GDT: GM #5 LA Kings vs Ottawa Senators @11:00AM 10/13/18

KingsFan7824

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Winning the Stanley Cup is never a bad thing, but failing to buy out Richards in the summer of 2014 was the beginning of the end.

Dean got too emotional about the players and their contributions. I know he called around and asked perennial champs in other sports how they maintained good performance over a long period of time. He probably should have only made one call, to Bill Belichick. Belichick hangs on to his best players, but is constantly reshaping his roster. Now that his best player is getting up there in age their run is probably over.

The Hickey pick was really the beginning of the end. If not Lewis. Without the end result, the pre-Cup Lombardi era would be completely ripped apart as incompetent. I can remember the Purcell trade debates. Why would you trade him, plus a pick, to get 0 goals from Halpern? That was the Versteeg trade before the Versteeg trade. Same way Penner would've been Lucic without the Cup. Penner was signed for the following season, but he couldn't score. Nobody could wait to see him leave before the 2012 playoffs. Him and Stoll actually.

Belichick is lucky Tom Brady ended up being Tom Brady. Nothing he's done would've been the same without the greatest QB of all time, who was drafted in the 6th round. Plus you can easily cut guys in the NFL, you can renegotiate contracts, and there's no singular player other than a goalie in hockey that comes close to the relevance that a QB has on a team. Even then, goalies don't have the puck, they just stop it. What's Belichick going to say? All you have to do is end up with maybe the greatest team sport professional athlete in North American history?
 

damacles1156

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Feb 5, 2010
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You guys still bitching about a system the Kings don't even play anymore ? This team hasn't played Kings hockey 2012-14 since 2015. There is ZERO intensity in their play, ZERO emotion.

Kings took Ottawa lightly and the Sens kicked the Kings teeth in for it. Throw this game in the garbage and move on.

Players acting like they did when they got Terry Murray fired.
 
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Little Psycho

I solemnly swear I'm up to no good
Feb 4, 2007
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Then why would you play him? He has been peppered with high amount of shots the last few games, wouldn't be surprised if he's a bit fatigued
 

damacles1156

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I am starting to understand why Sutter just really didn't say anything to the media. Stevens is airing-out all of his mental mistakes.
 

Sol

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Jun 30, 2017
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Then why would you play him? He has been peppered with high amount of shots the last few games, wouldn't be surprised if he's a bit fatigued



Wait. How is 4 games in 7 days not heavy for anyone ?

Stevens lol
 

Legionnaire

Help On The Way
Jul 10, 2002
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Lombardi believed that same thing after 2014.

I've said before, that 14 run will go down as a bad thing in the big picture. It was great as it happened, but Lombardi got caught up in it, and it ruined the franchise. If they go out looking the way they did in 4 or 5 to the Sharks, Richards is bought out, Greene is let go, Gaborik is let go, they don't trade what turned into the 2016 pick for Sekera, they don't trade the 2015 for Lucic. They would've had just the one run as the 8th seed, and then nothing else. There would've been a clearer picture of what Lombardi built. One hit wonder, got really hot for 20 games. It was a struggle in 2013. Maybe Kopitar gets traded before signing. Doubtful, but maybe.

Or, 2014 would've been fine, had they not had an emotional GM. They needed the Lombardi that he learned he should've been after all the post-2014 failures before all the post-2014 failures. Or, it would've been better to miss the playoffs in 2012, fire Lombardi and Sutter then, and bring in a GM that could actually build a good overall team that didn't require getting historically hot at the right time on two occasions.

Lombardi didn't want black hole hockey, but he ended up causing it. Sort of poetic really. A cautionary tale of best intentions.

:shakehead
 

Docgonzo

Triple Crown Line
Jan 9, 2010
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While I do believe the team has a lot of things to work on (almost everything, sadly). This game just screamed trap game, coming off shutting out Montreal in Montreal and the red hot Leafs on Monday. I could definitely see players overlooking a team that had an utterly chaotic offseason. But then it’s also on the coches to get them right.

And while I the PP looks bad since we can barely set it up, this isn’t exactly new. We've been complaining about the PP all the way back to Terry’s Murray days. At some point it has to be on the players. I think Kopitar should be separated, they just don’t work well together.
 

dechire

TBL Stanley Cup Champs 2020 2021
Jul 8, 2014
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Looks like JAD played pretty big minutes today. Glad to see him earning more trust from your coach. Is it looking more likely that he'll be staying with you guys past the 9 games ?
 

Eagle Fang

Less Defending, More Offending
Oct 12, 2005
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Looks like JAD played pretty big minutes today. Glad to see him earning more trust from your coach. Is it looking more likely that he'll be staying with you guys past the 9 games ?

In the games he's played so far, he's been one our of better forwards ( I don't know if that's good or bad). If he continues that, he should stay for sure.
 

Sacha Baron Corbin

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Jan 19, 2011
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Looks like JAD played pretty big minutes today. Glad to see him earning more trust from your coach. Is it looking more likely that he'll be staying with you guys past the 9 games ?

He absolutely deserves to stay up and stay in the lineup over Clifford and Thompson, so I 100% expect him to get sent down
 

Bandit

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Jul 23, 2005
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Lombardi believed that same thing after 2014.

I've said before, that 14 run will go down as a bad thing in the big picture. It was great as it happened, but Lombardi got caught up in it, and it ruined the franchise. If they go out looking the way they did in 4 or 5 to the Sharks, Richards is bought out, Greene is let go, Gaborik is let go, they don't trade what turned into the 2016 pick for Sekera, they don't trade the 2015 for Lucic. They would've had just the one run as the 8th seed, and then nothing else. There would've been a clearer picture of what Lombardi built. One hit wonder, got really hot for 20 games. It was a struggle in 2013. Maybe Kopitar gets traded before signing. Doubtful, but maybe.

Or, 2014 would've been fine, had they not had an emotional GM. They needed the Lombardi that he learned he should've been after all the post-2014 failures before all the post-2014 failures. Or, it would've been better to miss the playoffs in 2012, fire Lombardi and Sutter then, and bring in a GM that could actually build a good overall team that didn't require getting historically hot at the right time on two occasions.

Lombardi didn't want black hole hockey, but he ended up causing it. Sort of poetic really. A cautionary tale of best intentions.
Yeah, would have been way better if the Kings had only won one cup...
 

GoldenBearHockey

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Jan 6, 2014
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We definitely have a system , just a moronic one . I can agree with you on the bottom part but I also think some things are just to predictable and the coaches aren’t adapting and changing some things up. Also obviously Kopitar looks terrible again , Kovalchuk has skill and speed but he hasn’t been put in a position to succeed . That’s my opinion of course

About Kovalchuk? He;s put him with Kopitar and Iafallo, and on the PP#1, how is that not being put in a position to succeed?

I would agree with you if he was playing with Thompson and Clifford, but he's not, that makes no sense, that Stevens isnt putting Kovalchuk in a position to succeed
 

GoldenBearHockey

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Jan 6, 2014
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It's a combination of both to me. A good chunk of this roster is the same group that hasn't won anything in what is approaching five years. To me, Stevens is exactly like what the Penguins went through when they hired Mike Johnston after ousting Dan Bylsma.

They then hired Mike Sullivan and things changed dramatically for them with how they attack. Look at the difference in Tampa Bay with Jon Cooper versus that boring, garbage coaching of Guy Boucher. The difference is night and day.

A lot of things with this team has gotten stale, and that includes the players and the coach behind the bench.

A good chunk of this roster is also the same group that DID win in 2012, 2014, so saying it's the same group that didn't win, makes no difference.

As far as Cooper, look at the influx of talent, when he took over, he had Stamkos, an aging Lecavalier and St. Louis, and Hedman,
Next year, they add Palat, Johnson, Killorn, Kucherov
Year after, they add Stralman, Drouin etc,

Is it that Cooper is a better coach, or he was able to reap the benefits of adding more talent, vs Boucher.

I think it's a combination of both, you give Boucher the roster that Cooper had, and he probably succeeds better in Tampa.

I go back to what I said about this Kings roster/system, I think Stevens is trying to install a system that the players aren't familiar with, don't buy into it yet fully, and when that happens, you see the disconnect on the ice.

After the Detroit game, possibly after the Winnipeg game, I think it's EXTREMELY likely that Stevens had a meeting with the players, and told them not to worry about mistakes, to try and be creative, etc, that's why in the Winnipeg game, you started to see some blind passes to the middle, putting pucks to where there is space instead of tape to tape, etc, before, if Kings did that and a turnover happened, they got benched, so you saw it, they were playing rigid, tight, and afraid. The Winnipeg and Montreal game was much much more, loose, not as uptight, not saying they were better, but look at the ice time for the kids since Detroit game, I am talking about Amadio, JAD, mainly.

Detroit
Amadio - 9 shifts, 7:56
JAD - 9 shifts, 7:26

Winnipeg
Amadio - 11 shifts, 6:22
JAD - did not play,

This is where I think the meeting occured

Montreal
Amadio - 19 shifts, 13:16
JAD - 19 shifts, 11:51

Ottawa
Amadio - 20 shifts, 16:43
JAD - 20 shifts, 17:27

That is Stevens adjusting, trusting the kids a bit much, and they have reacted, they have played much better, results might not be there, but when you take it shift by shift, the idea for any youngster is to build on that shift, and that is what they are doing,

Also in the past 4 games,

Detroit
LAK - Giveaways - 12
Winnipeg
LAK - Giveaways - 11
Montreal
LAK - Giveaways - 21
Ottawa
LAK - Giveaways - 15

Completely uncharacteristic of the Sutter teams, but again, you can sense they are playing a bit looser.

As far as everyone complaining about PP entry, and breakouts, every single team in the league is running a version of the PP entry that LA has, the failure is in the execution, not the entry.

As far as breakouts, the breakout isn't the issue, it's the transistion game that is non-existent and that starts with guys like Muzzin, Forbort, and Martinez fumbling the puck, but also has a lot to do with out wingers not being in position etc When the D can make a solid transition pass, you will see the difference, when the wingers are in position you will see the difference.

Right now the game has evolved from short passes to 40-50 feet bomb passes/tip-ins from just above the red line to the far blueline, and the idea is to have 2 guys enter the zone with speed, problem is it's a simple counter, you drop 1 D back, and you have an active goaltender, that will thwart it 90% of the time, and again, the idea is to have a quick transition, and the Kings have none, and THAT is where you guys are seeing issues, not in coaching, not in "systems" etc.
 

kingsfan28

Its A Kingspiracy !
Feb 27, 2005
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What an awful game! They had no business losing this one, yet they looked like chumps today. Gotta love that 0-5 on the pp too. 0-19 an counting...
 

GoldenBearHockey

Registered User
Jan 6, 2014
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4 guys on the pp for 20 seconds is confusion.

Yes, no one said it wasn't, you know what else no one is doing,

Is taking one snippet from a game, and using it to say, that's how the entire season is...oh wait...maybe you are,

Do you truly believe that one snippet of a season should define the team, any team? Yea, didn't think so.
 

kingsfan28

Its A Kingspiracy !
Feb 27, 2005
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The fact that even after being out played in Montreal, and outplayed in every game, Stevens still decided the progress they had made as a team was "good enough" and didn't hold practice. Tells me he incapable of evaluating his team outside of the most basic statistics, and doesn't really know what his system should look like.


But the guys said it was one of the best off days they ever had. :nod:
 

Herby

Now I can die in peace
Feb 27, 2002
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I wouldn't go as far as saying it was a bad thing, I think @KingsFan7824 may have chosen his words poorly but his point is still correct about why we are in the spot we are in now. We are suffering today because of HORRENDOUS decisions made following the 2014 Stanley Cup win. None of what we are suffering with today is a result of any of the trades that went into winning the actual SC's, but what was done afterwards when a GM completely lost his mind and didn't see what was right in front of him. I still stand by that 2014-2017 was about as bad as you can possibly manage a team, and I think that is one of the reasons that DL has not been able to find work since then.

We can blame Stevens all we want, and he certainly deserves some blame, but the real reason the Kings aren't a good hockey team is because there have been so few really good players developed this decade. I mean who is the best player LA has drafted and developed this decade, Tyler Toffoli and Tanner Pearson? Come on guys, that is beyond pathetic.

A Vladimir Tarasenko or Kyle Connor in this lineup and things aren't nearly as hopeless.
 
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damacles1156

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Feb 5, 2010
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I'll take the two cups and these crappy seasons. You could be Sharks/Blues fan right now.

Even with a better roster on paper, the Kings will probably never be as good as 2012-2014 Kings teams in my lifetime.I got to witness both Cup victory's in person, wouldn't trade it for the world.

Odds are not in our favor to ever witness another Cup, even with a better roster.
 
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