Good players that you never respected

[NyQuil]

I’ll admit, as a kid in the 80s in the Gretzky camp, I was not a fan of Mario Lemieux.

I changed my tune by his incredible all-around performance in 2002 SLC where he was the best player by a mile despite his age and injury/illness history.

 

[Normand Lacombe]

Tom Barrasso- Standoffish, smug, arrogant and narcissistic are just a few of the adjectives that describe Barrasso. It should say something that Mario has never bought Barrasso back into the Pens organization. Barrasso is the greatest goalie of all time. Don't believe me? Just ask him. That is, of course, if Barrasso deems you worthy to be spoken too.

 

[sr edler]

Salo had a horse named "Lord Stanley".... I can agree with what you are saying.

It's not like I question the level of commitment though regarding most of these players, when it comes to harness racing. Some of them are probably even more into harness racing than they are hockey.

Charles Berglund, for instance, is married to the daughter of Sweden's perhaps most well known jockey of all time Stig H. Johansson.

Berglund's always puzzled me by they way because there's absolutely nothing athletic whatsoever about his appearance, even when he played. He just looks like a regular/random guy who should work at some office somewhere.

And there's nothing special about his game either. Nothing that stands out.

But he's still been a pretty good domestic player and won the Olympics, World Championships, and the SEL.

I think he was even captain for both Djurgårdens IF and the Swedish national team at some point.

Jonas Bergqvist's another guy whose appearance never struck me as stud athlete-ish.

 

[Florbalista]

While I almost entirely disagree with that poster's opinion and almost entirely agree with yours, this is obviously not correct:

As a teenager, he scored 24 points in 21 playoff games (8 points in 4 games in the Conference series). Not rising to the occasion? That's the most points by a teen in the playoffs, ever, by a margin of 71%. He was a little sub-par in 1993, but the guy was 20.

Jagr was drafted in 1990 as an 18-year-old. He was not a teenager during any part of the 1992 cup run, and he surely was 21 already by 93.

 

[The Panther]

While I almost entirely disagree with that poster's opinion and almost entirely agree with yours, this is obviously not correct:

Jagr was drafted in 1990 as an 18-year-old. He was not a teenager during any part of the 1992 cup run, and he surely was 21 already by 93.

Yes, I checked that now and you're right of course (he turned 20 about seven weeks before the playoffs started). So, in fact, among 20-year-olds or younger, Jagr has the 2nd most playoff points in a season, just 3 behind Crosby in 2008 (Jagr was younger than Cros here, too).

 

[MXD]

Justin Williams

 

[brachyrynchos]

Alexandre Daigle. Had the talent but lacked commitment to the game, right from the beginning with that photoshoot and all throughout his career I just had a hard time respecting him, he could have done better on the ice and in the bank if he at least pretended to giveca crap.

 

[joe dirte]

Jeremy roenick - loudmouth idiot
Chelios- doosh. So many incidents.

Olympic room trashing was one for both of them.

Bobby clarke. Biggest pos in hockey.

 

[ShelbyZ]

Lost in all of the Gary Roberts worship is how often he whined to the referees after the whistle.

He also gets chippy in alumni games.

 

[The Macho King]

He ran Scotty Bowman and Sergei Zubov out of town. He certainly wasn't an angel. Smoke, drank, ate like **** in the early years. He's one of those guys I think matured more slowly than most and his best work has been his role as an owner and charitable individual.

I say that as a Pittsburgh fan haha.

His comments (as owner) after that game against the Islanders that ended up in basically an all-out brawl bemoaning the state of the league and the prevalence of dirty play- WHILE having Matt Cooke on the team was one of the stupidest things I've ever heard.

Also - I mean off the ice, obviously Bobby Hull for a million reasons.

 

[Asheville]

Anyone whose intent is to injure their opponent. Funny enough, that's the greatest compliment you can pay them, as you are conceding inferiority on equal footing.

Messier
Stevens
Clarke
......

 

[ImporterExporter]

His comments (as owner) after that game against the Islanders that ended up in basically an all-out brawl bemoaning the state of the league and the prevalence of dirty play- WHILE having Matt Cooke on the team was one of the stupidest things I've ever heard.

Also - I mean off the ice, obviously Bobby Hull for a million reasons.

That stuff doesn't bother me. EVERY team/coach/owner says that after the fact. Nobody is going to throw their own guys under the bus. It's not "right" but unfortunately it happens regularly.

That was an ugly, ugly game. Remember it well. And yes, Cooke was a large pile of human trash.

 

[tarheelhockey]

Great thread idea.

I never cared for Patrick Roy. Between his visible arrogance on the ice, the way he quit on the Habs, and his off-ice persona including media spats, he just seems like a bad human being in spite of his sublime talent.

Similar feelings about Messier. Great player, garbage person.

 

[The Panther]

I don't see that Messier was a "garbage person" (that would be refuted by pretty much everyone who ever played with him) or that his intent was ever to injure his opponents. I don't feel that way about Stevens, either, who, with rare exceptions, played within the rules for 20 years.

 

[The Panther]

I never cared for Patrick Roy. Between his visible arrogance on the ice, the way he quit on the Habs, and his off-ice persona including media spats, he just seems like a bad human being in spite of his sublime talent.

I loved Roy in Montreal. But that last night with the Habs, when he went full-on prima donna, was a bit much for me. Sometimes his on-ice glares at teammates I found in bad taste. Still an awesome player, though.

 

[tarheelhockey]

I don't see that Messier was a "garbage person" (that would be refuted by pretty much everyone who ever played with him) or that his intent was ever to injure his opponents. I don't feel that way about Stevens, either, who, with rare exceptions, played within the rules for 20 years.

You don’t think Messier intended to injure opponents?

I mean I can buy all the other stuff, but that’s crazy to me. He was one of the most cold-blooded violent players in the league.

 

[Tarantula]

You don’t think Messier intended to injure opponents?

I mean I can buy all the other stuff, but that’s crazy to me. He was one of the most cold-blooded violent players in the league.

Jamie Macoun, Mike Madano would probably agree with the above post

 

[BadgerBruce]

I never cared for Frank Mahovlich’s game, and I saw him play live at least half a dozen times, even late-career with the Toros in the WHA.

He’d hang out in the cherry-picking zone and if he could pick up a pass or a stray puck, off he’d fly to the opponent’s blueline and rifle a shot on goal. Then he’d swoop into the corner .....

Spent 90% of his time between the
blue lines, which always made my blood pressure rise.

In the ‘74 Summit Series, he was on the ice for the game 1 opening faceoff with Ralph Backstrom and Gordie Howe, and that job was soon taken from him by 18 year old Mark Howe for the rest of the series.

To my eyes, the Big M looked utterly disinterested most of the time I saw him and he was a puck hog, too. Turned a 200 foot game into a 140 foot game.

 

[The Macho King]

I loved Roy in Montreal. But that last night with the Habs, when he went full-on prima donna, was a bit much for me. Sometimes his on-ice glares at teammates I found in bad taste. Still an awesome player, though.

I give goalies a shitload of leeway for a lot of stuff, so it never bothered me. And I feel Roy - who took two middle of the road teams to two Cups has a lot of credit built up that the fans in Montreal shouldn't shit on him for a rare bad game.

I still love that Detroit signed their own death warrant by hanging 9 on him that night.

 

[The Panther]

You don’t think Messier intended to injure opponents?

Not really, no. Messier had great respect for all his opponents.

A half-dozen times or so in a 26-year career he crossed the line into dangerous plays, but in all cases I've seen he simply lost his temper in the heat of the battle. He was an intense player with a physical edge. I never once saw Messier wack a guy with his stick.

Also, Messier didn't go after elite players like Mario or Yzerman, ala Gary Suter. (Yeah, I know he elbowed Mike Modano in a collision, but that's more an example of him raising an elbow to protect himself in anticipation of a hit. He didn't know who the player was. Also, we got that stretcher-fail clip from that incident, which makes it worth it.)

Sometimes he hit smaller guys, but Messier also answered the bell by fighting with McSorley (3 times, I think), Peplinski, Roberts, many others, etc.

If you're going to call Messier the dirtiest guy ever, you have to do the same for Gary Roberts, Eric Lindros, Gordie Howe, etc. It was a different time with different standards.

 

[The Panther]

Oh, I just remembered -- Messier did actually whack a guy over the head with his stick in (I think) 1984... it was a Canuck, on a very dangerous-looking play. Mess got a (then) long suspension.

 

[psycat]

Funny how people describe Markus Näslund as "disinterested"(or similiar) when every player, including Forsberg who pretty much grew up as a player together with him, that played with him says the exact opposite.

For me it's aformentioned Messier. A real douchebag who belongs in jail, still a great player at times obviously. HM: Bobby "The Rat" Clarke.

Also feel like I might be a bit biased against Bergeron, not that I don't respect him but I simply view him as a "Zetterberg ultra-lite" type of player who is pumped up by Canadian media. Have a hard time seeing a European or "small market" player of similiar stature gain as much praise.

 

[MBH]

Mike Gartner. Stats of an all-time great. But while he was good, I never viewed him as anything all that special.

 

[The Macho King]

Not really, no. Messier had great respect for all his opponents.

A half-dozen times or so in a 26-year career he crossed the line into dangerous plays, but in all cases I've seen he simply lost his temper in the heat of the battle. He was an intense player with a physical edge. I never once saw Messier wack a guy with his stick.

Also, Messier didn't go after elite players like Mario or Yzerman, ala Gary Suter. (Yeah, I know he elbowed Mike Modano in a collision, but that's more an example of him raising an elbow to protect himself in anticipation of a hit. He didn't know who the player was. Also, we got that stretcher-fail clip from that incident, which makes it worth it.)

Sometimes he hit smaller guys, but Messier also answered the bell by fighting with McSorley (3 times, I think), Peplinski, Roberts, many others, etc.

If you're going to call Messier the dirtiest guy ever, you have to do the same for Gary Roberts, Eric Lindros, Gordie Howe, etc. It was a different time with different standards.

 

[jiboy]

I will go with Patrick Marleau.

What a vanilla , bland , emotion less player. He puts up good numbers but doesnt seem to have a burning desire to actually win hockey games. Hes just out there putting numbers and playing like a professional but his game leaves me indifferent.

He seems happy to be considered a good player and to play in the NHL for a long time , wich is great for sure but not cutting it if you want to make it to HHOF and be remembered.