Hart 2015 Finalists

[WarriorofTime]

I know the votes are already in but tonight was a prime exhibit of why Ovechkin is the best player in the nhl.

 

[ulvvf]

Benn wasn't even the best offensive player on his team, or at minimum arguably. AND his team didn't make the playoffs. Those 2 together eliminate him from any Hart chance imo. Similar for Crosby, his team made the playoffs on the last day, his team wasn't good enough for him to get hart consideration, for better or worse. When Ovy wins the Richard by the gap he did and Price wins the vezina by the gap he does, they are locks. Tavares was #3 because he was runner up for the ross by 1pt, his team was a middle tier playoff team, and he outscored the next highest person on his team by 35pts. That combo got tavares there easily, but it's a 2 man race anyway imo, so I don't get why everyone is complaining about the 3rd person on the ballot(tavares).

So not being in playoff eliminate a player for winning a trophy?

Most top player have 1-2 good player in their team that you can say it is up for a debate who is best. With that logic Crosby should never win a hart, and not ovechkin either.

 

[Fish on The Sand]

I know the votes are already in but tonight was a prime exhibit of why Ovechkin is the best player in the nhl.

Price in game 6 > Ovechkin game 1

 

[Plural]

Price in game 6 > Ovechkin game 1

Hard to compare. But that's a legit opinion.

 

[Epsilon]

Big contradiction on your part. You say having 10 more goals is better than 6 more points. Crosby had 22 more goals and only 3 less points in 2010 and still lost. So which is it?

Crosby racked up a ton of meaningless points at the end of that season against the Islanders' AHL backup goaltenders. Thankfully the voters weren't fooled by that.

 

[Hippasus]

Price in game 6 > Ovechkin game 1

I thought both of Ovechkin's points were off the charts tonight. One was a bullet wrist shot through the defender's legs that went high short side. Probably no goalie would stop that one, on average. His other was an unbelievable Forsberg / prime Crosby-like assist with two defenders covering him very closely. He looked like he would continue skating behind the net and dished to Ward in the slot last second (literally). It almost looked like a no-look pass. He had other good chances to score / get an assist. Both points in a 2-1 game and the second one was to avoid overtime. Didn't see the Habs game about which you're talking.

 

[JustAHabFan]

I dont want Price to win it, its not fair to the other goalies who have suffered a strong anti-bias becaus of their position during many generations. The goalies who got a hart did it by seperating themselfs by an incredible margin. Price will only suffer from this, he will only be misjudged in the future.

I could not stop laughing.

 

[Wrath]

So not being in playoff eliminate a player for winning a trophy?

Not saying it's fair, but the last time a non-playoff team had a Hart winner was Mario Lemieux in 1988, and that was Mario Lemieux, a top 4 player all time.

For some reason the media thinks that player's who contribute gigantic value to their team suddenly create next to zero value when the team doesn't make the playoffs, it's just the way they are .

 

[Plural]

Not saying it's fair, but the last time a non-playoff team had a Hart winner was Mario Lemieux in 1988, and that was Mario Lemieux, a top 4 player all time.

For some reason the media thinks that player's who contribute gigantic value to their team suddenly create next to zero value when the team doesn't make the playoffs, it's just the way they are .

I think the reasoning is simply that the goal of the regular season is to make it in to the playoffs. Nothing more. So, by not making it, it doesn't make any difference on what happened.

I'm not saying I agree with it, but that's a valid point to make. You have to be Lemieux-esque player to win on a non-playoff team.

 

[WarriorofTime]

Plus Benn literally won the Art Ross after his team had been eliminated by compiling big numbers in meaningless games. Not taking away the Ross from him. He deserved it. But hardly the stuff of the Most Valuable Player.

 

[Wrath]

I think the reasoning is simply that the goal of the regular season is to make it in to the playoffs. Nothing more. So, by not making it, it doesn't make any difference on what happened.

I'm not saying I agree with it, but that's a valid point to make. You have to be Lemieux-esque player to win on a non-playoff team.

I mean, it makes sense in that all the value (the value in valuable) in the world doesn't matter if the only goal is to win the cup and you don't make the playoffs.

I mean, it's all up to the semantic interpretation of value.

I'm 100% sure that Mario Lemieux was more valuable to his non-playoff team in 1988 than any of the Hart contenders were this year.

However technically Mario Lemieux provided zero value to winning the cup in 1988 since the Pens never even made the postseason.

 

[Bathcat]

Plus Benn literally won the Art Ross after his team had been eliminated by compiling big numbers in meaningless games. Not taking away the Ross from him. He deserved it. But hardly the stuff of the Most Valuable Player.

Exactly. The difference between Perry's Hart and Benn's failure to get a nomination is Perry's late-season surge actually carried the Ducks to the playoffs when Getzlaf went down to injury.

 

[GreatGonzo]

I don't see how price is a lock for winning

he had an amazing season, but League wide scoring was at its lowest in like 10 years. Also, sure Montreals offense isn't exactly a threat. But he plays in front of a great defense, including Norris winner and Norris nominee, Subban

Ovi on the other hand had Backstrom only a few points behind him, and wasn't even top 3 in points(even if it was only by a few) but he did record 50+ goals in a low scoring year.

Both are deserving but I wouldnt be surprised if Ovi won.

 

[G0AT]

I want Ovi to win it, but I think Price will win it.

 

[Plural]

I mean, it makes sense in that all the value (the value in valuable) in the world doesn't matter if the only goal is to win the cup and you don't make the playoffs.

I mean, it's all up to the semantic interpretation of value.

I'm 100% sure that Mario Lemieux was more valuable to his non-playoff team in 1988 than any of the Hart contenders were this year.

However technically Mario Lemieux provided zero value to winning the cup in 1988 since the Pens never even made the postseason.

That's exactly it. I know trophies are nice and fine, but they don't always represent the reality that well. I think Benn was about as good value to his team as the rest of the top-10 scoring forwards. Maybe someone was more valuable and maybe someone was less valuable. But still, Benn will be nowhere near (I assume) the other stars like Ovechkin/Tavares in Hart voting.

Hart trophy, as well as it correlates with individual success, someone without a high Hart finish might have had individually great season.

 

[DaHabMan]

Amazing how the West wins the Cup every year and yet doesn't even garner a single representative for the Hart.

Well...your teams are more complete and balance and are always faves for the cup. The east teams are more dependant on single players. The east racks up the individual awards whilw the west wins the cup almost every year instead.

 

[habsnacks]

Is this even close?

 

[General Fanager]

Is this even close?

Nope, but its fun to watch people argue about it anyways.....

 

[Sotty]

Price should win it pretty easily, but the voters have proven their stupidity in the past more than once.

 

[Plural]

Nope, but its fun to watch people argue about it anyways.....

Yeah, I'm banking on Price winning this with a decent margin. But considering the history of this trophy, it might get closer than we think. Deserved or not.

But there is about no chance for Price to lose this.

 

[30Yonge]

Is this even close?

You never know.
The guy who did this finished third in the Hart voting that year
despite the league avg being .908 and besting the closest goalie by .011

Dom 64 GP 30-18-14 GAA 1.87 1758/1877 SV% .937
Price 66 GP 44-16-6 GAA 1.96 1823 /1953 SV%.933

The player who won the Hart did have a pretty good year
tallying 20 more points than the runner up for the Ross.

 

[Davebo*]

I know the votes are already in but tonight was a prime exhibit of why Ovechkin is the best player in the nhl.

That's cool.

However - that's not what this trophy is about.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hart_Memorial_Trophy

 

[yada]

Honestly surprised to see Tavares make the top 3 because of the way the islanders finished the season dropping to 3 in the division.

 

[Fish on The Sand]

Crosby racked up a ton of meaningless points at the end of that season against the Islanders' AHL backup goaltenders. Thankfully the voters weren't fooled by that.

I'm glad I'm not the only one who remembers that. Didn't he have something like 11 points in 2 games against a clearly not trying Isles team in the final week?

 

[Fish on The Sand]

I don't see how price is a lock for winning

he had an amazing season, but League wide scoring was at its lowest in like 10 years. Also, sure Montreals offense isn't exactly a threat. But he plays in front of a great defense, including Norris winner and Norris nominee, Subban

Ovi on the other hand had Backstrom only a few points behind him, and wasn't even top 3 in points(even if it was only by a few) but he did record 50+ goals in a low scoring year.

Both are deserving but I wouldnt be surprised if Ovi won.

Montreal's defence is not great, its definitely below average. They give up a ton of shots from the slot. Subban is great, and Markov is good, but after that it was guys like Beaulieu, Gonchar, Emelin, and Gonchar all year. It was an ugly sight.