Providence Bruins General Discussion thread IX

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DKH

The Bergeron of HF
Feb 27, 2002
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I trade vaak in 1 second for hall
Not me

1. How do they fit Hall Cap in

2. what’s your LD look like in 2-3 years if you trade Vaakanainen and Krug leaves

not trading a mid first who projects as a top 4 defenseman for years for 27-40 games of the enigma that is Taylor Hall

6+ years for 1/2 season. Hard pass
 
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DKH

The Bergeron of HF
Feb 27, 2002
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Would you trade Vakk for Tuch strait up?
Is Krug signed ?

how long is Chara staying?

Vaakanainen has top 4 ability and his offense is exploding in the AHL

I’m a Tuch guy - however, Vaakanainen is exempt from expansion draft

By age 22-23 he should be in the top 4 of any elite team

Senyshyn plays RW

Tuch certainly is interesting but with Senyshyn close and the uncertainty of Krug, Chara, and Vaakanainen skills I keep him
 

Montecristo

Registered User
Jul 29, 2012
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Not me

1. How do they fit Hall Cap in

2. what’s your LD look like in 2-3 years if you trade Vaakanainen and Krug leaves

not trading a mid first who projects as a top 4 defenseman for years for 27-40 games of the enigma that is Taylor Hall

6+ years for 1/2 season. Hard pass

1. The cap is the trickiest part. Maybe if you include studnicka and a conditional 1st they’d take backes as well. The condition would be that hall needs to resign. You don’t make this trade unless you are resigning him.
2: the left d still has lauzon grzcelyk, zboril, And Krug potentially. You could always trade a now semi expendable debrusk in a 1-1 for a top 4 lhd as well. But 2-3 years doesn’t matter as much. This team will have holes all over in 2-3 years. I don’t hold my breath on Marchand and Bergeron being as impactful in 2-3 years time. Chara is gone. Rask is maybe gone. This team needs to win in the next year or 2. In 2-3 they are pretty much hosed anyway. They’ll just have pastrnak and debrusk currently as forwards who wouldn’t have likely regressed, then just a bunch of middle 6 filler like bjork studnicka, steen, etc. they aren’t a cup team after 2021 for like 6 more years
 

Tbaybruin

Registered User
Feb 2, 2016
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Great take. I really believe they need to figure out the Krug and Grizz deals sooner than later. The only reason I might do the deal is our 2 year window is so great. This team is so close. Also I think Zaboril and Lauzon have to clear waivers next year witch might make it hard to bring up Vakk since he is exempt.

 
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DKH

The Bergeron of HF
Feb 27, 2002
73,961
51,460
1. The cap is the trickiest part. Maybe if you include studnicka and a conditional 1st they’d take backes as well. The condition would be that hall needs to resign. You don’t make this trade unless you are resigning him.
2: the left d still has lauzon grzcelyk, zboril, And Krug potentially. You could always trade a now semi expendable debrusk in a 1-1 for a top 4 lhd as well. But 2-3 years doesn’t matter as much. This team will have holes all over in 2-3 years. I don’t hold my breath on Marchand and Bergeron being as impactful in 2-3 years time. Chara is gone. Rask is maybe gone. This team needs to win in the next year or 2. In 2-3 they are pretty much hosed anyway. They’ll just have pastrnak and debrusk currently as forwards who wouldn’t have likely regressed, then just a bunch of middle 6 filler like bjork studnicka, steen, etc. they aren’t a cup team after 2021 for like 6 more years
You just said include Studnicka and a conditional 1st they take Backes as well

Do you are proposing

vaakanainen Studnicka a 1 If they take Backes for Taylor Hall 1/2 year and a UFA
 

Montecristo

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Jul 29, 2012
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You just said include Studnicka and a conditional 1st they take Backes as well

Do you are proposing

vaakanainen Studnicka a 1 If they take Backes for Taylor Hall 1/2 year and a UFA

The 1 is if he resigns. This would be a stone to Vegas type deal. We would have to know ahead of time we can sign him long term. If we do then they get the 1. If we don’t then they don’t get the 1
 

neelynugs

Registered User
Feb 27, 2002
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You just said include Studnicka and a conditional 1st they take Backes as well

Do you are proposing

vaakanainen Studnicka a 1 If they take Backes for Taylor Hall 1/2 year and a UFA

i'm with you danny boy. NFW i trade vaak or studnicka (or beecher).
bruins have enough assets to figure out a RW upgrade without moving
guys who will be key roster pieces for 10 years.

lauzon or zboril goes. donny loves trading picks, too.
 

Son of Donegal

Stay-at-home defenseman with zero upside.
Aug 1, 2008
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The thing about Hall is...it's like a 50/50 shot he has a major injury between now and the playoffs.

Also, the Bruins don't NEED another #1LW to compete.

They NEED a competitive, reliable #2RW...or at least a right-shot C with versatility.

Save your assets on Hall.

Spend less on a RW or a Righ handed C who can play wing.

Here are some options that could be had for less.

JG Pageau (UFA - $3.1M) imagine him with Bergeron and Marchand.
Mikael Granlund (1UFA - $5.75M)
Craig Smith (1UFA - $4.25M)
Kyle Palmieri (2UFA - $$4.65M)
Josh Andersen (1RFA -$1.85M)
Brandon Saad (2UFA - $6m)
 

Montecristo

Registered User
Jul 29, 2012
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The thing about Hall is...it's like a 50/50 shot he has a major injury between now and the playoffs.

Also, the Bruins don't NEED another #1LW to compete.

They NEED a competitive, reliable #2RW...or at least a right-shot C with versatility.

Save your assets on Hall.

Spend less on a RW or a Righ handed C who can play wing.

Here are some options that could be had for less.

JG Pageau (UFA - $3.1M) imagine him with Bergeron and Marchand.
Mikael Granlund (1UFA - $5.75M)
Craig Smith (1UFA - $4.25M)
Kyle Palmieri (2UFA - $$4.65M)
Josh Andersen (1RFA -$1.85M)
Brandon Saad (2UFA - $6m)

I’d happily take Anderson over Hall but the ask will be high for him as well. Not sure pageau will be worth it he’s like this years dzingel. Regardless Any of those names other than maybe Anderson won’t help Boston in the playoffs as much as hall would despite them filling more of a need
 

DKH

The Bergeron of HF
Feb 27, 2002
73,961
51,460
The 1 is if he resigns. This would be a stone to Vegas type deal. We would have to know ahead of time we can sign him long term. If we do then they get the 1. If we don’t then they don’t get the 1

I can’t deal Vaakanainen or Studnicka

they are both vital to long term

the D is set up spectacularly going forward

vaakanainen should be ready after next season (September 2021 a good 20 months from now and 100+ professional games be ready to take over for Chara next to McAvoy)

I expect him bigger and stronger beyond the experience

Vaakanainen-McAvoy
Krug/Grzelcyk-Carlo

gives you one outstanding top 4

Studnicka is vital to the center group

I love his game and my vision is he & DeBrusk will mesh very well on a second line

I see DeBrusk as that Mike Hoffman type second line sniper and Studnicka is well rounded - sees the ice well can pass win draws

he looks like he came out of Bruins Fax

I’ve watched skilled forwards the Ratelle, Bucyk, Armstrong, Francis, Recchi, Jagr etc play into their late 30’s at a high rate

no reason Bergeron and OR Krejci can’t play well to ages 35, 36 even 37 and facilitate between Pastrnak & Marchand

Marchand will play
2020-21 at 32
2021-22 at 33
2022-23 at 34
2023-24 at 35

I’m not thinking he’s done in a few years

Pastrnak will be entering his age 27 year

spitballing with only using their current guys in 3 years

Marchand-Bergeron-Pastrnak
DeBrusk-Studnicka-Heinen
Bjork-Coyle-Senyshyn
Frederic-Beecher- Lauko

Vaakanainen -McAvoy
Krug-Carlo
Grzelcyk-Clifton
Lauzon/Zboril - Anderson

that is a young team

and I don’t discount Krejci still being around
 

Son of Donegal

Stay-at-home defenseman with zero upside.
Aug 1, 2008
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I’d happily take Anderson over Hall but the ask will be high for him as well. Not sure pageau will be worth it he’s like this years dzingel. Regardless Any of those names other than maybe Anderson won’t help Boston in the playoffs as much as hall would despite them filling more of a need

Pageau is a far more proven player than Dzingel. He gets the job done, year-in, year-out, is an excellent two way player and can score clutch goals. He killed the Bruins in the 2017 playoffs.

The idea would be to keep Pastrnak with Krejci and DeBrusk and let Pageau ride with Marchand and Bergeron. He also provides a stop-gap if one of Bergeron or Krejci gets hurt at C.

Taylor Hall is an elite player, but I just don't love the idea of overpaying for a pure rental to fill a position we are already strong at...especially with the type of year he is having, coming off of a season lost to injury.

I take a hard pass on Hall unless his price is more affordable.

Kyle Palmeiri is having a arguably better season than Hall, would be less expensive, fills a positional need and is a proven goal scorer with a big body.

All of this being said, deadline trades almost never meet expectations. It always seems to be the "lesser" player finding a good fit over the Star coming in and dealing with pressure of a new market.

Look at Marcus Johansson and Charlie Coyle.

Go get Pageau, Donny.
 

BruinsFanSince94

The Perfect Fan ™
Sep 28, 2017
32,709
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New England
Yeah for the rest of the league maybe ha. People seem to forget that Taylor hall is good and vaak and stud will never be as good as hall is. Also he’d be the perfect winger for krejci

No. Your suggestions are frightening for the Bruins because they're terrible 99.9% of the time. Vaakanainen is a defenseman so I don't know how you can really compare the two. You're literally suggesting to trade our two best prospects for a few months of Taylor Hall.
 

Fenian24

Registered User
Jun 14, 2010
10,321
13,302
Ok there are actually people making a pro Vaak argument that I respect their opinions but let me ask 2 simple questions.

1- is Vaak guaranteed to be a top 4 D? Why can't he regress instead of continue to approve? Injuries should not be a factor because using that logic they do not take Pasta due to concussion history, also a player can suffer a career altering injury at any point so the Hall is hurt all the time argument isn't really a deal breaker.

2-LW, RW,C does Taylor Hall, an MVP candidate and winner two years ago, give the Bruins a better chance at winning the cup this year or does Vaak?
 

Montecristo

Registered User
Jul 29, 2012
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No. Your suggestions are frightening for the Bruins because they're terrible 99.9% of the time. Vaakanainen is a defenseman so I don't know how you can really compare the two. You're literally suggesting to trade our two best prospects for a few months of Taylor Hall.

Under the assumption hall resigns long term
 

Son of Donegal

Stay-at-home defenseman with zero upside.
Aug 1, 2008
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Ok there are actually people making a pro Vaak argument that I respect their opinions but let me ask 2 simple questions.

1- is Vaak guaranteed to be a top 4 D? Why can't he regress instead of continue to approve? Injuries should not be a factor because using that logic they do not take Pasta due to concussion history, also a player can suffer a career altering injury at any point so the Hall is hurt all the time argument isn't really a deal breaker.

2-LW, RW,C does Taylor Hall, an MVP candidate and winner two years ago, give the Bruins a better chance at winning the cup this year or does Vaak?

For me, this is less about moving Vaakanainen and more about avoiding the trap of overpaying for top-level rentals. History shows that adding complimentary players like Mark Recchi and Rich Peverley can have a greater impact than adding players like Tomas Kaberle! Over the past 10 years there has only been one deal involving a top line player that has panned out as planned. In 2014, CBJ traded Marion Gaborik to LAK for 4th liner Matt Frattin, a 2nd and a 3rd. Talk about a steal. Gaborik went on to lead the Kings in goals en route to the cup.

Aside from him, cup winners have made the following deadline moves...

2009- PIT - Chris Kunitz
2010- CHI - Nick Boynton
2011 - BOS - Peverley, Kelly, Kaberle
2012 - LAK - Jeff Carter (who was average for LAK the year of the trade.)
2013 - CHI - Michal Handzus
2014 - LAK - Gaborik
2015 - CHI - Vermette
2016 - PIT - Hagelin, Daley
2017 - PIT - Streit, Hainsey
2018 - WAS - Kempny
2019 - STL - Del Zotto

So, there really isn't much precedence for success, as it relates to giant deadline deals. The Bruins have a very strong team. They could use a piece or two at max.

Now, if the price for Hall comes down and the Bruins can get him for less, sure. But, I would have measured expectations for him based on a) his varied health, b) his off-year, c) short period of time to gel with teammates and d) the fact that the Bruins are still in need of a RW! What is the NET impact of adding Hall versus a less expensive RW? Also, keep in mind, DeBrusk has been heating up.

Bottom line, I am not interested in moving our very best assets for a short-term rental unless that player has proven that he is a winner in the playoffs at the NHL level.

I would much rather move expendable parts for someone who can plug in, play alongside excellent talent, contribute and be a good teammate.
 

bb74

Thanks for Everything Bill
Sep 24, 2003
4,146
1,222
Cuttyhunk
1. The cap is the trickiest part. Maybe if you include studnicka and a conditional 1st they’d take backes as well. The condition would be that hall needs to resign. You don’t make this trade unless you are resigning him.
2: the left d still has lauzon grzcelyk, zboril, And Krug potentially. You could always trade a now semi expendable debrusk in a 1-1 for a top 4 lhd as well. But 2-3 years doesn’t matter as much. This team will have holes all over in 2-3 years. I don’t hold my breath on Marchand and Bergeron being as impactful in 2-3 years time. Chara is gone. Rask is maybe gone. This team needs to win in the next year or 2. In 2-3 they are pretty much hosed anyway. They’ll just have pastrnak and debrusk currently as forwards who wouldn’t have likely regressed, then just a bunch of middle 6 filler like bjork studnicka, steen, etc. they aren’t a cup team after 2021 for like 6 more years

are you the ghost of seasons past of Mike O’Connell or something? This is horrible!
 
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