Gordie Howe spent 20 consecutive years in the top 5 of scoring

[Muscles Glasses]

Not to start a baseball debate but it's hard not to choose Ruth #1 overall considering he was hitting more home runs than entire teams while batting .370 in doing so. But that's another story. Either way, Gretzky can have a lot of arguments in his favour of beng the most dominant player at his sport and that includes Ruth, Jordan and Ali IMO

Not to mention how he spent the first 5 seasons of his career as a pitcher putting up ace numbers at that position as well (career record of 94-46 including one year where he went 23-12 with a 1.75 ERA as a 21 year old)

 

[BSHH]

1) The talent depth was definitely lower then. No Europeans in the NHL, and the population of Canada was lower than it is today.

But that doesn't mean high end talent was lower.

Gordie Howe was Top 5 in points every year from 1950 to 1969.

In 1975, as a 47 year old man, he was a 1st Team All-Star in the WHA.

In 1980, as a 52 year old man, he scored 41 points in the NHL.

Howe was just a freak of nature.

2) Ray Bourque was not as dominant as Howe, but he did dominate the defensive position for 21 years. Ray Bourque was a 1st Team All-Star for the first time in 1980. He was a 1st Team-All Star for the last time in 2001.

How much better could high-end talent have gotten if the same guy could dominate for 21 years?

But Oilers1 cited the scoring records, and I also believe that it was easier to finish top 5 in scoring during the Original 6 era, where less teams gave players the opportunity to accumulate points and those flashy, offensive-minded Europeans like Bure, Mogilny, Jagr, Selänne or Ovechkin were missing. Of course, that does not take away any of Howe's merits in terms of dominance.

Being only able to follow the careers of those Great Four in retrospective, it seems to me that Howe was less obviously talented one compared to the others (maybe even in comparison with peers like Beliveau or M. Richard), but almost perfectly executed a two-way play throughout decades. Thus he appears to be the player, who somehow ideally exploited his talent to have an extremely productive career, which will likely be unmatched in longevity. Is this assertion correct?

Gruß,
BSHH

 

[Canadiens1958]

Gordie Howe

But Oilers1 cited the scoring records, and I also believe that it was easier to finish top 5 in scoring during the Original 6 era, where less teams gave players the opportunity to accumulate points and those flashy, offensive-minded Europeans like Bure, Mogilny, Jagr, Selänne or Ovechkin were missing. Of course, that does not take away any of Howe's merits in terms of dominance.

Being only able to follow the careers of those Great Four in retrospective, it seems to me that Howe was less obviously talented one compared to the others (maybe even in comparison with peers like Beliveau or M. Richard), but almost perfectly executed a two-way play throughout decades. Thus he appears to be the player, who somehow ideally exploited his talent to have an extremely productive career, which will likely be unmatched in longevity. Is this assertion correct?

Gruß,
BSHH

Gordie Howe was one of those rare individuals who was a physical force of nature. He survived a near fatal skull fracture in the 1950 semi finals against Toronto and went on to have a near injury free career afterwards. Richard had multiple injuries during his career as did Jean Beliveau.

Gordie Howe also paid a great deal of attention to the little details of the game. He was extremely efficient on the ice never wasting effort. You never saw him make the lazy play - shooting the puck down ice just short of center and producing an unnecessary icing call, or making a soft pass when the result of the game was not in question. Simply he provided an honest effort every second of every shift.

It was this mental discipline combined with the physical skills that allowed Gordie Howe to have a long career and consistent career.

 

[markzab]

Not to start a baseball debate but it's hard not to choose Ruth #1 overall considering he was hitting more home runs than entire teams while batting .370 in doing so. But that's another story. Either way, Gretzky can have a lot of arguments in his favour of being the most dominant player at his sport and that includes Ruth, Jordan and Ali IMO

I'm not an expert...in any sport really...but I just want to throw out the name Tiger Woods. Could he be debatable in this category?

 

[seventieslord]

I'm not an expert...in any sport really...but I just want to throw out the name Tiger Woods. Could he be debatable in this category?

Probably.

I'd like to see a list of the most dominant athletes in professional sports, with all sports weighted equally.

 

[diligent_d]

To be honest, I realized that Gordie Howe was one of the all-time greats - but I didn't realize he was as dominant as he was until looking at this thread. For a time, I ignorantly felt that perhaps he was considered one of the all-time bests simply due to the amount of playing years he “clung onto” ala Chris Chelios (whom I respect nevertheless.)

But I am a convert now.

To be in the top-five in any league for twenty-years straight speaks immense volumes toward just how talented Howe was as a player. In my mind, without a doubt he belongs in the top-three for sure alongside Gretzky and Orr.

 

[canucks4ever]

Not to start a baseball debate but it's hard not to choose Ruth #1 overall considering he was hitting more home runs than entire teams while batting .370 in doing so. But that's another story. Either way, Gretzky can have a lot of arguments in his favour of beng the most dominant player at his sport and that includes Ruth, Jordan and Ali IMO

I think you can throw jim brown in there somewhere, he lead the nfl in rushing 8 times in 9 years and football isnt a sport someone can play for 20 years.

I also have gordie howe as #2 all time behind gretzky.

 

[kaiser matias]

Probably.

I'd like to see a list of the most dominant athletes in professional sports, with all sports weighted equally.

I don't know the slightest thing about cricket, but I've read that Sir Donald Bradman (Australian player from 1927-49) is the "greatest batsman of all time" and that "Bradman's career Test batting average of 99.94 has been claimed to be statistically the greatest achievement in any major sport." (Wikipedia)

To put that in context, some statisticians measured the standard diviation of other sports compared with Bradman (but leaving out hockey, of course). The results are posted on Wikipedia:

Athlete Sport Statistic Standard deviations
Bradman Cricket Batting average 4.4
Pelé Association football Goals per game 3.7
Ty Cobb Baseball Batting average 3.6
Jack Nicklaus Golf Major titles 3.5
Michael Jordan Basketball Points per game 3.4

In order to post a similarly dominant career statistic as Bradman, a baseball batter would need a career batting average of .392, while a basketball player would need to score an average of 43.0 points per game.The respective records are .366 and 30.1

He led a tour of an Australian national cricket team in England in 1948, and played 31 matches against teams. They were the first, and only, team to tour England and not lose a single match, which apparently is a huge thing in cricket, as the Australian team is referred to as "the Invincibles."

However, I have read somewhere once that the only comparable athlete to Bradman is Gretzky, in terms of statistical domination over his peers. So that means something.

 

[seventieslord]

I don't know the slightest thing about cricket, but I've read that Sir Donald Bradman (Australian player from 1927-49) is the "greatest batsman of all time" and that "Bradman's career Test batting average of 99.94 has been claimed to be statistically the greatest achievement in any major sport." (Wikipedia)

To put that in context, some statisticians measured the standard diviation of other sports compared with Bradman (but leaving out hockey, of course). The results are posted on Wikipedia:



He led a tour of an Australian national cricket team in England in 1948, and played 31 matches against teams. They were the first, and only, team to tour England and not lose a single match, which apparently is a huge thing in cricket, as the Australian team is referred to as "the Invincibles."

However, I have read somewhere once that the only comparable athlete to Bradman is Gretzky, in terms of statistical domination over his peers. So that means something.

Wow, fascinating stuff. I don't know a thing about cricket, either. I wonder if he's known as the best ever, or just the most statistically dominant. In hockey the two are often not the same.

 

[kaiser matias]

Wow, fascinating stuff. I don't know a thing about cricket, either. I wonder if he's known as the best ever, or just the most statistically dominant. In hockey the two are often not the same.

I'm mostly going off Wikipedia here, but he was huge. When Nelson Mandela was released from prison in 1990 one of the first questions he asked was whether Bradman was alive. Upon hearing of Bradman's death, the Australian parliament stopped mid-session to commemorate his life, and talk radio and the like were flooded with calls about him.