Post-Game Talk: Game 4: The Todd ReirDONE Capitals VS Ex Coach Who Won The Breakup & His NY Islanders

[trick9]

Pinho played only 3 minutes. Hopefully Backstrom is ready or we need to ride Kuznetsov for 25 minutes in G5. He was absolutely dominant. Created grade 1 chances for Kovy and Dillon too.

Kovy needs to sit. Absolutely useless.

 

[ovikovy817]

Well, it was a great response (the 2nd and 3rd period)
Liked the time out by TR after the 2nd Isles goal.
Ovi

 

[francaisvolantsparis]

Pinho played only 3 minutes. Hopefully Backstrom is ready or we need to ride Kuznetsov for 25 minutes in G5. He was absolutely dominant. Created grade 1 chances for Kovy and Dillon too.

Kovy needs to sit. Absolutely useless.

Some here are asking a trade for Kuznetsov. I hope we get both Kucherov and McDavid in return for him.

 

[searle]

where are half the posters from game 3?

In bed, game started at 1am here

How did Kovy/Vrana look? (I'll admit I was on the melodramatic trade vrana train after G3, hope he gets his confidence back either now or under a new coach)

Sounds like Kuzy really stepped it up, if he does it for 15 more wins this off season then all is forgiven, if not it's too little too late for me, the fact that he can play really well when he wants to isn't really enough IMO, though again hard to argue that it isn't worth seeing if the next coach can solve the enigma

 

[AlexBrovechkin8]

In bed, game started at 1am here

How did Kovy/Vrana look? (I'll admit I was on the melodramatic trade vrana train after G3, hope he gets his confidence back either now or under a new coach)

Sounds like Kuzy really stepped it up, if he does it for 15 more wins this off season then all is forgiven, if not it's too little too late for me, the fact that he can play really well when he wants to isn't really enough IMO, though again hard to argue that it isn't worth seeing if the next coach can solve the enigma

Vrana looked good. He was moving his legs and was unlucky not to score one or two.

Kovalchuk was bad. Looked lost and out off position whenever he was out there and missed a layup gifted to him by Kuznetsov.

 

[Raikkonen]

Vrana tried to do something but didn't do much.

Kovy was useless and didnt convert one golden chance. I think Pinho cant play worse than Kovy as bottom-6 RW grinder.

Defense and goalie played better than in the beginning of the series.

8-92-43 were on fire.

 

[Raikkonen]

Btw, I think we should start a rumour that after G3 Kuzy became the real coach and invented new tactics: fun hockey. This is where all clicked.

 

[txpd]

Or it showed that the problem all along has been execution and effort. I honestly am not sure.

Its all the same thing. Either the players arent given the right game plan or arent motivated to provide execution and effort. The Trotz/Reirden Caps style of hockey doesnt come together quickly. Its both complicated and requires quick, precise movement. If its not sharp, its not good. It needs repetition to be sharp. The Caps dont tend to hit their stride til 20 games into a season. I think people are not entering that into their thinking.

This is a good team that is built to play its best a certain way and it takes a month or two of playing regular to play that certain way with quality.

It doesnt help that the team has 3 top 4 defensemen. Once of which is a short timer with the team and still trying to find his way in their style of game

 

[txpd]

Kovy was useless and didnt convert one golden chance. I think Pinho cant play worse than Kovy as bottom-6 RW grinder..

I know we all see things thru out own eyes, but....in the this one thread there are people saying Kovalchuk played his best game and needs to be in the top 6 and people saying he sucked. I see that he only played 10 mins and that indicates that he wasnt that good, but for someone that didnt watch the game, its very confusing

 

[marcel snapshot]

He was a bit better than he has been, but that’s a low bar because he had been terrible. He’s still a net negative on an NHL playoff team 3rd line. He doesn’t do anything NHL 3rd liners do, and he can’t create space for himself. His 1 stellar scoring chance was all created by Kuzy and he botched it. I’d love to be wrong about him because there’s no sign the coaches are going to give his jersey to someone else. I guess somehow it’s more respectful or something to just sit him

 

[txpd]

Some here are asking a trade for Kuznetsov. I hope we get both Kucherov and McDavid in return for him.

Which Kuznetsov? The coasting Kuzy or the all in Kuzy? The problem with Kuzy is that games like he apparantly played last night are provided inconsistantly enough that he cant be counted on. 1 game in 4 isnt good enough. Is 2018 Kuzy the real Kuzy? If yes, no way i trade that player. Is 2019 Kuzy the real Kuzy? If yes, I dont trust him to be the difference maker the Caps live and die on.

Just from reading here, it sounds to me like Kuzy hasnt been good in the losses and killed it last night. If he plays the next 3 games like the last one, I would never trade him.

 

[Capsman]

Its all the same thing. Either the players arent given the right game plan or arent motivated to provide execution and effort. The Trotz/Reirden Caps style of hockey doesnt come together quickly. Its both complicated and requires quick, precise movement. If its not sharp, its not good. It needs repetition to be sharp. The Caps dont tend to hit their stride til 20 games into a season. I think people are not entering that into their thinking.

This is a good team that is built to play its best a certain way and it takes a month or two of playing regular to play that certain way with quality.

It doesnt help that the team has 3 top 4 defensemen. Once of which is a short timer with the team and still trying to find his way in their style of game

You could argue Jensen is playing like a top 4.

 

[txpd]

You could argue Jensen is playing like a top 4.

Thats true, but me saying that but it can start I fight I am trying to avoid. I grade Kempny and Jensen on the same level. I get crap for pumping Jensen and crap for cutting on Kempny. Best to leave it lie with Dillon Carlson and Orlov as confirmed top 4 defenseman.

 

[RandyHolt]

 

[hb12xchamps]

Kind of puzzling that he was on the third pairing to start the series after his strong end to the regular season.

Had that argument in another thread. Apparently it's because he was only good with Orlov for 2 weeks

 

[txpd]

Had that argument in another thread. Apparently it's because he was only good with Orlov for 2 weeks

Putting the best possible light on this, Kempny is Carlson's comfort zone. If Kempny is able to fill that role, they want to go that way. Dillon is their toughest defender and Orlov their best defender. Jensen playing on the 3rd pair spreads the strenth thru all 3 pairs.

On the other hand, Kempny hasnt been carrying that load well and Orlov was playing out of position. So, Jensen on the 3rd pair didnt have value. With Carlson Dillon and Orlov Jensen you have Orlov back in position and Dillon in a solid supporting role.

Really, the issue has been Kempny

 

[AlexBrovechkin8]

Putting the best possible light on this, Kempny is Carlson's comfort zone. If Kempny is able to fill that role, they want to go that way. Dillon is their toughest defender and Orlov their best defender. Jensen playing on the 3rd pair spreads the strenth thru all 3 pairs.

On the other hand, Kempny hasnt been carrying that load well and Orlov was playing out of position. So, Jensen on the 3rd pair didnt have value. With Carlson Dillon and Orlov Jensen you have Orlov back in position and Dillon in a solid supporting role.

Really, the issue has been Kempny

Have worried for some time now that Kempny is done. He doesn't have much to offer if his mobility isn't there and the dude literally had to have his hamstring drilled back into his bone so it would be understandable if that part of his game is gone for good. I wonder what they'll do with him after this year... trade him or give him more time to heal and hope he bounces back next year like Niskanen has done in Philly. His confidence also has to be super low right now so I don't see they put him back in when they're facing elimination every game from here on out unless they magically make it to the second round.

 

[twabby]

Putting the best possible light on this, Kempny is Carlson's comfort zone. If Kempny is able to fill that role, they want to go that way. Dillon is their toughest defender and Orlov their best defender. Jensen playing on the 3rd pair spreads the strenth thru all 3 pairs.

On the other hand, Kempny hasnt been carrying that load well and Orlov was playing out of position. So, Jensen on the 3rd pair didnt have value. With Carlson Dillon and Orlov Jensen you have Orlov back in position and Dillon in a solid supporting role.

Really, the issue has been Kempny

I agree with pretty much all of this. I thought it was optimistic to expect Kempny to return to form on the first pair after a dreadful season following a major injury but it was forced by the coaching staff regardless. Kempny going from the first pair and leading the team in ESTOI in games 1-2 to the press box in games 3-4 indicates that it was a flawed plan to begin with, especially when as you say it forced Orlov into a role he hasn't played in a while at RD and limited Jensen's TOI against a team where his ability to neutralize a forecheck is desperately needed. They could have easily started Kempny on the third pair along with Siegenthaler and then evaluated his play from there.

 

[marcel snapshot]

Also, Gudas-Siegenthaler is the best 3rd pair iteration we've got. Fever-Siegs is just too young for now. And, against the Isles, the nasty that Gudas brings is helpful

 

[hb12xchamps]

Putting the best possible light on this, Kempny is Carlson's comfort zone. If Kempny is able to fill that role, they want to go that way. Dillon is their toughest defender and Orlov their best defender. Jensen playing on the 3rd pair spreads the strenth thru all 3 pairs.

On the other hand, Kempny hasnt been carrying that load well and Orlov was playing out of position. So, Jensen on the 3rd pair didnt have value. With Carlson Dillon and Orlov Jensen you have Orlov back in position and Dillon in a solid supporting role.

Really, the issue has been Kempny

Meh Kempny has been bad all year. It wasn’t working in the play in games and in game one. The coaching staff forced it. Orlov-Jensen was the team’s best pairing down the stretch before the whole world shut down. They clearly developed chemistry. It seemed the coaching staff wanted to make Dillon fit in the top 4 by pairing him with Orlov. Like I’ve said in previous posts, Dillon’s issue was lack of familiarity. He was thrown into the top pairing role with Carlson right away and they didn’t have enough time to gel as a pairing or give Dillon enough time to get comfortable with the Caps system. The extra training camp and games seems to have helped Dillon tremendously

 

[txpd]

Have worried for some time now that Kempny is done. He doesn't have much to offer if his mobility isn't there and the dude literally had to have his hamstring drilled back into his bone so it would be understandable if that part of his game is gone for good. I wonder what they'll do with him after this year... trade him or give him more time to heal and hope he bounces back next year like Niskanen has done in Philly. His confidence also has to be super low right now so I don't see they put him back in when they're facing elimination every game from here on out unless they magically make it to the second round.

If they keep Dillon, they will trade him. As a 3rd pair defenseman with a cup he is not a budget buster for another team. I am not sure Niskanen was traded because of his play.

 

[AlexBrovechkin8]

If they keep Dillon, they will trade him. As a 3rd pair defenseman with a cup he is not a budget buster for another team. I am not sure Niskanen was traded because of his play.

True that Niskanen was traded mainly for cap reasons but there's no denying he had a down year which probably made the decision easier.

 

[txpd]

I agree with pretty much all of this. I thought it was optimistic to expect Kempny to return to form on the first pair after a dreadful season following a major injury but it was forced by the coaching staff regardless. Kempny going from the first pair and leading the team in ESTOI in games 1-2 to the press box in games 3-4 indicates that it was a flawed plan to begin with, especially when as you say it forced Orlov into a role he hasn't played in a while at RD and limited Jensen's TOI against a team where his ability to neutralize a forecheck is desperately needed. They could have easily started Kempny on the third pair along with Siegenthaler and then evaluated his play from there.

I would just argue with the description of Carlson's pair as the first pair. The Caps really dont work like that. Orlov and Niskanen carried the first pair defensive assignments while Carlson played offense. They dont really play a 1, 2, 3 depth chart.
Kempny's job was to support Carlson so he can play offense.

I am just going to guess that the coaches feel like Siegenthaler needs a right shooting partner which is why Gudas.

 

[txpd]

Meh Kempny has been bad all year. It wasn’t working in the play in games and in game one. The coaching staff forced it. Orlov-Jensen was the team’s best pairing down the stretch before the whole world shut down. They clearly developed chemistry. It seemed the coaching staff wanted to make Dillon fit in the top 4 by pairing him with Orlov. Like I’ve said in previous posts, Dillon’s issue was lack of familiarity. He was thrown into the top pairing role with Carlson right away and they didn’t have enough time to gel as a pairing or give Dillon enough time to get comfortable with the Caps system. The extra training camp and games seems to have helped Dillon tremendously

IIRC pre series the general consensus was that Kempny was good and that the layoff was what he needed. That given the choice in the top 4 between using Kempny and using Jensen, Kempny got the votes. I didnt see a lot of whining over Jensen on the 3rd pair

 

[txpd]

True that Niskanen was traded mainly for cap reasons but there's no denying he had a down year which probably made the decision easier.

My read on that is that the team knew why Niskanen had a down year and would know if his playoff damage was permanent or just needed the rest. I suggested at the time that trading Orlov and keeping Niskanen was the way to go and didnt get a lot of support. I think in the end though that MacLellan knew he needed to move Nisky because of the salary cap and that is why he got Jensen. Jensen just took a year to find his way. It doesnt look so bad now....except for what the Flyers are doing with Niskanen