leafs and both suck. It is also plenty realistic for your goalie to do well enough to win games where you significantly out chance the opposition. Since 2018 Andersen has not been that goalie.

I have a simple solution , instead of endlessly searching for a goalie who never lets in a goal we should just hire Trotz or a similar coach who can turn cast off tenders into elites at their position .

it's not only easier to do but it's also saves cap space

the down side is his teams score less so we won't be able to run to the main boards and brag about our xgf team/player stats

 

[leafsfan5]

The Jets kind of remind me of a better version of Carlyle's leafs. Out-chanced and outshot to hell (Jets advanced stats are awful IIRC), but the goalie bails them out and they score. It wasn't sustainable over a long period of time but if there's one goalie who may be able to do it, it's Helly

 

[hotpaws]

The Jets kind of remind me of a better version of Carlyle's leafs. Out-chanced and outshot to hell (Jets advanced stats are awful IIRC), but the goalie bails them out and they score. It wasn't sustainable over a long period of time but if there's one goalie who may be able to do it, it's Helly

playing in this division it's sustainable

i like there forwards and goalie , there D are crap so hopefully they can't add any before the deadline

lucky for us they're probably on a large number of players no trade list

 

[leafsfan5]

playing in this division it's sustainable

i like there forwards and goalie , there D are crap so hopefully they can't add any before the deadline

lucky for us they're probably on a large number of players no trade list

Maybe. I wouldn't make a bet that it's sustainable but then again if Winnipeg does it I wouldn't be surprised either. They definitely have the talent for it. If they can somehow get a couple of top 4 defenseman they're a top contender in the league imo

 

[Critical13]

Andersen is very good in front of a team that's doing their job and get good stats for it. But as soon as something goes wrong, he has no ability to flex out of his rigid play-style.
You can win with Andersen as long as you play a completely perfect systematic defensive game. Anything out of the box, he's horrible.

Does Toronto deserve to win? Well they were out-hit 28 to 15 ... nothing new there. They blocked 4 shots compared to the Jets 15. Mathews is credited with two take-aways...
the rest of the team? ZERO. The amount of times the Leafs made some contact against Edmonton was significantly more than these last three games. They give the opposition
time and space. They're not skating, they're not supporting their blueline. The Leafs have all the offense but are structurally lazy. Keefe would be right to tear a strip off them.

What this does do is open up any possible trade discussions IMHO.

Is this some kind of joke?

They had 24 high danger chances last night, and defended brilliantly other than a few gaffes by Holl and Rielly.

You replay that game 100 times, I bet we win 80 of them.

 

[JayfromNB1219]

Although you are right ... Keefer will not have Freddy in net ... it will be Soupy ... and it will be fine

Love Campbell but he’s only played 9 games for us we really don’t know what we have yet aside from the great personality...here’s hoping he is that guy we’ve been looking for but we should probably relax on the expectations until we know what he is

 

[KIWILEAFFAN]

I didn't think it was the greatest argument @KIWILEAFFAN has ever used

Just an observation, not an argument. Yeah he was weak on the game winning goal which is unfortunate but if that one was the only one that got by him it wouldn't be an issue. Probably still injured? The Matthews tip past Fred annoyed me the most. I am also more than pissed at his save percentage and do not think he is going to lead us past a game 7 let alone a cup run but there were a lot of other things imo that happened, as to why they lost that game.

 

[Kiwi]

Just an observation, not an argument. Yeah he was weak on the game winning goal which is unfortunate but if that one was the only one that got by him it wouldn't be an issue. Probably still injured? The Matthews tip past Fred annoyed me the most. I am also more than pissed at his save percentage and do not think he is going to lead us past a game 7 let alone a cup run but there were a lot of other things imo that happened, as to why they lost that game.

I'm hoping Campbell gets fit and starts making the starters job a competition, may the best man win

Maybe that's what Andersen needs to pull his head out of his butt

I liked our game quite honestly, do that your going to win a lot of games even if your goaltender is just ok

 

[KIWILEAFFAN]

I'm hoping Campbell gets fit and starts making the starters job a competition, may the best man win

Maybe that's what Andersen needs to pull his head out of his butt

I liked our game quite honestly, do that your going to win a lot of games even if your goaltender is just ok

Apart from a couple games at the start, the 2nd Canucks game is the only one recently, where I thought they played a below average game. This team is a consistent goalie and maybe another top 4 defender away from great things.
Half way thru after tomorrow. Anything can happen.