Good or Bad trade offer?

Discussion in 'General Fantasy Talk' started by ItsthatSimple, Oct 7, 2013.

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  1. ItsthatSimple

    ItsthatSimple Registered User

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    I've been offered Byfuglien Ryder and Halak for OV and taylor hall and corey schneider, I dont think i should trade OV, what do you think?
     
  2. canucks20

    canucks20 Registered User

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    This is a joke right?
     
  3. ItsthatSimple

    ItsthatSimple Registered User

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    No im serious my friend at work is offering it to me and he knows a hell of a lot more than me with hockey. So please help me I dont want him to think hes getting over on me.
     
  4. ItsthatSimple

    ItsthatSimple Registered User

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    Or he said byfuglien and vrbata for OV...
     
  5. DelZottoHitTheNetJK

    DelZottoHitTheNetJK Registered User

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    You should try and see if he would be willing to give up Parros for OV that would be a steal
     
  6. ItsthatSimple

    ItsthatSimple Registered User

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    You see ^^^ hes trying to pull a quick one on me. (thats him)
     
  7. canucks20

    canucks20 Registered User

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    Its a really bad trade for you. Your friend is trying to rip you off
     
  8. DelZottoHitTheNetJK

    DelZottoHitTheNetJK Registered User

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    Not even close. You can't say that without considering both teams rosters and needs. His goaltending conists of Nabokov, Schneider and Markstrom. Nabokov(38 years old now?) will be gassed by the olympic break and Schneider is splitting time with Brodeur. Halak is STL clear cut starter and they're projected to be top 3 in the West which means tons of wins for Halak.

    Halak > Schneider, he upgrades his G which he badly needs (league starts 2 G).

    Ryder is replacing Kovalchuk on the Devils; he's gonna eat up a ton of minutes and his stats have always been excellent, especially on the PP (he's on NJs first PP unit).

    Ovechkin > Ryder

    His defense is also pretty brutal. Yandle, Hedman, Streit, J. Johnson, Muzzin, Visnovsky.

    By mentioned to me that he didn't want Hall; so by trading Hall for Byfuglien that gives him an elite D man (fantasy scoring wise; PPP, PIM, G, A)

    Byfuglien = Hall for fantasy value, but in this case its a need based trade. I need offense, he needs defense.

    So overall:

    He upgrades at D and G, and downgrades at F. But he has good depth at F regardless (which is why he is lacking D and G) so he can afford to. He still has Sedin, Richards, Gaborik etc.
     
  9. DelZottoHitTheNetJK

    DelZottoHitTheNetJK Registered User

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    Byfuglien + Vrbata/Ryder for Ovechkin is another deal that helps both teams. It doesn't address his goaltending but he gets a solid replacement (obviously not as good) for Ovechkin at RW with Vrbata or Ryder and he adds a stud D in the process.

    A downgrade at RW for a huge upgrade in D. His forward core still looks like this:

    Sedin
    Gaborik
    Hall
    Richards
    Little
    Hagelin (IR)


    keep in mind its a 14 person league
     
  10. you Giroux it for me

    you Giroux it for me Registered User

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    I would never do this. OV alone should be worth that, if not more. He was the highest scoring fantasy forward last year and is on a really fast start now too.

    Think of it as trading your 1st, 2nd, and 4th round picks for someones 3rd, 7th, and 12th picks. Would that make any sense at all?
     
  11. DelZottoHitTheNetJK

    DelZottoHitTheNetJK Registered User

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    Firstly, Stamkos is the #1 ranked fantasy forward due to consistency. OV had a few pretty down years by his standards, so there's always that slight risk.

    And I would based on team needs. I really think you're undervaluing Ryder and Halak as well. Look at Ryders stats the past few years, particularly on the PP. Obviously they're not Ovechkins, but they're damn good. This seriously minimizes the production he's losing from Ovechkin. Let's say for instance OV puts up 45G, 40A and 40PPP. If Ryder puts up 30G, 28A and 25PPP with the Devils is he really losing that much? Those numbers aren't unrealistic for Ryder especially considering he's a go-to guy in NJ now

    It's similar to the Gaborik trade the Rangers made. They traded a high scoring, quality player for depth pieces. He is trading from a position of strength to improve a position of weakness.
     
  12. DelZottoHitTheNetJK

    DelZottoHitTheNetJK Registered User

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    It's really simple

    OV >>> Ryder

    Halak >>> Schneider (at least while Brodeur is in the picture)

    Byfuglien > Hall

    He gets his D and G shored up and I get a game breaking forward. Seems pretty fair to me considering both rosters. On second thought, I'd be fine with throwing in a depth forward with upside like a Vrbata or Perron to make the deal better.
     
    Last edited: Oct 7, 2013
  13. Darth Bangkok

    Darth Bangkok Registered User

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    If he makes the 3 for OV trade, he's gotta drop two guys, so its like 3 for 3 for him. So even though the trade may not exactly be a real-life value for OV, it could be worth it for upgrades to other positions. Usually, I would never do an uneven trade in Yahoo fantasy. I would either let him know my possible throw-ins (the guys I have to drop in order to make room) and let him choose, or ask him to send me his in the trade.

    This is what Wojtek is arguing, but I can't comment on the validity of all his arguments. They may or may not make a lot of sense. (Is Halak the clear cut #1?)
     
  14. DelZottoHitTheNetJK

    DelZottoHitTheNetJK Registered User

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    Stl has said the job is his to lose. And yes I would prefer to keep the number even, I'd even take back Hagelin who is on IR.

    Compare Ryder's stats from last year to OV. Ryder seriously minimizes the loss in production from trading OV. Ryder had 17 PPP in 27 games which is excellent
     
  15. graphicdisaster

    graphicdisaster Registered User

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    I would say no. I can almost guarantee that whatever he offers you for Ovechkin will be not worth it for you to trade. In the original trade offer, the only thing you get that is worth your time even considering the trade is Halak.

    It would be foolish for you to trade with him. He obviously really wants to pull a quick one on you, and that's not fair to you, as someone who doesn't know hockey.
     
  16. DelZottoHitTheNetJK

    DelZottoHitTheNetJK Registered User

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    You have no idea what you're talking about Lol. Did you not even read my analysis of the deal? Ryder is no joke at RW. Your basing the value of the player off of name recognition. Ryder will account for 75% of ovechkins points and he gets to upgrade his defense and goaltending at the same time. If he was weak at forward I'd say don't do it but he's not. He has gaborik, sedin, Richards to put up points still
     
  17. you Giroux it for me

    you Giroux it for me Registered User

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    If we, people who have nothing to gain or lose from him doing the trade, are saying how poor we think the value is, I think it goes to say that we are much more impartial than the person who offered it.

    I don't care that Stamkos is ranked 1 because of consistency, OV was the best last year. If we can just throw out random things we don't want to factor, neither of them are the no 1, because Crosby is. I've decided to throw out his injury problems and prorate his points based on what he would have done if he played the whole time. In that case, he blows everyone out of the water.

    The fact is that Ryder is not even close to OV in value, and if he is the main forward coming back, I wouldn't touch this just because I have Gaborik (inconsistent), Sedin (inconsistent), and Richards (inconsistent) to put up points still.

    OV, Hall, and Schneider will help him much more than Ryder, Halak, and Byfuglien and it's just not even close at all, despite what you may want him to believe
     
  18. Rookie Chargers

    Rookie Chargers Registered User

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    Please don't tell it's because Byfl is twice the man. :laugh:
     
  19. DelZottoHitTheNetJK

    DelZottoHitTheNetJK Registered User

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    Firstly, that's not even the currently proposed deal. I would also add one of Steen/Vrbata to the package. Let's break it down again

    Halak > Schneider

    Schneider as it stands won't play more than 45 games for NJ. Halak is on arguably the second best team in the west with arguably the best defense in the west. He now has his two starting goalies (nabokov and halak) as opposed to one mediocre starter and two backups. He wins here AINEC

    Ovechkin > Ryder

    Ovechkin is a top fantasy player no doubt. But my friend is lacking depth. He was smart enough to realize this and asked me for a trade. Ryder isn't on the same level as OV but he's still a bonafide top line player and point producer. His role in NJ is huge; he's not a complimentary player on under team but rather a major component. I guarantee that Ryder will put up VERY solid numbers this year barring injury. He was phenomenal last year in Dallas. I win this one

    He's then getting his pick of Vrbata/Steen both of whom are top 6 players and are legit point producers. He wins here

    Byfuglien>Hall

    Byfuglien between the PIM and points he will put up is a more valuable fantasy player than Hall. It fills needs on both sides; I need more scoring and he needs defense. We both win

    Byfuglien/Ryder/Halak/One of Vrbata/Perron > OV/Hall/Schneider with the way both of our teams are currently structured
     
  20. DelZottoHitTheNetJK

    DelZottoHitTheNetJK Registered User

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    Because he would have to drop a forward in that proposal (done he's getting an extra player) I imagine he would drop Hagelin who's on IR until the end of the month and even when healthy is not a good fantasy player
     
  21. Misneach

    Misneach Registered User

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    Since when is Halak a starting goalie? He's 1A; Elliot is 1B. Halak won't break 50 games. He's in the same boat as Schneider albeit with a much better team.
     
  22. KrugLife

    KrugLife Registered Champion

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    It's pretty hilarious to see the dude who offered the trade trying to justify this.

    Absolute rip off. Not even close. Stop trying to take advantage of your friend
     
  23. ItsthatSimple

    ItsthatSimple Registered User

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    I appreciate everyone's input, I've decided that these are the picks I have made in the draft and for not really understanding hockey as much as everyone else I think I have a great team. I will stick through with it and just hope my goal-tending can come through this season. Thanks again everyone!
     
  24. BrainOfJ

    BrainOfJ ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

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    Thank god you didnt take that.

    That guy should have his ass kicked for even trying to pull that on you
     
  25. jordyr77

    jordyr77 Registered User

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    Good call man, that was an absolute ripoff, AINEC. Can't believe the guy who offered it to you is posting ridiculous justifications too. Besided Buff for Hall, the rest of the trade was absolute garbage. OV and Hall are top 20 assets, and besides Buff, the others aren't even top 50!!! If you're giving up one top 5 (OV) you should be getting 2 top 20's. Like his justification is the funniest thing ever. Never give up value for positional need, unless the value for that position is somewhat close. Ryder is old and had an unsustainable shooting percentage last year. Halak is not even a clear cut #1!? This offer just makes me mad someone would even try that.

    In my league I traded Rick Nash, Pavel Datsyuk, Tobias Enstrom, and a First for Sidney Crosby and people were still saying I won the trade lol (I obviously gave up ALOT, but he's a keeper now). That should give you a rough idea of the value of OV and how much people value him. Don't even consider another offer from that guy, he's out to rip you off for sure. Fair value for positional need?? How bout Karlsson or Subban for OV and Quick for Hall (Hall will be a top 10 fantasy player this year or next, put up a 95 (ish) point pace last year)
     
    Last edited: Oct 8, 2013

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