GDT: Game #43 San Jose SHARKS @ Chicago Blackhawks 5 Jan 2014 5:00pm PST NBCS WGN KFox

[richo]

Bold prediction...Stalock wins the job in the playoffs and leads us to the cup while winning the Conn Smythe! (Cam Ward 2.0)

I would LOVE this. Niemi does not inspire any confidence in me. Being a former goalie it's been easy to figure out his style - simply fall down and hope for the best. He's so big that this works a lot. Most of his “big” saves are just sheer luck. But if you just shoot high or through his legs and you will score on him consistently. Shootouts show this. Also, is there any other goalie that gives up such horrible rebounds on a consistent basis. I won't even go into his woeful puckhandling skills.

 

[Gene Parmesan]

I would LOVE this. Niemi does not inspire any confidence in me. Being a former goalie it's been easy to figure out his style - simply fall down and hope for the best. He's so big that this works a lot. Most of his “big†saves are just sheer luck. But if you just shoot high or through his legs and you will score on him consistently. Shootouts show this. Also, is there any other goalie that gives up such horrible rebounds on a consistent basis. I won't even go into his woeful puckhandling skills.

Stalock also gives up monster rebounds but the Sharks did a good job of tying up sticks and clearing pucks. For all the bluster I hear of Stalock's puck skills..he doesn't look particularly great at it. He's better than Niemi at it but that's not saying much. I'd go with the guy that carried the Sharks last year when they couldn't score and was lights out in the playoffs. Stalock is a good back up to Niemi.

 

[DarrylshutzSydor]

I've been in a great mood ever since the 49ers game, but that Sharks game was probably a much more entertaining game for me. I thought they would kind of lay an egg this game, considering the game yesterday, the travel, and the fact that they don't do well (Or match up well) against the Hawks and the Hawks are reigning champions. To find out that Stalock was getting this opportunity, and then to watch him not waste it and show that yeah he is a pretty good back up goaltender was just fun to watch. I remember when Stalock had a bad game and I read posts on here saying he shouldn't get another start, or at least that's not how T'Mac operates. If there's one thing I hope that comes out of this start (Actually, two things), it's I want to see him start against Nashville as a reward, and I want to see him get more opportunities. Yeah Niemi is our goaltender and we'll ride him through the postseason, but you can't deny Stalock the chances anymore. Tonight's win should reward him with more shots than what he's been getting.

As for the officiating, I feel about this game the same way I felt about the 49ers game. Things are in the rules, sure, but as long as you call things both ways, I'm fine with it. In fact, I liked the old school feel of both games, where the Refs weren't the story and they allowed the teams to play. It made for a very entertaining hockey game.

One thing about the Announcers. Does McGuire have a Towes fetish, sure, but I think that might be overstated. I loved tonight's broadcast, mainly because I love Doc Emrick and I love the tangents he goes on but both of them were really good tonight. I'm glad to hear Doc call a Sharks game, something that doesn't happen nearly enough and I was entertained throughout.

I can't stand NURSE Emrick. In fact I will watch the game on mute if he is the play by play announcer.

 

[hohosaregood]

Stalock also gives up monster rebounds but the Sharks did a good job of tying up sticks and clearing pucks. For all the bluster I hear of Stalock's puck skills..he doesn't look particularly great at it. He's better than Niemi at it but that's not saying much. I'd go with the guy that carried the Sharks last year when they couldn't score and was lights out in the playoffs. Stalock is a good back up to Niemi.

The rebounds that Stalock has been giving up just look like the ones that are typical of the style.

If you look on YouTube, stalock actually has a few videos that are purely focused on his puck play and its pretty impressive to say the least. I have a feeling that he hasn't put it into use at the NHL level yet because that aspect of his skill set hasn't been integrated into the system yet.

 

[OrrNumber4]

I think with Stalock...the team is not really invested in his development. They don't see him as "the answer" going forwards, so they don't feel the need to give him playing time based on his needs alone. He's merely a stop-gap; someone to give Niemi a breather once and awhile.

If a young goalie really came in and showed he had potential as a future Niemi-replacement, I think that the team, even in win-now mode, would be more inclined to give him more time.

 

[Herschel]

I would LOVE this. Niemi does not inspire any confidence in me. Being a former goalie it's been easy to figure out his style - simply fall down and hope for the best. He's so big that this works a lot. Most of his “big†saves are just sheer luck. But if you just shoot high or through his legs and you will score on him consistently. Shootouts show this. Also, is there any other goalie that gives up such horrible rebounds on a consistent basis. I won't even go into his woeful puckhandling skills.

I don't want to hijack this thread but is Niemi even considereed big by NHL standards? All I did was look up his height 6-2 and I am going to assume that is very average, but I might be wrong.

I also think that in today's NHL position play and quick feet are the two biggest keys to success in the crease.

IMO Niemi needs to play better but I am not worried with him in the net.

 

[SJSharks42]

lol I cannot believe this board sometimes. Nemo has an off stretch of games and suddenly Stalock is going to save us and win us a Cup. Calm down you chuckleheads.

 

[hohosaregood]

lol I cannot believe this board sometimes. Nemo has an off stretch of games and suddenly Stalock is going to save us and win us a Cup. Calm down you chuckleheads.

What if I've always liked Stalock and I'm just really excited that he's played well in the last couple weeks?

 

[Juxtaposer]

I think with Stalock...the team is not really invested in his development. They don't see him as "the answer" going forwards, so they don't feel the need to give him playing time based on his needs alone. He's merely a stop-gap; someone to give Niemi a breather once and awhile.

If a young goalie really came in and showed he had potential as a future Niemi-replacement, I think that the team, even in win-now mode, would be more inclined to give him more time.

I have the same feeling, much as I love Al and want him to succeed.

 

[Negatively Positive]

When Niemi's contract is up he might be asking for 6 mill(thanks Crawford) so if the Sharks don't wanna pay that much for a goalie, shouldn't they try to groom a cheaper replacement just in case?

 

[richo]

lol I cannot believe this board sometimes. Nemo has an off stretch of games and suddenly Stalock is going to save us and win us a Cup. Calm down you chuckleheads.

My comment is not a comment on recent play by Niemi, but go back even to his Chicago days. I just don't post very often and get tired of how many non-goalies praise Niemi so much without really knowing what it is that makes a good goalie. Not sure if Stalock is the answer. He looked good yesterday and earlier against Ottawa, but given more playing time may be able to show us more. I do agree however that this is unlikely to happen.

 

[Oppa]

Niemi's gonna go someday, so I'd rather have a fanbase that's confident in the assumed successor

 

[OrrNumber4]

When Niemi's contract is up he might be asking for 6 mill(thanks Crawford) so if the Sharks don't wanna pay that much for a goalie, shouldn't they try to groom a cheaper replacement just in case?

Sure, but that doesn't meant that Stalock is that goalie. Perhaps the Sharks's brass is looking at him and going "not good enough"...

My comment is not a comment on recent play by Niemi, but go back even to his Chicago days. I just don't post very often and get tired of how many non-goalies praise Niemi so much without really knowing what it is that makes a good goalie. Not sure if Stalock is the answer. He looked good yesterday and earlier against Ottawa, but given more playing time may be able to show us more. I do agree however that this is unlikely to happen.

So your experience as a goalie in some minor or beer league somewhere is what gives you the special insight in to what makes a good goalie at the NHL level?

Your ideas of what makes a goalie good or bad at the NHL level may have merit, but they don't gain any merit whatsever because they come from someone who plays goal.

 

[Pinkfloyd]

Niemi's gonna go someday, so I'd rather have a fanbase that's confident in the assumed successor

I would've been fine with him getting traded for value this past off-season but understood it was not going to happen due to just how good he was. However, to me, goalies are a lot more product of the system and very replaceable. The Sharks especially should put more faith and value in developing their own goalies to keep it cheap yet experienced in their system. They've basically dropped that since Strelow died. Haven't developed one that has taken over since their trio of 2003.

 

[SactoShark]

Jumbo's pass to Al was pretty great. I guess he's got at least that much confidence in Stalock.

 

[OrrNumber4]

I would've been fine with him getting traded for value this past off-season but understood it was not going to happen due to just how good he was. However, to me, goalies are a lot more product of the system and very replaceable. The Sharks especially should put more faith and value in developing their own goalies to keep it cheap yet experienced in their system. They've basically dropped that since Strelow died. Haven't developed one that has taken over since their trio of 2003.

I think it is both ways. You want goalies who have skills who can fit into your system..a system that hides your goalies weaknesses and whose own flaws are hidden by the goalie. Nabakov was probably a more talented goalie, but he never got into the same rhythm with the team that Niemi has.

Even if you say that a lot of goalies could fit that bill, until you get the goalie that fits, you're going to lose a lot of hockey games. Rolling the dice on a goalie, hoping that he can fit and everything meshes...if that fails, it results in a lot of games lost, since the goalie is such an important position. Heck, the Sharks lost the 2003 season when they handed the reigns to Kiprusoff...and they lost the 2007 playoffs when they handed it to an injured Toskala.

 

[Tkachuk4MVP]

I would've been fine with him getting traded for value this past off-season but understood it was not going to happen due to just how good he was. However, to me, goalies are a lot more product of the system and very replaceable. The Sharks especially should put more faith and value in developing their own goalies to keep it cheap yet experienced in their system. They've basically dropped that since Strelow died. Haven't developed one that has taken over since their trio of 2003.

While I generally agree with your thoughts re: goalies being more of a product of the team, to think that anyone from our pipeline could've just stepped in and played as well as Niemi did last year is a little misguided. On paper our defense was very average when Murray was still in the lineup on a regular basis, and Nemo was great despite that. Plus it's not as if he's making Rinne or Lundqvist money, he's on a good deal for what he brings.

 

[Arrch]

Jumbo's pass to Al was pretty great. I guess he's got at least that much confidence in Stalock.

I enjoyed that. I wonder if Stalock called for it or if Jumbo did it on his own.

Niemi probably would have froze the puck after receiving the pass.

 

[Pinkfloyd]

I think it is both ways. You want goalies who have skills who can fit into your system..a system that hides your goalies weaknesses and whose own flaws are hidden by the goalie. Nabakov was probably a more talented goalie, but he never got into the same rhythm with the team that Niemi has.

Even if you say that a lot of goalies could fit that bill, until you get the goalie that fits, you're going to lose a lot of hockey games. Rolling the dice on a goalie, hoping that he can fit and everything meshes...if that fails, it results in a lot of games lost, since the goalie is such an important position. Heck, the Sharks lost the 2003 season when they handed the reigns to Kiprusoff...and they lost the 2007 playoffs when they handed it to an injured Toskala.

Nabokov's problem with the team was more of a mental thing than a physical thing. You can think of a goalie like a coach. If you believe in him, they play better for him and when they don't, they don't play as well. The difference between Nabokov and Niemi in that regard is that the players know for a fact that if they are good enough, they can win with Niemi. They didn't have that with Nabokov. There have been plenty of seasons where Nabokov had as good of a groove or rhythm or better than Niemi. You can look at the goals allowed stat through their times. They're very much comparable.

You certainly can't say that Niemi fit at the beginning. He was the prime definition of a square peg in a round hole but the team tailored its defensive structure around his play and eventually adjusted. I'm not saying that it doesn't take a certain level of talent to play in this league. It's difficult to develop those talents but when you go out and have your pick of free agent goalies or goalies available through trade that are obviously NHL talent that need a shot, any number of goalies can fit if you do the same things adjusting your team to fit around your goalie like they've done for Niemi.

The Toskala/Kiprusoff examples you bring up are small sample sizes and panic-driven decisions to go away from them. It's not just goalies that need time to develop a rhythm in the games, it's the defense in front of the goalie that have to learn their goalie's tendencies as well. It's tough to get it to click from the get-go. Nabokov was an exception to the rule in this regard.

While I generally agree with your thoughts re: goalies being more of a product of the team, to think that anyone from our pipeline could've just stepped in and played as well as Niemi did last year is a little misguided. On paper our defense was very average when Murray was still in the lineup on a regular basis, and Nemo was great despite that. Plus it's not as if he's making Rinne or Lundqvist money, he's on a good deal for what he brings.

I'm not saying any one of them could. I'm saying the guys that I've seen play like Greiss and Stalock could have. Patzold couldn't. But a lot of what you would or will see from Greiss and Stalock is simply what happens when your starts are sporadic. You don't develop rhythm. You don't develop consistency. The team doesn't develop a knowledge of what you do as a goalie. And Niemi is so drastically different than a lot of goalies that his game compared to the other ones that play have an almost adverse affect on these points. Most goalies don't kick out rebounds as frequently as Niemi and in the spots Niemi does. That creates subtle but important positional changes for those situations.

I would think that the team would want to focus more on developing their own goalies than they have. It seems that goalies in their system now can only hope to be a backup because they don't get a real shot to take the starting spot away with how the coach handles the position.