GM Chuck Fletcher

[Sombastate]

I don't honestly think we need more defensemen. If Hagg and Farmer are being used this much, its because he chooses to use them this much.

I'm not convinced that if we get a stud on defense they're gonna be used any less, and we'll still see the shit shifts and goals we've been seeing.

Sanheim has proven he's better than them, time and time again, and doesn't get their ice time. I believe given the opportunity, Meyers would also prove that. And i don't believe he would get more ice time.

 

[Flyers Faithful]

Im strongly considering starting a GoFundMe for a #FireHakstol billboard.

I’d donate

 

[Prongo]

We need a top 4 badly. Someone to play with Ghost or preferably Provorov.

Top 9 winger. Panarin would look really good next to Patrick

Panarin-Patrick-Voracek.

If we keep the dumb core together.

 

[Beef Invictus]

That just causes instability and sends a message that you don't know what you're doing at the top level.

It sends the message that failure won't be tolerated.

 

[Rich Nixon]

Might not be a popular opinion, but I really think they should consider Pietrangelo depending on what his long-term plans are.

 

[FlyerNutter]

There is a dman in house. One that should have made the opening night roster.

He is waiting. Lurking. Make the call up.

 

[Prongo]

Even with Myers/Sanheim/Provorov/Ghost I am all for getting another top 4 guy. Myers will need to adjust to the nhl. And Hagg we know can be moved. So I am for getting another top 4 guy. Ice distribution can be figured out once we bring another guy in. Especially a new head coach.

 

[Rich Nixon]

There is a dman in house. One that should have made the opening night roster.

He is waiting. Lurking. Make the call up.

Phil Myers is a good prospect, but my philosophy, and certainly the philosophy of this organization's higher-ups, is that you're not going to have success throwing a bunch of very talented but inexperienced defensemen together and hoping for the best. While he's better than the guys on the 3rd pairing, he doesn't check the box of "experienced, stabilizing force and mentor." So he should be playing, but he doesn't solve the problem necessarily.

 

[JojoTheWhale]

Might not be a popular opinion, but I really think they should consider Pietrangelo depending on what his long-term plans are.

I've been pretty vocal about not wanting Pietrangelo, but I absolutely would call on him. Fletcher isn't doing his job if he's not calling about every upgrade potentially available.

In a vacuum, sign me up in an instant. My issue is that someone is going to value him as an All Situations 1D type, which is not something that has reasonable numerical support. He's quite good offensively and sneakily average defensively. As a result, I probably don't want to be the high bidder, but there's definitely a world in which the Blues value some of "my" assets more highly than I do and I would pull the trigger.

 

[Rich Nixon]

I've been pretty vocal about not wanting Pietrangelo, but I absolutely would call on him. Fletcher isn't doing his job if he's not calling about every upgrade potentially available.

In a vacuum, sign me up in an instant. My issue is that someone is going to value him as an All Situations 1D type, which is not something that has reasonable numerical support. He's quite good offensively and sneakily average defensively. As a result, I probably don't want to be the high bidder, but there's definitely a world in which the Blues value some of "my" assets more highly than I do and I would pull the trigger.

I view him as a player who's just very good at everything. He's not a "shutdown" guy though I'd say he's a bit more than average defensively, but the way the game is played now it's really more about puck movement, mobility, and decision-making than even things like board play and presence. He absolutely gives you an upgrade in your own end and all the way up the ice from there. I'd consider him a less explosive Subban, if anything.

My main issue is the expiring contract after next season and the payday he'll be looking for. But if you're looking to inject a defenseman into your top 4, he's the best available by a mile.

This is where you might be able to get into mythical 3-way trade territory. The Leafs probably want Pietrangelo, but if they for some reason are out on that (and with monetary concerns they might be) you could be looking to move players that you'd be selling typically-like Simmonds and Gudas-and using them to soften the blow on your own prospect pool. Say you can convince Toronto to send Kapanen and a pick to St Louis in exchange for Gudas and Simmonds, and then you turn around and only have to contribute a couple of your own younger pieces to get it done. Compelling notion, right?

 

[BillDineen]

Ideally a vet top 4 D man would be to allow someone like Sanheim to develop, but with this backwards franchise, it would be just limiting his minutes even more.

 

[BackToTheBrierePatch]

Im not convinced having Chuck coach this team would change anything. Special teams still blow ass. He has to share the blame in some of that.

 

[Rich Nixon]

Im not convinced having Chuck coach this team would change anything. Special teams still blow ass. He has to share the blame in some of that.

...it's been 4 games, I think we give the GM a bit more than that before we start blaming him for the special teams.

 

[duffy9748]

These are always my favorite plans. Here, it's super easy. Just make 6 huge deals and everything is fixed. If I can figure it out, how dumb can they be?

What are you giving up for Tarasenko that St Louis would accept and would top all other offers?

How do you figure there would still be cap space to make significant additions? Are you taking back zero salary in a Voracek deal?

Is there a Defense? Or is that the answer to all of my other questions and Pavel Kubina is on a flight out here to retake his throne?

Next year’s salary cap is estimated at $83M. Remove the following off of next year’s payroll:

Lehterä
Simmonds
Weal
Raffl
Elliott
Neuvirth
Folin

———

That leaves a little over $31M in cap space heading into next year. Say you resign Konecny(6/5.5M) and Provorov(8/6.75M) long term. Resign Laughton(2/2.75). Sanheim takes a bridge deal at (2/2)That leaves around $15M left with this roster.

Giroux-Couturier-X
JVR-Patrick-Konecny
Lindblom-X-Voracek
Laughton-X-X
Weise

Provorov-Ghost
Sanheim-Gudas
Morin-Hagg
Macdonald

Hart/X
——————

Yes, Patrick and Lindblom are due for extensions the following offseason, but MacDonald, Weise, and Gudas are up and open an additional $10.7M. That would easily cover those two and leave additional money. It’s also likely the Flyers move some cap if they take on a big salary player this offseason.

If St. Louis is rebuilding and looking for futures, I don’t think anyone could beat what the Flyers could offer. I won’t make an offer but will just list pieces that could go for either Tarasenko OR Pietrangelo.

Morgan Frost
Joel Farabee
Phil Myers
Sam Morin
Robert Hagg
Jay O’Brien
Wade Allison
Mikhail Vorobyev
German Rubstov
Tanner Laczynski
Isaac Ratcliffe
Felix Sandstrom
2019 1st(Likely top 14)
2020 1st
2019 2nd
2020 2nd

Cap dumps would also be included in this deal, even though it isn’t necessary to fit them in. But that would open up additional cap room.
—————

So for example, say it was 3-4( 16 listed) of the pieces listed above+MacDonald for Tarasenko, that would leave this roster with $12M in cap space.

JVR-Giroux-Tarasenko
X-Couturier-Voracek
Lindblom-Patrick-Konecny
Laughton-X-X
Weise

Provorov-Ghost
Sanheim-X
Morin-Gudas
Hagg


Hart/X
————

That’s a roster you can very easily fill out through trades, free agency, and call ups and turn it into a cup contender. If you want to deal Voracek, like I suggested earlier, it makes things more complicated.

I personally don’t think you’d have to retain too much, if any, on Voracek. He consistently produces points and would be able to find a top line role somewhere and do the same. They could take back some salary in that deal, but it could be the salary of a player who could contribute. Voracek doesn't have negative value. He could definitely bring back a different top 9 forward or top 4 defenseman back in a trade if they went that route.

Gudas is also a player who may not finish out his contract here. Trade him for futures and then go out and acquire someone at a cap hit less than 5.5-6M in:

Parayko
Brodin
Muzzin
Martinez
Carolina Defenseman
—————

Fletcher has so many different ways he can go with this, you can’t really rule anything out as a possibility with the resources at his disposal.

 

[DrinkFightFlyers]

I would guess the ask on Crawford is around a 2 plus a solid but unspectacular prospect.

Quick I don't even want to hazard a guess, but as you said, the contract is just absurd -- 4 × 5.8 left, turning 33 next month. They're likely just going to ride that out.

I probably would be a ok with EITHER a 2nd OR a prospect. I just don't see him as that big of an upgrade to what we have. I'd rather trade a 2nd for someone to replace one of the dopes in the bottom six.

 

[Flyers Faithful]

Next year’s salary cap is estimated at $83M. Remove the following off of next year’s payroll:

Lehterä
Simmonds
Weal
Raffl
Elliott
Neuvirth
Folin

———

That leaves a little over $31M in cap space heading into next year. Say you resign Konecny(6/5.5M) and Provorov(8/6.75M) long term. Resign Laughton(2/2.75). Sanheim takes a bridge deal at (2/2)That leaves around $15M left with this roster.

Giroux-Couturier-X
JVR-Patrick-Konecny
Lindblom-X-Voracek
Laughton-X-X
Weise

Provorov-Ghost
Sanheim-Gudas
Morin-Hagg
Macdonald

Hart/X
——————

Yes, Patrick and Lindblom are due for extensions the following offseason, but MacDonald, Weise, and Gudas are up and open an additional $10.7M. That would easily cover those two and leave additional money. It’s also likely the Flyers move some cap if they take on a big salary player this offseason.

If St. Louis is rebuilding and looking for futures, I don’t think anyone could beat what the Flyers could offer. I won’t make an offer but will just list pieces that could go for either Tarasenko OR Pietrangelo.

Morgan Frost
Joel Farabee
Phil Myers
Sam Morin
Robert Hagg
Jay O’Brien
Wade Allison
Mikhail Vorobyev
German Rubstov
Tanner Laczynski
Isaac Ratcliffe
Felix Sandstrom
2019 1st(Likely top 14)
2020 1st
2019 2nd
2020 2nd

Cap dumps would also be included in this deal, even though it isn’t necessary to fit them in. But that would open up additional cap room.
—————

So for example, say it was 3-4( 16 listed) of the pieces listed above+MacDonald for Tarasenko, that would leave this roster with $12M in cap space.

JVR-Giroux-Tarasenko
X-Couturier-Voracek
Lindblom-Patrick-Konecny
Laughton-X-X
Weise

Provorov-Ghost
Sanheim-X
Morin-Gudas
Hagg


Hart/X
————

That’s a roster you can very easily fill out through trades, free agency, and call ups and turn it into a cup contender. If you want to deal Voracek, like I suggested earlier, it makes things more complicated.

I personally don’t think you’d have to retain too much, if any, on Voracek. He consistently produces points and would be able to find a top line role somewhere and do the same. If you have to retain $2M in salary, you open up another $6M in cap space to go after Panarin to replace Voracek.

Gudas is also a player who may not finish out his contract here. Trade him for futures and then go out and acquire someone at a cap hit less than 5.5-6M in:

Parayko
Brodin
Muzzin
Martinez
Carolina Defenseman
—————

Fletcher has so many different ways he can go with this, you can’t really rule anything out as a possibility with the resources at his disposal.

If Tarasenko gets traded anywhere but Philly it’ll be a crying shame, we have such a vast number of tradable prospects and assets there’s no way any other team can reasonably outbid us.

 

[JojoTheWhale]

I view him as a player who's just very good at everything. He's not a "shutdown" guy though I'd say he's a bit more than average defensively, but the way the game is played now it's really more about puck movement, mobility, and decision-making than even things like board play and presence. He absolutely gives you an upgrade in your own end and all the way up the ice from there. I'd consider him a less explosive Subban, if anything.

My main issue is the expiring contract after next season and the payday he'll be looking for. But if you're looking to inject a defenseman into your top 4, he's the best available by a mile.

This is where you might be able to get into mythical 3-way trade territory. The Leafs probably want Pietrangelo, but if they for some reason are out on that (and with monetary concerns they might be) you could be looking to move players that you'd be selling typically-like Simmonds and Gudas-and using them to soften the blow on your own prospect pool. Say you can convince Toronto to send Kapanen and a pick to St Louis in exchange for Gudas and Simmonds, and then you turn around and only have to contribute a couple of your own younger pieces to get it done. Compelling notion, right?

Of course. He's quite a good Defenseman and he has qualities that fit the modern game well.

I don't view a 3 way with Toronto as realistic because you would get cut out. They would find a way to be the one getting Pietrangelo if the adds are secondary. If they're not, you're paying in trade as if he's a top ~20 Defenseman, which if you believe that is fine, but there is absolutely no numerical support for putting him in that neighborhood.

There are definitely corner cases (like a 3 way as you suggested) where I could see it all adding up in my head. I just don't view it as particularly likely.

 

[RANKKA]

patrick and jake for tarasenko+, since patrick obviously is a bust lol

 

[duffy9748]

If Tarasenko gets traded anywhere but Philly it’ll be a crying shame, we have such a vast number of tradable prospects and assets there’s no way any other team can reasonably outbid us.

There just isn't any room for all of these prospects. Outside of some depth spots opening up in the next 2 summers, the majority of the roster is in place.

Fletcher said there are 20 players with NHL potential in the organization. You could trade 60% of your farm system and still have a mediocre prospect pool.

 

[BillDineen]

There just isn't any room for all of these prospects. Outside of some depth spots opening up in the next 2 summers, the majority of the roster is in place.

Fletcher said there are 20 players with NHL potential in the organization. You could trade 60% of your farm system and still have a mediocre prospect pool.

Volume is the reason you have to be continuously giving young players a legitimate shot. That is the No. 1 change that needs to occur.

 

[LegionOfDoom91]

What Homer & Scott should be doing with Fletcher right now.

 

[duffy9748]

Volume is the reason you have to be continuously giving young players a legitimate shot. That is the No. 1 change that needs to occur.

I have no issue giving young players a shot. There simply is only room for a few of these prospects though. Where do you see top 9 spots opening up for Farabee, O'Brien, Allison, Ratcliffe, etc.? Their better off being dealt for a top line player and sliding someone down the lineup. Strengthen the team that way.

 

[Flyers Faithful]

What’s everyone’s opinions on Justin Faulk?

 

[macleish1974]

Im strongly considering starting a GoFundMe for a #FireHakstol billboard.

I thought at first it was #GoF**KMe...sorry, I have enough problems as it is.

 

[JojoTheWhale]

Next year’s salary cap is estimated at $83M. Remove the following off of next year’s payroll:

Lehterä
Simmonds
Weal
Raffl
Elliott
Neuvirth
Folin

———

That leaves a little over $31M in cap space heading into next year. Say you resign Konecny(6/5.5M) and Provorov(8/6.75M) long term. Resign Laughton(2/2.75). Sanheim takes a bridge deal at (2/2)That leaves around $15M left with this roster.

Giroux-Couturier-X
JVR-Patrick-Konecny
Lindblom-X-Voracek
Laughton-X-X
Weise

Provorov-Ghost
Sanheim-Gudas
Morin-Hagg
Macdonald

Hart/X
——————

Yes, Patrick and Lindblom are due for extensions the following offseason, but MacDonald, Weise, and Gudas are up and open an additional $10.7M. That would easily cover those two and leave additional money. It’s also likely the Flyers move some cap if they take on a big salary player this offseason.

If St. Louis is rebuilding and looking for futures, I don’t think anyone could beat what the Flyers could offer. I won’t make an offer but will just list pieces that could go for either Tarasenko OR Pietrangelo.

Morgan Frost
Joel Farabee
Phil Myers
Sam Morin
Robert Hagg
Jay O’Brien
Wade Allison
Mikhail Vorobyev
German Rubstov
Tanner Laczynski
Isaac Ratcliffe
Felix Sandstrom
2019 1st(Likely top 14)
2020 1st
2019 2nd
2020 2nd

Cap dumps would also be included in this deal, even though it isn’t necessary to fit them in. But that would open up additional cap room.
—————

So for example, say it was 3-4( 16 listed) of the pieces listed above+MacDonald for Tarasenko, that would leave this roster with $12M in cap space.

JVR-Giroux-Tarasenko
X-Couturier-Voracek
Lindblom-Patrick-Konecny
Laughton-X-X
Weise

Provorov-Ghost
Sanheim-X
Morin-Gudas
Hagg


Hart/X
————

That’s a roster you can very easily fill out through trades, free agency, and call ups and turn it into a cup contender. If you want to deal Voracek, like I suggested earlier, it makes things more complicated.

I personally don’t think you’d have to retain too much, if any, on Voracek. He consistently produces points and would be able to find a top line role somewhere and do the same. They could take back some salary in that deal, but it could be the salary of a player who could contribute. Voracek doesn't have negative value. He could definitely bring back a different top 9 forward or top 4 defenseman back in a trade if they went that route.

Gudas is also a player who may not finish out his contract here. Trade him for futures and then go out and acquire someone at a cap hit less than 5.5-6M in:

Parayko
Brodin
Muzzin
Martinez
Carolina Defenseman
—————

Fletcher has so many different ways he can go with this, you can’t really rule anything out as a possibility with the resources at his disposal.

First, thank you for actually doing the math. It's good bit of work for a message board post, but it's impossible to really discuss without.

Ok, so first we're bridging Sanheim here. Obviously that helps in the short term even if it potentially hurts down the line.

In regard to Voracek, I agree that he's not a negative or anything like that, but because we're in a cap league, it can be extremely tough to find teams who think they're contenders with that much cap space burning a hole in their pocket for a Wing. Likely you would have to do some combination of taking back both money and term and/or Retaining. Ideally you would try to line that up with Sanheim's bridge expiring, but of course that's tricky.

Your numbers get you to ~12MM in space and the premise was also signing Panarin (with which I am completely on board). He's going to be in the 11 range, so figure that leaves you with a million plus the difference between Voracek's current cap hit and your return. If you still have Myers, that's your RD. A reasonable 1B type of UFA Goalie and ELCs for your other 3 Forwards and you might be able to squeeze it in there, but you can't make another Defensive addition of consequence (which again was the premise) unless you're kissing your next patch of RFAs goodbye.

You're also betting the franchise on Hart/Goalie Prospect of your choice to be ready immediately, but that's probably where they're headed, so I can't exactly chastise you for it.