Speculation: Head Coach Hunt 2021

[SR]

Just listened to that coach podcast episode with Rocky Thompson. Not bad. I wouldn't say I was blown away but it's nice to hear a coach string together a coherent sentence.

Where did you find it to listen to you.

 

[Mosby]

Where did you find it to listen to you.

Here's the online version, but if you want it in podcast format I found it on the Apple Podcasts app. I assume it's also on the other podcast apps.



There is also an episode with Nate Leaman. Haven't checked out that one yet.

There is also an episode with John MacLean, which I just chuckled at as I scrolled through.

 

[rt]

Here's the online version, but if you want it in podcast format I found it on the Apple Podcasts app. I assume it's also on the other podcast apps.



There is also an episode with Nate Leaman. Haven't checked out that one yet.

There is also an episode with John MacLean, which I just chuckled at as I scrolled through.

There’s also one with Jay Woodcroft.
https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/glass-out/id1242989875?i=1000424871646

 

[rt]

Just listened to that coach podcast episode with Rocky Thompson. Not bad. I wouldn't say I was blown away but it's nice to hear a coach string together a coherent sentence.

I was absolutely blown away. I can tell you how to get there. Listen to 3-4 from other coaches first. Then listen to Thompson. It’s not that he’s just this amazing speaker. It’s that he is relevant to his peers.

 

[Tom Polakis]

To me it's not the money, but the new factor. A young new coach that BA found. A piece of clay to form.

BA is looking for fire in a man.

He is a great evaluator of men, so I would give him leeway.

I'm not big on doubling down on my posts, but it has come up multiple times in this thread that they won't want to pay the higher salary of a veteran coach. I ask how a difference of $2M is significant relative to the player payroll, and didn't really get an answer. If it's the ROI, that should be much more of a factor when deciding on players that cost (ahem) $8.25M than a coach costing $4M instead of $2M.

So my takeaway is that I'm not buying that coach's salary is a big factor.

 

[Mosby]

In one of his recent interviews, Army said something along the lines of having the support of ownership to hire whomever. Didn’t sound like cost is a factor.

What all the expensive guys do have in common though is their age and Army seems to prefer a candidate who is younger and more of a long-term thing.

The expensive guys by age are Boudreau 66, Tortorella 63, Gallant 57. That covers the main ones I think. At least the ones who won’t have a cheque coming in after June.

 

[XX]

I'm not big on doubling down on my posts, but it has come up multiple times in this thread that they won't want to pay the higher salary of a veteran coach. I ask how a difference of $2M is significant relative to the player payroll, and didn't really get an answer. If it's the ROI, that should be much more of a factor when deciding on players that cost (ahem) $8.25M than a coach costing $4M instead of $2M.

So my takeaway is that I'm not buying that coach's salary is a big factor.

It's unlikely that BA hires someone making 4-5x as much as him, which would come with a lot of clout and pull with ownership. He's just been rid of Tocchet and needs 'his guy' to get the organization on the same page.

 

[Jakey53]

In one of his recent interviews, Army said something along the lines of having the support of ownership to hire whomever. Didn’t sound like cost is a factor.

What all the expensive guys do have in common though is their age and Army seems to prefer a candidate who is younger and more of a long-term thing.

The expensive guys by age are Boudreau 66, Tortorella 63, Gallant 57. That covers the main ones I think. At least the ones who won’t have a cheque coming in after June.

Another thing they have in common is "success". When I first started out in business "years" ago I was told to hire the best man for the job and let them do it. I think it is stupid to even use age when hiring a coach. Of course salary is more of a concern when talking about a restaurant for example, but a multimillion dollar business a couple of million annually is chump change, especially if this person can take your business to the next level. We have been a losing team, losing money going the cheap route, and the way it looks we are continuing this practice.

 

[Jakey53]

It's unlikely that BA hires someone making 4-5x as much as him, which would come with a lot of clout and pull with ownership. He's just been rid of Tocchet and needs 'his guy' to get the organization on the same page.

Then BA should coach.

 

[rt]

Then BA should coach.

Why are you so sad about not getting an old re-tread on his 4th or 5th NHL head coaching gig, who feels like they “ended up” in Arizona with the rest of golden girls, looking down the barrel of retirement? It’s not a tragedy to miss out on these guys.

Do you want Patrick Marleau or Alex Newhook? I mean, look at all that Marleau has accomplished. Meanwhile, Newhook hasn’t done Jack shit at the NHL level. Let’s get all pouty if we end up with a blue chip prospect instead of a dusty old re-tread on the downslope? Why?

 

[cobra427]

True but ROI is, in some instances, much more difficult to ascertain. Cost is staring you in the face while ROI is substantially more subjective.

Let me put it to you this way. If it were me, I would look at hiring the best person for the job first, I would narrow it down to a few candidates. Once I know who I want, I would then figure out how to pay them. Cost would be a secondary factor to hiring the right person. BA might have reasons to hire somebody younger or a better candidate in his eyes than the Torts/Gallant type of older coaches.

 

[Jakey53]

Why are you so sad about not getting an old re-tread on his 4th or 5th NHL head coaching gig, who feels like they “ended up” in Arizona with the rest of golden girls, looking down the barrel of retirement? It’s not a tragedy to miss out on these guys.

Do you want Patrick Marleau or Alex Newhook? I mean, look at all that Marleau has accomplished. Meanwhile, Newhook hasn’t done Jack shit at the NHL level. Let’s get all pouty if we end up with a blue chip prospect instead of a dusty old re-tread on the downslope? Why?

I want the best man for the job, regardless of age, and if that means an older coach, so be it. BA has his own equation what he wants for a HC, other GM's have there's. Past success HAS to be in the equation, period. If not, we are just spinning our tires again. Not sure what Marleau or Newhook have to do with us looking at coaches.

 

[Mosby]

How close are Boudreau and Tortorella to retirement?

If Bruce Boudreau was parachuted into the NHL right now, he'd be the oldest coach in the league. He turns 67 next season. Tortorella turns 63.

 

[AZviaNJ]

It's unlikely that BA hires someone making 4-5x as much as him, which would come with a lot of clout and pull with ownership. He's just been rid of Tocchet and needs 'his guy' to get the organization on the same page.

Agreed, there’s definitely a plan and you appropriately described what it isn’t.

Likely Current NHL AC or AHL HC who works well with young players, within the Coyotes budget and aligns with BA’s vision. Van Ryn seems like almost too obvious a choice at this point.

 

[Jakey53]

How close are Boudreau and Tortorella to retirement?

If Bruce Boudreau was parachuted into the NHL right now, he'd be the oldest coach in the league. He turns 67 next season. Tortorella turns 63.

If they are ready for retirement then they will tell BA as much.

 

[rt]

If they are ready for retirement then they will tell BA as much.

I’m having a hard time tracking your point in all of this. Can you summarize ?

 

[Bonsai Tree]

• How often does a wet under the ears hire a top tier veteran coach. Would a Torts or Quinn even want to work w BA, not even taking into account the Arizona tire fire?

 

[Mosby]

I was absolutely blown away. I can tell you how to get there. Listen to 3-4 from other coaches first. Then listen to Thompson. It’s not that he’s just this amazing speaker. It’s that he is relevant to his peers.

Just listened to the Leaman episode. Underwhelming. Not bad or anything, and he raised some interesting points, but I definitely preferred the Thompson episode. If the interviews were those two episodes alone, I'd pick Thompson easily.

Leaman's episode also did nothing to remove concerns of him not having any experience with pros. Perhaps the next move for him should be to be an AHL head coach.

Any other podcasts of coaching candidates worth listening to?

 

[Mosby]

Dave Hakstol had basically the same resume as Leaman and was a disaster in Philly. That's what I'd like to avoid.

 

[rt]

Dave Hakstol had basically the same resume as Leaman and was a disaster in Philly. That's what I'd like to avoid.

Agreed. And it's not just the results that Hakstol had, it's what players have said about it stuff like he was in over his head, he didn't know how to work with professionals, he was used to dealing with kids, etc., etc.

 

[rt]

Just listened to the Leaman episode. Underwhelming. Not bad or anything, and he raised some interesting points, but I definitely preferred the Thompson episode. If the interviews were those two episodes alone, I'd pick Thompson easily.

Leaman's episode also did nothing to remove concerns of him not having any experience with pros. Perhaps the next move for him should be to be an AHL head coach.

Any other podcasts of coaching candidates worth listening to?

Knoblauch
‎The Voice & The Coach: Episode 28 - Kris Knoblauch (January 13, 2021) on Apple Podcasts

Tourigny
‎Breakaway, The Minor Hockey Podcast: Episode 122 | Playing the Game the Right Way (Andre Tourigny) on Apple Podcasts

Woodcroft
https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/glass-out/id1242989875?i=1000424871646

Larsen
‎Up My Hockey with Jason Podollan: Ep.4 - Brad Larsen - Asst. Coach Columbus Blue Jackets - "Road to The NHL" on Apple Podcasts

 

[rt]

• How often does a wet under the ears hire a top tier veteran coach. Would a Torts or Quinn even want to work w BA, not even taking into account the Arizona tire fire?

I honestly think there's a great chance David Quinn is our next head coach. BA was based out of Providence for most of his career, and Quinn lives there in the off-season. Both are connected to the Rhode Island hockey community. Quinn was an amateur coach during the time when BA was primarily focused on amateur hockey. BA got promoted to AGM and moved to St. Louis around the same time Quinn got the Rangers job and moved to New York.

There's also the fact that both guys have worked at a bunch of different levels, in multiple roles. I think there's some parallels there. Both are well-known names around the league with great reputations. Highly thought of guys.

Also, I think that the Rangers screwed Quinn over bad, and he was a very good soldier for them. Him and Drury are close and I think NYR will be willing to split the difference with us on his remaining compensation. I suspect it's very possible that we can pay him half of what he was owed, and NYR will agree to make him whole. Also, the team really need to get Keller going and Quinn was his coach. Quinn has made a career out of working with young players. The Coyotes will have a young team. Quinn also has a ton of pro experience. And has been a feature name in some really big stages. BU is as big a program as their is in college hockey and the New York Rangers are the New York Rangers. He's not going to be some starry eyed yokel, in over his head with his first NHL job.

Finally, Quinn just got burned badly by the ridiculous and unfair pressure of the big market. The Rangers cleaned house due to some complete bullshit. I think there may be some appeal to him coming to Arizona, working as a true partner with his front-office, and building something of their own, from scratch, without the insane pressure of "are we there yet? are we there yet? are we there yet?" that he suffered through in that New York market.

 

[rt]

Contrast what Brad Larsen starts saying at the hour and ten minute mark with the overall tone, tenor, and message of the Rocky Thompson interviews. It’s just not even close. In terms of servant leadership and true investment into the individual.

I’ve interviewed many candidates for jobs. If I was interviewing Larsen for the job and I got that answers, he’d be off my list immediately. Regardless of whatever else he said or his resume.

And Larsen seems like a really good man. And a really awesome hockey guy. I listened to another interview with him on a Christian podcast and I like him a lot. But I really don’t like that answer at all and I think it points to a bad cultural fit doe where this team is right now and where it’s heading in the immediate future.

These podcasts aren’t super worthwhile but it’s all I’ve got besides blogs. YouTube and hockeyDB. But something like the contrast between Larsen’s answer to that question and Thompson’s is crazy. Thompson goes off for 20 minutes where I’m nodding my head. Larsen does five straight minutes where I’m cringing and shaking my head. He’s giving a lecture on accountability and uses nothing but negative examples of players that highlight why it’s not his fault they didn’t get better. Then he unironically talks about self awareness right it in. Hilarious. And bad.

 

[Mosby]

Of the commonly mentioned candidates, it’s Rocky Thompson for me. And it’s not even really close. All the others are either underwhelming or totally unappealing.

I am not including guys like Knoblauch as I have not seen his name raised outside of HF.

Edit: Quinn ahead of Thompson if it includes Eichel.

 

[rt]

I’m listening to these and thinking, which of these men would I most trust with my sons’ futures. Which would I want as a mentor for my kids.

And if my boss was quitting and I had to help his boss interview potential replacements, which of these guys would I recommend to our president, take over as my VP that I report to. Which to I want to work with? Which can I count on to help me be better and have more success?