Guillaume Latendresse vs Bobby Ryan

[Buffalo87]

While there is no way I'd take Higgins over Selanne, I think it's much closer with MacDonald. The season is very young, but Higgins looks so much improved over last year it's not even funny, to the point that he's our second best foward. But yeah, though he's six years older, MacDonald amazing season last year is hard to ignore.

Yes, you're right it is much closer with MacDonald but I would still take McDonald over him without too much thought. I would probably be able to understand why somebody would take Higgins over MacDonald, but Higgins over MacDonald? No way

 

[MXD]

Well, there's the problem, take off your homer glasses and you'll understand our point of view.

No sane GM would pick Getzlaf, Penner and Chistov over Koivu, Kovalev and Higgins by today's abilities. As a group, and individually, too.

If you want to read that comment again 5 times, say I'm an homer 5 times. If you want to read it 10, say I'm an homer 10 times.

I'm not saying nonsense like I'd take Selanne over Plekanec everyday of the week. Just stating facts.

 

[MXD]

Yes, you're right it is much closer with MacDonald but I would still take McDonald over him without too much thought. I would probably be able to understand why somebody would take Higgins over MacDonald, but Higgins over MacDonald? No way

When Selanne will play 1st PP AND 1st PK unit. And remember, a C is more important than a W to a team -- Higgins plays W, but he's a natural C. And while I'd take Selanne over Samsonov and Ryder any time, and maybe ahead of Kovalev at times, I would not take him ahead of Higgins, bar none. A 1st-Liner W that plays C and plays on ALL PP and PK in the league... Name'em. You have like... Mike Modano, maybe? Rod Brind'Amour? (not a 1st liner anymore except for playoffs). Chris Drury for sure. Craig Conroy... That's it.

 

[Randall Graves*]

When Selanne will play 1st PP AND 1st PK unit. And remember, a C is more important than a W to a team -- Higgins plays W, but he's a natural C. And while I'd take Selanne over Samsonov and Ryder any time, and maybe ahead of Kovalev at times, I would not take him ahead of Higgins, bar none. A 1st-Liner W that plays C and plays on ALL PP and PK in the league... Name'em. You have like... Mike Modano, maybe? Rod Brind'Amour? (not a 1st liner anymore except for playoffs). Chris Drury for sure. Craig Conroy... That's it.

Higgins over Selanne? based on what?

 

[espo*]

I'm a Habs fan but i've got to agree with what an earlier poster said,our forwards are solid but not overwhelming.God how i wish they were.

I prefer Ryan too.Hope Lats can show himself to be the better player in years to come but i would'nt lay any money on that at this point in time.

 

[neelynugs]

latendresse over ryan every day of the week, and three times on sunday. this guy has hall of famer written all over him, even after only a handful of games. a force on every shift, and he's so strong and talented; it's scary how incredible he is. sometimes i wonder why montreal even plays these games, since it is clear that latendresse would just break all of gretzky's records in his rookie year. rumor has it that carbonneau took young "tender" aside the other day, and told him to scale it down a notch (to make it more fair for the rest of the league).

it's a shame that the bruins couldn't get their hands on a kid like latendresse. he will undoubtedly lead the habs to multiple stanley cups.

go "lats" go!

 

[bjac]

I fail to see how guys like Perezhogin, Murray, Kostitsyn, Latendresse, etc. can be considered part of a "stacked" team.

Your team isn't stacked. Hate to burst your bubble.

It's a solid set of forwards, no doubt. But so far from stacked it's not even funny.

If you read his post correctly you would realize he was talking about the Habs wingers being better than the Ducks... Montreals centermen are one the biggest weaknessess of the team (besides Koivu). For lats to break into the first two lines he would have to beat out Kovalev, Ryder, Higgins and Samsonov... Those wingers are much better than the Ducks top 4 wingers making it much more difficult for Lats to play on a scoring line than it is for Ryan... As for who is better, IMHO both are fairly equal and will be dissapointments.

 

[Static]

latendresse over ryan every day of the week, and three times on sunday. this guy has hall of famer written all over him, even after only a handful of games. a force on every shift, and he's so strong and talented; it's scary how incredible he is. sometimes i wonder why montreal even plays these games, since it is clear that latendresse would just break all of gretzky's records in his rookie year. rumor has it that carbonneau took young "tender" aside the other day, and told him to scale it down a notch (to make it more fair for the rest of the league).

it's a shame that the bruins couldn't get their hands on a kid like latendresse. he will undoubtedly lead the habs to multiple stanley cups.

go "lats" go!

hall of fame? what the hell??

 

[Kardi]

when you said stacked team what team are you refering to?

 

[Randall Graves*]

hall of fame? what the hell??

Yeah GUI should have his own hall of fame.

 

[Static]

when you said stacked team what team are you refering to?

somebody said Montreal had a stacked forward corps and all hell broke loose.

 

[Buffalo87]

No sane GM would pick Getzlaf, Penner and Chistov over Koivu, Kovalev and Higgins by today's abilities. As a group, and individually, too.

If you want to read that comment again 5 times, say I'm an homer 5 times. If you want to read it 10, say I'm an homer 10 times.

I'm not saying nonsense like I'd take Selanne over Plekanec everyday of the week. Just stating facts.

What are you talking about?

This is what I was referring to:

I would not take Selanne, McDonald and Kunitz (or Chistov, whoever is the other Top-6 guy...) ahead of those 3, neither.

You're telling me that doesn't reak of homerism? I don't care what you say, no sane GM would take Higgins over Selanne, the other 2 are debatable.

 

[MetalMilitia]

I believe that Bobby Ryan is better than Latendresse. Although I haven't seen Latendresse play too much, I have seen Bobby play since he was a rook in the "O" . Bobby can single handedly take over a game and lift his team up on his shoulders and get the 2 points. Any Attack fan can tell you that Bobby plays physically with and without the puck and his size is a huge advantage over the opposing players. He has dangles and sees the ice better than anyone in the OHL for sure. He is a playmaker at the max and it shows when he doesn't shoot at the wrong times. All in all, I think Bobby should shoot more and get better conditioning, but I am confident that it will all come in time. My vote goes to Bobby. Sure, this post is biased, but it makes sense when you see Bobby play in the "O".

 

[SammyTheBull]

No sane GM would pick Getzlaf, Penner and Chistov over Koivu, Kovalev and Higgins by today's abilities. As a group, and individually, too.

If you want to read that comment again 5 times, say I'm an homer 5 times. If you want to read it 10, say I'm an homer 10 times.

I'm not saying nonsense like I'd take Selanne over Plekanec everyday of the week. Just stating facts.

What facts? All I see is an opinion and the lack of evidence to support your "facts". What GMs would pick those three MTL players over three or four of the Anaheim players listed below? The Montreal players might produce slightly more but considering the salaries, age and future potential of these players Anaheim has the much better situation. The 7 million Anahem saves on the players could be used to fill roster spots with a Daniel Briere and a decent veteran.

Lets take a look at the salary of these players.

"Just stating facts"

Getzlaf- 714.4K
Penner- 450k
chistov- 800k
Perry- 684k

2.64m

vs

kovalev- 4.5m
koivu- 4.75m
higgins- 673k

9.9m

 

[neelynugs]

hall of fame? what the hell??

sorry - i didn't think i needed the:

 

[baston]

What facts? All I see is an opinion and the lack of evidence to support your "facts". What GMs would pick those three MTL players over three or four of the Anaheim players listed below? The Montreal players might produce slightly more but considering the salaries, age and future potential of these players Anaheim has the much better situation. The 7 million Anahem saves on the players could be used to fill roster spots with a Daniel Briere and a decent veteran.

Lets take a look at the salary of these players.

"Just stating facts"

Getzlaf- 714.4K
Penner- 450k
chistov- 800k
Perry- 684k

2.64m

vs

kovalev- 4.5m
koivu- 4.75m
higgins- 673k

9.9m

"Just stating facts"

Getzlaf : 39 pts last season
Penner : 7 pts last season
Chistov : first season in the NHL since 03-04 when he had 18 pts.
Perry : 25 pts last season

Kovalev : 65 pts last season
Koivu : 62 pts last season
Higgins : 38 pts last season

You're comparing apples and oranges here.

If you want to compare Getzlav, Penner and Perry (Chistov wouldn't have a spot on Montreal's lineup IMO), you need to compare them with Higgins, Perezhogin and Latendresse and then, you get pretty even with age and salaries. Anaheim couldn't sign "a Daniel Briere" because they are paying their top 2 defensemen 13 millions / year.

Anaheim's trio has clearly the advantage, even though Higgins is looking as good, or even better than Getzlav so far.

Now :

Selanne - McDonald - Kunitz - Niedermayer
VS
Koivu - Kovalev - Samsonov - Ryder

One could argue that Selanne and McDonald are better than Koivu and Kovalev because of their points total last season, but Koivu and Kovalev bring leadership and always raise to the occasion.

Now, if anybody wants to compare Kunitz and Niedermayer to Samsonov and Ryder ... There's also Mike Johnson, a two-way player who had two 60 pts seasons in Phoenix ...

Anyways ...

 

[Form and Substance]

Note: Never wade through threads involving Montreal prospects, since as is the axiom of rabid fans, they always devolve into a violent hissyfit match concerning line-ups and salaries, usually to destructive and personal ends. Moreover they will have zero pertinence to the thread subject itself.

 

[Randall Graves*]

It was Ryan vs Latendresse til oh about the 10th post.

 

[neelynugs]

i predict 7 goals for 'tender' tonight

 

[Hunter Gathers]

Note: Never wade through threads involving Montreal prospects, since as is the axiom of rabid fans, they always devolve into a violent hissyfit match concerning line-ups and salaries, usually to destructive and personal ends. Moreover they will have zero pertinence to the thread subject itself.

When someone makes such a boneheaded statement calling someone like Montreal a "stacked" team, than it opens up the floodgates for ridicule.

 

[Eeyore]

i predict 7 goals for 'tender' tonight

Sounds fair enough. I agree he wont get into double digits for goals this game, what with the Flames being a good defensive team.

Nice avatar

 

[AD]

When someone makes such a boneheaded statement calling someone like Montreal a "stacked" team, than it opens up the floodgates for ridicule.

He said STACKED AT WING.

And they are.

Montreal is weak at centre, weak at Defense, but STACKED AT WING.

Nothing ridiculous about the statement.

There are so many "rabid montreal hating fans" that it is natural that Habs fans defend their team.

 

[neelynugs]

Sounds fair enough. I agree he wont get into double digits for goals this game, what with the Flames being a good defensive team.

Nice avatar

thanks - i like it too

 

[Evil Ted]

Tenderness is a mirage, he isnt as good as people think he is.

He gets a free pass straight out of jr onto the habs roster after being impressive in a handful of games that mean nothing(preseason).

Every young habs player on the current roster has put in there time in minor pro level, Higgins, Ryder, Komisarek, Perezhogin, Pleks have all put in time playing in the AHL atleast.

Tenderness still has a whole year of jr left and he gets on the roster? maybe if he could make an impact right away but he is not that tallented, he is no differnt then any of those players on the habs who have earned there spot by seasoning in other pro leagues.

In my opinion which probably isnt shared by many on this board habs fans place this prospect on a level that is above his head. Just look at all the avatars.

I am not very familar with Bobby Ryan, and I doubt many other habs fans are either, therefore I dont think that they really can be compared at this point. But in my opinion Tenderness doesnt belong in the NHL at all he looks out of place and really was just given this spot on the roster he didnt earn it.

 

[West]

Some things I've noticed about skating...

Over the years I've notice that some players tend to get hammered by people for their skating. They tend to fall into 3 categories.

1) Guy's like Spezza and Joffery Lupul. They tend to but up solid to excellent numbers in the Top Prospects skill testing but get blasted by people actually watching the games. My take on this is they just have poor conditioning habits and don't have the endurance to keep anywhere near their top speed for any length of time. This is a conditioning issue and easily fixed.

2) Skinny guy's who do well in the Puck Handling and top speed Drills but have horrible acceleration (Simon Gagne and Colby Armstrong were rated only an average skater for this reason). The decent values in the other two drills usally means that they have good skating skills but poor leg strength. This is can be fair easily fixed with a good training program also.

3) Guys who but up weak numbers right across the board are usually in trouble from what I've seen.

Long story short if the guy's only got one major defeciency in his skating it's pretty safe to say that you can realistically improve it so that his overall skating is acceptable to excellent.

From memory Latendresse was a player who posted middle of the board numbers in most of the skating events which makes me think his main issue was endurance(option 1). Ryan was pretty weak across the board (option 3) and most scouts were pretty impressed by his conditioning level.

With all that said Latendresse over Bobby Ryan for me mostly because of the skating issues. Ryan has superior offensive skills but I think that his skating will remain enough of an issue that teams will have to be very careful how they use him.


p.s. When I say "bad skater" it means in comparison to NHL players so take it with a grain of salt.