German Football Part III

[Corto]

Let me put in another way: he wouldn't have gotten the job ahead of more deserving candidates if they weren't friends. You can express this as "familiarity with Kovac" or whatever - and obviously Salihamidzic has better friends who didn't get the job, so it wasn't the only criteria - but that was what put Kovac over the top for the job.

You see, the thing is, you don't know that. But you're saying it like you do.
Except you don't.

And that's the bit I have issues with.

 

[Deficient Mode]

You see, the thing is, you don't know that. But you're saying it like you do.
Except you don't.

And that's the bit I have issues with.

Whether they made him coach over more deserving candidates because they were familiar with him, or if they thought he was as qualified and capable as those others - either way they deserve harsh criticism.

 

[Corto]

Whether they made him coach over more deserving candidates because they were familiar with him, or if they thought he was as qualified and capable as those others - either way they deserve harsh criticism.

Who are these "more deserving" managers then? They were late on Tüchel, and the only other one in the conversation was Nagelsmann.
What Kovac has done with Eintracht is just as impressive as what Nagelsmann did with Hoffenheim. He took them from what looked like a club destined to be relegated to two high place finishes and their first trophy in 30 years (and another Cup final last season).

I do realize Nagelsmann is the "sexier" pick because he's like 14, but painting a picture that Kovac is 5 tiers below Nagelsmann (or any other German-speaking candidate that was in play) is ridiculous.
FWIW, its not like Kovac is 60, he's 46, which is pretty young for a manager.

And in the end, do you honestly think that Bayern would pick any manager currently available that they didn't think was the best for their club at the time?

 

[Deficient Mode]

Who are these "more deserving" managers then? They were late on Tüchel, and the only other one in the conversation was Nagelsmann.
What Kovac has done with Eintracht is just as impressive as what Nagelsmann did with Hoffenheim. He took them from what looked like a club destined to be relegated to two high place finishes and their first trophy in 30 years (and another Cup final last season).

I do realize Nagelsmann is the "sexier" pick because he's like 14, but painting a picture that Kovac is 5 tiers below Nagelsmann (or any other German-speaking candidate that was in play) is ridiculous.
FWIW, its not like Kovac is 60, he's 46, which is pretty young for a manager.

And in the end, do you honestly think that Bayern would pick any manager currently available that they didn't think was the best for their club at the time?

Where is this "late on Tuchel" stuff coming from? There were numerous reports that they were negotiating with him months before they announced Kovac or he ended up at PSG.

What Kovac has done at Eintracht is nowhere close to as impressive as what Nagelsmann has done at Hoffenheim. Speaking of ridiculous arguments. Nagelsmann averaged 12.5 more points in the Bundesliga per 34 matches over Kovac and started with a relegation side, too. Why would I care about age? Nagelsmann is simply the far better manager.

As I said, either way they deserve criticism. Not agreeing to terms with Tuchel, not prying Nagelsmann out of Hoffenheim hard enough, etc. Unlike cgf, I don't think Kovac is a nightmare manager anymore. Just far from Bayern's level.

 

[cgf]

Let's settle some of these myths. If Bayern's board weren't so full of themselves they could've had Tuchel long before PSG signed him. TT specifically didn't look at clubs abroad until after he found out he wouldn't get the Bayern job. Likewise, they could've had Nagelsmann if they didn't decide to do the dumb thing and bring in the guy they already know, the guy they know won't have a strong opinion of his own & will make a good patsy for the board.

So there were much better options available to them, even if they were only looking at german speaking coaches from the BuLi...even if I disagree with DM about Hassenhuttl being one of those better options as well. And pretending like their age is the only reason to hold such an opinion is just as disingenuous as me saying that y'all are only Kovac fans because he's a croat. Kovac is a worse choice because he's a worse coach, not because he's not as young. He's less tactically flexible, the tactics he does impliment aren't as sharp or extensive as TT or Nagelsmann's, and you can't even use the results as a defense for him since his results have been significantly less impressive than Nagelsmann or Tuchel's.

 

[Albatros]

you can't even use the results as a defense for him since his results have been significantly less impressive than Nagelsmann or Tuchel's.

Kovač won the cup like Tuchel, albeit in fewer seasons and with a worse team. Nagelsmann hasn't won anything.

 

[Bon Esprit]

Why don't you Favre/Kovac critics do a betting game. Who is getting sacked first? The winner gets Nagelsmann.

 

[cgf]

Kovač won the cup like Tuchel, albeit in fewer seasons and with a worse team. Nagelsmann hasn't won anything.

lol see how badly kovac apologists have to reach to defend their man for getting left behind in the dust by Nagelsmann again?

 

[Bon Esprit]

Apparently SC Freiburg are buying Luca Waldschmidt from HSV for 5m. Did Freiburg ever spend that muchmoney? Seriously asking.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

Will there be a broadcast of Dortmunds game in LA in the US?

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

Good, now bring in a starter at the position.

 

[Albatros]

lol see how badly kovac apologists have to reach to defend their man for getting left behind in the dust by Nagelsmann again?

I don't think that a reigning champion needs to apologize for anything. Veni, vidi, vici.

 

[TheMoreYouKnow]

For what it's worth, I'm pretty sure it's easier to win at Hoffenheim than at Eintracht Frankfurt. Considerably bigger wage budget there. Let's not forget, it's not too long ago that some people here doubted Kovac's ability to keep Frankfurt in the league. Finishing 8th and winning the Cup is a really good season for them in this day and age.

I'll be honest, I don't expect Kovac to succeed in Munich, but it wouldn't be the first time for him to surprise everyone and exceed expectations.

 

[sabremike]

Word over here is that Tyler Adams to Leipzig is a done deal but he will finish out the season here before heading to Deutschland. Knew he was gone after this season, I'm just glad he will stay for the full season and hopefully he leads us to that elusive title.

 

[Deficient Mode]

oooooh this news won't please @cgf



(Unless they're partners in Gladbach hmmmmm)

 

[cgf]

As long as PSG gives gladbach 40M for him, we're gucci. Need to find minutes for Cuisance, Benes & Neuhaus somehow

 

[Corto]

Where is this "late on Tuchel" stuff coming from? There were numerous reports that they were negotiating with him months before they announced Kovac or he ended up at PSG.

That's basically it, they were negotiating for a while, PSG came in with a money offer and then it was too late.
He was their #1 choice (and they reportedly inquired about Klopp as well).

What Kovac has done at Eintracht is nowhere close to as impressive as what Nagelsmann has done at Hoffenheim. Speaking of ridiculous arguments. Nagelsmann averaged 12.5 more points in the Bundesliga per 34 matches over Kovac and started with a relegation side, too. Why would I care about age? Nagelsmann is simply the far better manager.

Hoffenheim has twice the wage budget that Eintracht has though, to be fair.
For all the great work Nagelsmann's done , their board and their scouting has been bringing in the right players, it has to be said.
Getting a guy like Kramaric for next to nothing is inspired (though he'll likely be gone after the WC).
This doesn't take anything away from Nagelsmann, don't get me wrong, but they've had some top footballers in Hoffenheim in the last 2 years.

But even without going into comparison, you have to be blind not to see the work Kovac did with Eintracht, or how impressive it was.
Saved from relegation, then two high place finishes and two Cup finals, including a win over Bayern for freaking Eintracht Frankfurt...

We don't know whether Tuchel or Nagelsmann ever wanted to come at this point, or maybe were just swayed by money (Tuchel) or promises etc (Nagelsmann).
And I'm not saying Kovac is the next Cruyff or Michels here, just that in that current situation, knowing that negotiations with some other candidates fell through, picking him made as much sense as any other potential candidate.
And again, assigning blame and accusing people of this and that on the internet without actually knowing how the process went or even remotely what was happening and how it all went down... That's silly.

 

[cgf]

You are incorrect. Bayern could've had TT or Nagelsmann if they had wanted. I can't say for sure about Favre or anyone else, but I know for a fact that those two were waiting for the Bayern gig

And it’s a lot easier to bring in the right guys when your coach can teach anyone how to be useful...even reknowned dumb dumbs like Demirbay.

 

[Corto]

You are incorrect. Bayern could've had TT or Nagelsmann if they had wanted.

You don't actually know that. None of us do. All we have is speculations and conjecture.
And we have absolutely no clue how the negotiations (if there were any) went.

 

[Bon Esprit]

Hradecky to Leverkusen is done. Time for Leno to move on.

 

[Deficient Mode]

This doesn't take anything away from Nagelsmann, don't get me wrong, but they've had some top footballers in Hoffenheim in the last 2 years.

Most of them became top footballers at Hoffenheim, or improved dramatically. That's part of Nagelsmann's deal. Kramaric isn't the best example of that, but he certainly played much better at Hoffenheim than he did at Leicester.

 

[cgf]

You don't actually know that. None of us do. All we have is speculations and conjecture.
And we have absolutely no clue how the negotiations (if there were any) went.

That’s what I’m saying, this isn’t just conjecture, I have been told for a fact that Nagelsmann wouldn’t even talk to Dortmund about replacing Stöger because he was waiting for the Bayern job

 

[samabam]

Apparently SC Freiburg are buying Luca Waldschmidt from HSV for 5m. Did Freiburg ever spend that muchmoney? Seriously asking.

Mehmedi cost 6Million in 2014, Ravet 4.5 just last year

and now they got Dominique Heintz for 3 Million just today...Soyüncu replacement I guess...

 

[TheMoreYouKnow]

That’s what I’m saying, this isn’t just conjecture, I have been told for a fact that Nagelsmann wouldn’t even talk to Dortmund about replacing Stöger because he was waiting for the Bayern job

To be fair, unless he told you that himself..how is that not hearsay?

 

[cgf]

To be fair, unless he told you that himself..how is that not hearsay?

*shrug* that's what folks in BVB's PR department were told in the spring