World Cup: Group F: Germany vs. Sweden, 6/23/2018

Result?


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Drivesaitl

Time to Drive
Oct 8, 2017
45,294
54,816
Duck hunting
Can the NHL draft be over anytime soon? This board has been unstable for days.

Also, just a request that the hate germany posts be in a different thread?

This is to discuss the game.

Great game. Germany lives.
 

Stray Wasp

Registered User
May 5, 2009
4,561
1,503
South east London
What a finale. I genuinely thought Germany were gone there.

Early on, it looked like Low was a tactical genius for using the referee as a sweeper. When Toivanen scored I was amazed me the goal wasn't ruled out for handball. In the end, though, Sweden's inability to keep the ball better in the second half worked decisively against them. Although Durmaz proved a ruinous substitution, its arguable that waiting until the 74th minute to make any changes didn't do anything to help a team that was clearly flagging.

But I thought Germany's second half performance was more fuelled by desperation than coherence. As for the first 45 minutes, they simply crashed the same car they drove into a ditch against the Mexicans. I've read that in 1974 Helmut Schon suffered what approached a nervous breakdown following the DDR defeat, and Beckenbauer practically took over running the team. If the holders are to prosper this year, it feels as though the players will pretty much have to lock the coach out of the dressing room. Whenever the cameras cut to Low on the touchline his body language resembled a school coach who ran out of ideas months ago.
 
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Corto

Faceless Man
Sep 28, 2005
15,991
942
Braavos
Pretty onesided assessment of a match in which Germany had 80% possession, vast majority of the scoring chances, could have scored 5 times.

Sweden with 95mins of fairly cynical play only looking to get rare counters against the constant grain of play. You must have watched select moments and NONE of the 2nd half.

You mean an inferior team, up 1-0, is defending against the 2014 world champions instead of all out attacking?

Of course Germany were dominant.
That doesn't mean they were good. In the first half (and the Mexico game) they were being absolutely killed on the counter.
Their game plan is very questionable at the moment, and their top players (other than Kroos) are hiding or just making bad decisions (Kroos was poor first half as well, but pretty much played alone in the 2nd).
 

cgf

FireBednarsSuccessor
Oct 15, 2010
59,988
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w/ Renly's Peach
What a finale. I genuinely thought Germany were gone there.

Early on, it looked like Low was a tactical genius for using the referee as a sweeper. When Toivanen scored I was amazed me the goal wasn't ruled out for handball. In the end, though, Sweden's inability to keep the ball better in the second half worked decisively against them. Although Durmaz proved a ruinous substitution, its arguable that waiting until the 74th minute to make any changes didn't do anything to help a team that was clearly flagging.

But I thought Germany's second half performance was more fuelled by desperation than coherence. As for the first 45 minutes, they simply crashed the same car they drove into a ditch against the Mexicans. I've read that in 1974 Helmut Schon suffered what approached a nervous breakdown following the DDR defeat, and Beckenbauer practically took over running the team. If the holders are to prosper this year, it feels as though the players will pretty much have to lock the coach out of the dressing room. Whenever the cameras cut to Low on the touchline his body language resembled a school coach who ran out of ideas months ago.

We have a history of doing that, the 96 team coached itself as well.
 

cgf

FireBednarsSuccessor
Oct 15, 2010
59,988
19,060
w/ Renly's Peach
Posts appearing and disappearing, and earlier my computer was telling me that Eisen was a deleted member. (Happily, this doesn't appear to have been the case).

Is this site being run by Jean-Luc Godard?

HF is trying out this new surrealist schroeding’s forum thing.
 
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Drivesaitl

Time to Drive
Oct 8, 2017
45,294
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You mean an inferior team, up 1-0, is defending against the 2014 world champions instead of all out attacking?

Of course Germany were dominant.
That doesn't mean they were good. In the first half (and the Mexico game) they were being absolutely killed on the counter.
Their game plan is very questionable at the moment, and their top players (other than Kroos) are hiding or just making bad decisions (Kroos was poor first half as well, but pretty much played alone in the 2nd).

Its more a reflection on negative football in general and the state the game is generally in. Sweden had one intent only today and that was simply to have everybody back and hope for the best on cynical counters.

Of course Germany haven't been good as Germany can be. But Germany was still the much better team and deserved the match. The poster I replied was seemingly indicating that wasn't the case.

More though is I could have replied to any of the hate Germany posting in the thread. Of which theres been several, some apparently deleted.
 

Stray Wasp

Registered User
May 5, 2009
4,561
1,503
South east London
Who was worst in this game : the referees for not sending off Boateng or the idiot Guidetti for fouling on the counter at 92:30 and attempting a weak shot at 93:45 instead of going for the corner flag.

Now you mention it, at the time my thought about Guidetti's shot was, 'That's ludicrous, but no matter how much help Sweden give them, Germany still won't come out of this with the three points.'

Not the best prediction, as it turns out.
 

kmart

Registered User
Jan 23, 2008
4,344
667
germany had to force plays against mexico while accepting to be counter attacked... you just expect the better team to execute there which germany didnt... the gameplan was ok not the realization.
vs. sweden again... germany needed a win there and had to attack and deal with the counter... there is just no other gameplan for that stage in the tournament... its going to be similar against korea.

my sister told me that gündogan gets the hate atm.... i dont get that, he was more than ok... i believe 0 mistakes, he got the ball in akward position at times but made the best out of it.

despite his goal... i get the hate for kroos... when i watch him defend.... its like watching a very rich guy doing some labor work, it looks like he thinks he is to good for it, the same for khedira and his position is even more crucial to the defense... thank god löw pulled the trigger on that at least.
 

cgf

FireBednarsSuccessor
Oct 15, 2010
59,988
19,060
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germany had to force plays against mexico while accepting to be counter attacked... you just expect the better team to execute there which germany didnt... the gameplan was ok not the realization.
vs. sweden again... germany needed a win there and had to attack and deal with the counter... there is just no other gameplan for that stage in the tournament... its going to be similar against korea.

my sister told me that gündogan gets the hate atm.... i dont get that, he was more than ok... i believe 0 mistakes, he got the ball in akward position at times but made the best out of it.

despite his goal... i get the hate for kroos... when i watch him defend.... its like watching a very rich guy doing some labor work, it looks like he thinks he is to good for it, the same for khedira and his position is even more crucial to the defense... thank god löw pulled the trigger on that at least.

Your making excuses for tactical failures. We needed a third CB or midfielder, and twice Jogi has f***ed that up.
 

Moncherry

Registered User
Feb 5, 2010
5,845
1,055
Not as great as Iran knocking Portugal out of the tourney would be :laugh:

Portugal advancing wouldn't mean millions of people at the mercy of watching an uncouth slob of a manager repeatedly picking his nose and scratching his balls like Germany would.
 

BruinLVGA

CZ Shadow 2 Compact coming my way!
Dec 15, 2013
15,187
7,325
Switzerland
If the last two games Germany beats SK 1-0 and Sweden beats Mexico 1-0, we would have a three way tie @ 6 points, with each team having scored 3 goals and allowed 2 in the tournament...
 

Firsov99

Registered User
Feb 17, 2006
4,594
3,281
A glorious comeback for the Germans. I don't see Sweden getting more than a point from Mexico, and Germany is pretty much a lock to win against South Korea. Germany-Brazil round of 16 game is looming.
 

cgf

FireBednarsSuccessor
Oct 15, 2010
59,988
19,060
w/ Renly's Peach
Portugal advancing wouldn't mean millions of people at the mercy of watching an uncouth slob of a manager repeatedly picking his nose and scratching his balls like Germany would.

Is watching a dimwitted slob really worse than a clinical narcissist?
 

hatterson

Registered User
Apr 12, 2010
34,951
12,225
North Tonawanda, NY
If the last two games Germany beats SK 1-0 and Sweden beats Mexico 1-0, we would have a three way tie @ 6 points, with each team having scored 3 goals and allowed 2 in the tournament...

In that case Germany and Mexico would move on. With Germany getting the top seed.

They'd be all equal for the group based tie breakers, but the next set is among the tied teams. In that case both Sweden and Germany would be 2gf-2ga and Mexico would be 1gf-1ga.
 

Live in the Now

Registered User
Dec 17, 2005
53,029
7,489
LA
The five minutes was totally logical.

A.) It takes the referee ages to send off Boateng.

B.) Sweden was blatantly time wasting on all levels. Wasting time with subs, taking forever to take corners and throw-ins, goal kicks, etc.
 
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East Coast Bias

Registered User
Feb 28, 2014
8,362
6,422
NYC
A couple people saying South Korea is the worst team in this tournament. I’m not sure what to say there. Folks If you’re watching this and they’re you’re worst team.....
 

Evilo

Registered User
Mar 17, 2002
61,958
8,525
France
I don't think the 5 minutes are an issue.
Some calls or non-calls in the first half, those were more of an issue.

In any case, Sweden lost this game because of that last minute and a half and poor choices with the ball and without in those 90 seconds.
 

Paulie Gualtieri

R.I.P. Tony Sirico
May 18, 2016
12,312
3,052
I don't think the 5 minutes are an issue.
Some calls or non-calls in the first half, those were more of an issue.

In any case, Sweden lost this game because of that last minute and a half and poor choices with the ball and without in those 90 seconds.
And because the referee missed a clear penalty.
 

Eisen

Registered User
Sep 30, 2009
16,737
3,101
Duesseldorf
What a finale. I genuinely thought Germany were gone there.

Early on, it looked like Low was a tactical genius for using the referee as a sweeper. When Toivanen scored I was amazed me the goal wasn't ruled out for handball. In the end, though, Sweden's inability to keep the ball better in the second half worked decisively against them. Although Durmaz proved a ruinous substitution, its arguable that waiting until the 74th minute to make any changes didn't do anything to help a team that was clearly flagging.

But I thought Germany's second half performance was more fuelled by desperation than coherence. As for the first 45 minutes, they simply crashed the same car they drove into a ditch against the Mexicans. I've read that in 1974 Helmut Schon suffered what approached a nervous breakdown following the DDR defeat, and Beckenbauer practically took over running the team. If the holders are to prosper this year, it feels as though the players will pretty much have to lock the coach out of the dressing room. Whenever the cameras cut to Low on the touchline his body language resembled a school coach who ran out of ideas months ago.
I never heard about Schön's breakdown. I did hear that Beckenbauer and the team was not satisfied with his tactics and strongly influenced his decisions.
 

BruinLVGA

CZ Shadow 2 Compact coming my way!
Dec 15, 2013
15,187
7,325
Switzerland
In that case Germany and Mexico would move on. With Germany getting the top seed.

They'd be all equal for the group based tie breakers, but the next set is among the tied teams. In that case both Sweden and Germany would be 2gf-2ga and Mexico would be 1gf-1ga.

I looked it up for curiosity.

In such a scenario (1-0 wins of Germany over SK, Sweden over Mexico), it would be Germany and Sweden through and Mexico eliminated, in virtue of what you wrote in your second paragraph.
And who is seed number one and seed number two, it would come down to yellow and red cards and if that is also tied - unlikely, but I have not checked -, it would be drawing lots. Funky stuff.
 

hatterson

Registered User
Apr 12, 2010
34,951
12,225
North Tonawanda, NY
I looked it up for curiosity.

In such a scenario (1-0 wins of Germany over SK, Sweden over Mexico), it would be Germany and Sweden through and Mexico eliminated, in virtue of what you wrote in your second paragraph.
And who is seed number one and seed number two, it would come down to yellow and red cards and if that is also tied - unlikely, but I have not checked -, it would be drawing lots. Funky stuff.

I assumed that when Mexico was eliminated they’d reapply the tie breaker between just Germany and Sweden which would mean Germany would be above Sweden. If they don’t then yea it’d go to fair play.

Right now Germany has -5 points and Sweden has -2. So if Sweden gets 2 or fewer players picking up a yellow, they’d hold onto the advantage.
 

BruinLVGA

CZ Shadow 2 Compact coming my way!
Dec 15, 2013
15,187
7,325
Switzerland
I assumed that when Mexico was eliminated they’d reapply the tie breaker between just Germany and Sweden which would mean Germany would be above Sweden. If they don’t then yea it’d go to fair play.

Right now Germany has -5 points and Sweden has -2. So if Sweden gets 2 or fewer players picking up a yellow, they’d hold onto the advantage.

Thanks for looking up the yellow card situation. It's going to be an exciting last two matches.
 

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