Proposal: Hayes to Pittsburgh (3 team trade)

Viqsi

"that chick from Ohio"
Oct 5, 2007
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Hayes having a career best half season assist total doesn't make him any better than he always was.
And yet Brassard's history before he became to Pitt doesn't make him a better player right now.

* * *​
Well since CBJ is presumably interested in Brassard might as well make them team X with them giving up a light cap hit and 1st to NYR
**** that ****. If Hayes is available, we go after Hayes and ignore Brass.
 
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Darren McCord

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Dec 15, 2015
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So Pens give up Brassard, 2nd and flip Hallander for Hayes @ 3.5.

Easy Pass

Pens aren't giving up one of their top prospects right now for a rental. Especially in addition to a 2nd and in Brassard is dumb.

This is a buyers year at the deadline, I think prices will be lower than normal. Lost of teams will be selling. I expect more trades of struggling player swaps, then 1rst being handed out.
 

Meeqs

Registered User
Aug 23, 2012
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Time Will tell. It depends on the projected number of the pick. Plus, likely, If he resigns with the new team (iow the 2nd would be conditional). I can see him getting a late First (projected 25-31), a very good prospect and a conditional 2020 2nd. Or a mid First round pick (projected 17-24), a good prospect and a conditional 2020 2nd.

Man are you going to be disappointed haha
 

Dipsy Doodle

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So basically the Pens use Team X to take Brassard and get Hayes to Pitt...?

Only if you think Hallander and a 2nd are worthless and Brassard would have no value either.

The way Brassard has played this year, he is only worth about a 3rd. Seriously. I don't know what happened to him. Maybe it is the way he is being used in Pitt, but his numbers are night and day. It looks like a completely different person.

It seems you do know. He's getting 3rd line minutes and DZ starts that he's never seen before in his career.
 

Mortimer Snerd

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Only if you think Hallander and a 2nd are worthless and Brassard would have no value either.



It seems you do know. He's getting 3rd line minutes and DZ starts that he's never seen before in his career.

That might do it, but still ..... it is startling. It isn't just a drop in scoring. It is the underlying performance metrics. So he is an offense player, defensively challenged, useless as a 3C. Has to play 2C or nothing. Worth a 3rd, maybe a 2nd, not a 1st.
 

Dipsy Doodle

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That might do it, but still ..... it is startling. It isn't just a drop in scoring. It is the underlying performance metrics. So he is an offense player, defensively challenged, useless as a 3C. Has to play 2C or nothing. Worth a 3rd, maybe a 2nd, not a 1st.

Since when is a UFA 2C making 3 mil per only worth a 3rd? If that were the going rate, the Pens would be better off just keeping him and using him as a skilled LW on Malkin's line.

The only thing this season has proved is that Brassard isn't a utility knife. Any team who'd want him would know going in that he'd have to be a 2C, and there are a fair number of teams who could use that.
 

Mortimer Snerd

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Since when is a UFA 2C making 3 mil per only worth a 3rd? If that were the going rate, the Pens would be better off just keeping him and using him as a skilled LW on Malkin's line.

The only thing this season has proved is that Brassard isn't a utility knife. Any team who'd want him would know going in that he'd have to be a 2C, and there are a fair number of teams who could use that.

With those limitations? And being less than elite as a 2C? What is he worth to any team that needs an upgrade at 3C? Maybe some GM pays a 1st. I hope it isn't Chevy.
 

Dipsy Doodle

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With those limitations? And being less than elite as a 2C? What is he worth to any team that needs an upgrade at 3C? Maybe some GM pays a 1st. I hope it isn't Chevy.

He's worth nothing to a team that needs an upgrade at 3C, because he can't play that role. He could mean a fair amount to a team that needs an upgrade at 2C because he has a pretty good track record there, especially in the playoffs.

If it isn't the Jets, that's fine. I don't see there being a problem with suitors, and if there is, we're better off keeping him and using him as a top 6 LW than settling for a mid-round pick.
 

Ugene Magic

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Oct 17, 2008
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GM's value Brassard more than some here for sure.

The retention hurts trying to trade him for another player coming back, but if it is straight up futures he's bringing back a 1st from a contender.

Just because he's a misfit here doesn't change his value, or the fact a team is going to give him 5.5/6.0 for term next July 1st if not sooner should the team who trades for him doesn't already sign him before then if he wants to be there.

It all comes down to cap hit of the target the Pens choose or are left with from the limited trading partners. Probably 2 to 5/6 teams.

One trade that makes sense is Lowry from the Jets where he is signed for a two years more, but he's not a top six center, but the fit might be there where the cap hits are close. Pushes Little down to 3c. Depth.

This is a trade where the Pens are downgrading due to fit and will most certainly pay more for age, contract as well. There's no need for retention here though.

Jets: Brassard +conditional 3rd: Should Brassard not re-sign with the Jets they receive a 2nd and C level prospect.

for

Pens: Lowry



For a deal around Kevin Hayes... and both being UFA, and only Brassards 3.0 to Hayes 5.175 and age difference

NYR: Brassard + 3rd and 5th

for

Pens: Hayes with retention

Both players probably don't stick with current teams. I know 100% certain Brassard won't.

If it were me, I'd trade him for futures straight up and keep the late 1st and prospect, and then either replace him from within or use the Pens own assets to replace the 3c which should cost way less than a 1st. Two 1sts could come in handy this draft to move up into the high teens. Make up for the 1st and Gustavsson lost getting Brassard. One true time where they could get good assets back.

The Pens have plenty of assets to make that work.
 
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Dr Quincy

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Jun 19, 2005
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This is a trade where the Pens are downgrading due to fit and will most certainly pay more for age, contract as well. There's no need for retention here though.

Jets: Brassard +conditional 3rd: Should Brassard not re-sign with the Jets they receive a 2nd and C level prospect.

for

Pens: Lowry

Why do the Jets do that? They need a Lowry type for the playoffs more than a Brassard type..... and oh look, they have one!
For a deal around Kevin Hayes... and both being UFA, and only Brassards 3.0 to Hayes 5.175 and age difference

NYR: Brassard + 3rd and 5th

for

Pens: Hayes with retention
giphy.gif
 
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Kupo

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For a deal around Kevin Hayes... and both being UFA, and only Brassards 3.0 to Hayes 5.175 and age difference

NYR: Brassard + 3rd and 5th

for

Pens: Hayes with retention.

Is this a joke:laugh:

Like what the actual **** here? Why is NY trading for Brassard? NY’s rebuilding. We moved Brassard to Ottawa for Zibanejad and a 2nd because we wanted to get younger.

Where’s the incentive here? A 3rd and 5th?

This is one of the dumbest proposals I have ever read.

giphy.gif
 

UnSandvich

Registered User
Sep 7, 2017
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GM's value Brassard more than some here for sure.

The retention hurts trying to trade him for another player coming back, but if it is straight up futures he's bringing back a 1st from a contender.

Just because he's a misfit here doesn't change his value, or the fact a team is going to give him 5.5/6.0 for term next July 1st if not sooner should the team who trades for him doesn't already sign him before then if he wants to be there.

It all comes down to cap hit of the target the Pens choose or are left with from the limited trading partners. Probably 2 to 5/6 teams.

One trade that makes sense is Lowry from the Jets where he is signed for a two years more, but he's not a top six center, but the fit might be there where the cap hits are close. Pushes Little down to 3c. Depth.

This is a trade where the Pens are downgrading due to fit and will most certainly pay more for age, contract as well. There's no need for retention here though.

Jets: Brassard +conditional 3rd: Should Brassard not re-sign with the Jets they receive a 2nd and C level prospect.

for

Pens: Lowry



For a deal around Kevin Hayes... and both being UFA, and only Brassards 3.0 to Hayes 5.175 and age difference

NYR: Brassard + 3rd and 5th

for

Pens: Hayes with retention

Both players probably don't stick with current teams. I know 100% certain Brassard won't.

If it were me, I'd trade him for futures straight up and keep the late 1st and prospect, and then either replace him from within or use the Pens own assets to replace the 3c which should cost way less than a 1st. Two 1sts could come in handy this draft to move up into the high teens. Make up for the 1st and Gustavsson lost getting Brassard. One true time where they could get good assets back.

The Pens have plenty of assets to make that work.


The Rangers are in a rebuild. Brassard+3rd+5th does not equal 1st+decent prospect, which is what Hayes would likely get on the market. So why would they deliberately downgrade their team for that?

EDIT: Especially with the retention, which just makes the trade even more lopsided in Pittsburgh's favor
 

Hunter368

RIP lomiller1, see you in the next life buddy.
Nov 8, 2011
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GM's value Brassard more than some here for sure.

The retention hurts trying to trade him for another player coming back, but if it is straight up futures he's bringing back a 1st from a contender.

Just because he's a misfit here doesn't change his value, or the fact a team is going to give him 5.5/6.0 for term next July 1st if not sooner should the team who trades for him doesn't already sign him before then if he wants to be there.

It all comes down to cap hit of the target the Pens choose or are left with from the limited trading partners. Probably 2 to 5/6 teams.

One trade that makes sense is Lowry from the Jets where he is signed for a two years more, but he's not a top six center, but the fit might be there where the cap hits are close. Pushes Little down to 3c. Depth.

This is a trade where the Pens are downgrading due to fit and will most certainly pay more for age, contract as well. There's no need for retention here though.

Jets: Brassard +conditional 3rd: Should Brassard not re-sign with the Jets they receive a 2nd and C level prospect.

for

Pens: Lowry



For a deal around Kevin Hayes... and both being UFA, and only Brassards 3.0 to Hayes 5.175 and age difference

NYR: Brassard + 3rd and 5th

for

Pens: Hayes with retention

Both players probably don't stick with current teams. I know 100% certain Brassard won't.

If it were me, I'd trade him for futures straight up and keep the late 1st and prospect, and then either replace him from within or use the Pens own assets to replace the 3c which should cost way less than a 1st. Two 1sts could come in handy this draft to move up into the high teens. Make up for the 1st and Gustavsson lost getting Brassard. One true time where they could get good assets back.

The Pens have plenty of assets to make that work.

Jets easy pass on that, no chance they give up Lowry.
 

Ugene Magic

EVIL LAUGH
Oct 17, 2008
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Actually, it is. For teams that roll multiple lines, rather than having a dedicated "defending" line as their third line, Brassard is a useful #3C.

He is?

The Pens 3rd line was to be just that, but Brassard isn't fitting in in that role. So why would a team trade for him to be one where he shows he's not good at it. The only way it works for a team is that he gets top PP time. What teams can afford that, or have the room to do it without him being a true top six C?

Brassard was getting better zone starts before, this all has an affect on his output.

If you can't put him where he'll succeed then there's no point in getting him. That's the glaring mistake the Pens made with him. Playing with Pearson and Kessel should see him eating the matchups there, but it's not happening.

The Pens need a proven 5 on 5 guy with very little to do with high offensive starts.

On paper you see him there and you'd think it's just gonna work. Nope.
 
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Ugene Magic

EVIL LAUGH
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Is this a joke:laugh:

Like what the actual **** here? Why is NY trading for Brassard? NY’s rebuilding. We moved Brassard to Ottawa for Zibanejad and a 2nd because we wanted to get younger.

Where’s the incentive here? A 3rd and 5th?

This is one of the dumbest proposals I have ever read.

giphy.gif

The Rangers are in a rebuild. Brassard+3rd+5th does not equal 1st+decent prospect, which is what Hayes would likely get on the market. So why would they deliberately downgrade their team for that?

EDIT: Especially with the retention, which just makes the trade even more lopsided in Pittsburgh's favor

Rebuilding?

I get retooling, rebuild would be cleaning house a lot more than that.

It's about stemming the time where Brassard signs there to get what he wants, and gives them time to find better options.

Meaning they are signing Brassard while Hayes walks/gets traded. They get assets on top of it.

It's not a concept never heard of.

Brassard would command a 1st + just the same.
 

UnSandvich

Registered User
Sep 7, 2017
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Rebuilding?

I get retooling, rebuild would be cleaning house a lot more than that.

It's about stemming the time where Brassard signs there to get what he wants, and gives them time to find better options.

Meaning they are signing Brassard while Hayes walks/gets traded. They get assets on top of it.

It's not a concept never heard of.

Brassard would command a 1st + just the same.

They have internal options to replace Hayes, and traded Brassard away a few years ago. Trading Hayes for him is losing assets, not gaining them
 
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Viqsi

"that chick from Ohio"
Oct 5, 2007
53,660
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40N 83W (approx)
The Pens 3rd line was to be just that, but Brassard isn't fitting in in that role. So why would a team trade for him to be one where he shows he's not good at it. The only way it works for a team is that he gets top PP time. What teams can afford that, or have the room to do it without him being a true top six C?
So what you're saying is that he doesn't have all that much value because he can't do the one job he would be seemingly useful at? Okay, gotcha. :thumbu:
 

Ugene Magic

EVIL LAUGH
Oct 17, 2008
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So what you're saying is that he doesn't have all that much value because he can't do the one job he would be seemingly useful at? Okay, gotcha. :thumbu:

No. I'm saying he wouldn't be good at a job he's never done before in his career.

Sometimes.... This board.
 

Ugene Magic

EVIL LAUGH
Oct 17, 2008
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They have internal options to replace Hayes, and traded Brassard away a few years ago. Trading Hayes for him is losing assets, not gaining them

That's good, but are they ready is the real question?

I'm not all that familiar with your prospects, so I have to defer for sure.
 

Big Daddy Cane

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So, Duchene, Stone, Staal, Hayes, Zuccarello, Nyquist, Simmonds, Edler, Ferland and Brassard are returning 1st round picks now?

This is getting ridiculous. On average, roughly 2 unconditional 1st round picks have moved at the deadline going back 10 years. 10 are going to move this year?
 
Feb 27, 2002
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For a deal around Kevin Hayes... and both being UFA, and only Brassards 3.0 to Hayes 5.175 and age difference

NYR: Brassard + 3rd and 5th

for

Pens: Hayes with retention .

1) why would the Rangers be at all interested in this deal

2) you really think that would be the best offer the Rangers get for Hayes?

Just awful.
 
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