GDT: Game 48: Coyotes @ Blues - 6 PM - FSAZ

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drgregg

SLAP CHOP
Jun 7, 2012
1,130
100
as seen on TV
I have read this narrative all season and it is nonsense. At the beginning of the season our offence consisted of Stephan, a bunch of children and a bunch of borderline fourth liners.
This meant that pretty much every single one of these players was was being asked to play a greater role than they would ordinarily. It should surprise no one that that group would stumble out of the gate. Follow that up with abhorrent goaltending and a bottom defence pairing of 2 ahlers and you don’t need to be a brilliant prognosticator to see that there is an excellent likelihood that we would be in for a bad time.
Big Dave was right, we had no vet forwards worth a damn last year, so we could bid them all adios without shedding too many tears. However, restocking that group in a single offseason is too tall of an order.
 

drgregg

SLAP CHOP
Jun 7, 2012
1,130
100
as seen on TV
I know he is no one’s favourite, but getting a top 6 centre who actually needs to shave in Stephan was a good start. Adding Panik, a top 9 winger who can drink legally is another step in the right direction. At least another top 9 (preferably top 6) player is needed, but we probably won’t be able to add him until the offseason.
 
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BUX7PHX

Registered User
Jul 7, 2011
5,581
1,350
I have read this narrative all season and it is nonsense. At the beginning of the season our offence consisted of Stephan, a bunch of children and a bunch of borderline fourth liners.
This meant that pretty much every single one of these players was was being asked to play a greater role than they would ordinarily. It should surprise no one that that group would stumble out of the gate. Follow that up with abhorrent goaltending and a bottom defence pairing of 2 ahlers and you don’t need to be a brilliant prognosticator to see that there is an excellent likelihood that we would be in for a bad time.
Big Dave was right, we had no vet forwards worth a damn last year, so we could bid them all adios without shedding too many tears. However, restocking that group in a single offseason is too tall of an order.

This single sentence sums up the reason why it has been brought up - this is nothing different than expected or what has been seen in the past. Petr Prucha was on one of our top lines in the 09-10 season. Scottie Upshall. Matthew Lombardi. Hanzal as a de facto #1 C. Yandle as a true top pairing D. You could look at every single player and with the exceptions of maybe Whitney, Jovo, and Doan - all players had to play above their value, to some degree.

It's not a guess as to what has happened. The same thing that you are frustrated about is the same thing that people recognized as our time for struggles with Tippett in charge. People wanted to believe that the reason was b/c of Tippett and Tippett alone, when we can trace it back to the exact reason - every single one of our players over a far greater amount of time than just this year has been asked to play at a higher level. The difference is that when it started to fail in the 14-15 season, people put it square on the coach. It was convenient to ignore that we had the same issues that you are arguing - a lack of talent, a defense that continued to get weaker players to complement the team, and players who lacked experience, in general. Now, with a different coach who was supposed to change this, we look just the same as ever, and actually appear worse.

I doubt that anyone expected us to be a significantly better team, but if we are being honest, did anyone expect to take a step back as much as we did this year? We became a little less experienced with additions of Keller and Fischer, yet became so much more experienced through adding Hjalmarsson, Stepan and Demers. At some point, we have to call a spade a spade. That is for the players that have been weaker (honestly, Stepan hasn't been great, but he hasn't been as bad as people think, either), as well as the organizational roles (we need to see better team performances from the team as relates to the coaching and following the gameplan, which I think we have seen since the Duclair trade, tbh).

I am not happy with the progression thus far, but the second half of the season provides the opportunity to progress, so we'll go from there.
 

Jakey53

Registered User
Aug 27, 2011
29,977
9,038
This single sentence sums up the reason why it has been brought up - this is nothing different than expected or what has been seen in the past. Petr Prucha was on one of our top lines in the 09-10 season. Scottie Upshall. Matthew Lombardi. Hanzal as a de facto #1 C. Yandle as a true top pairing D. You could look at every single player and with the exceptions of maybe Whitney, Jovo, and Doan - all players had to play above their value, to some degree.

It's not a guess as to what has happened. The same thing that you are frustrated about is the same thing that people recognized as our time for struggles with Tippett in charge. People wanted to believe that the reason was b/c of Tippett and Tippett alone, when we can trace it back to the exact reason - every single one of our players over a far greater amount of time than just this year has been asked to play at a higher level. The difference is that when it started to fail in the 14-15 season, people put it square on the coach. It was convenient to ignore that we had the same issues that you are arguing - a lack of talent, a defense that continued to get weaker players to complement the team, and players who lacked experience, in general. Now, with a different coach who was supposed to change this, we look just the same as ever, and actually appear worse.

I doubt that anyone expected us to be a significantly better team, but if we are being honest, did anyone expect to take a step back as much as we did this year? We became a little less experienced with additions of Keller and Fischer, yet became so much more experienced through adding Hjalmarsson, Stepan and Demers. At some point, we have to call a spade a spade. That is for the players that have been weaker (honestly, Stepan hasn't been great, but he hasn't been as bad as people think, either), as well as the organizational roles (we need to see better team performances from the team as relates to the coaching and following the gameplan, which I think we have seen since the Duclair trade, tbh).

I am not happy with the progression thus far, but the second half of the season provides the opportunity to progress, so we'll go from there.

Great post, and you hit the nail on the head.:nod:
 

_Del_

Registered User
Jul 4, 2003
15,425
6,736
We are literally seven points behind last year at game 48. Seven. Despite losing the greatest coach of all time, the world's best goaltender, and the greatest captain ever who admitted he mailed it in for two years. Seven. You might have to reevaluate.
Five at 49 games played...
 
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Jakey53

Registered User
Aug 27, 2011
29,977
9,038
Five at 49 games played...

You keep on bringing up last years pts. vs this year. With a rebuilding team it's not all about pts. rather how the kids are developing and maturing and the team play overall. IF, you want to just talk pts. this team should be way ahead of last years totals, especially when you add in the maturity of the kids and increasing our talent level by bringing in Demer, Hammer and Stepan. By being close or behind last years totals is nothing to be proud about. We should be sniffing for a playoff spot.
 

_Del_

Registered User
Jul 4, 2003
15,425
6,736
I'm just saying the team playing more kids (which is automatically bad for your record according to rationalizing last year), with the worst coach ever who puts noone in a position to succeed, who should be immediately fired, who coaches no system, playing pond hockey, with a ten game stretch of AHL goaltending, no regulation wins in the first 20, minus our core and very important leadership players, with a lower payroll and massive turnover has still managed to be only five points behind where the best coach in the world who should have never been fired *cough* i mean "quit" *wink, wink, nudge, nudge* who also had great goaltending and the game's best system had us last year at game 49.
Five point swing. That's curious to me. Makes me think not all of that is true.
 
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