GDT: Game 21: Avalanche @ Arizona Pasties - The haunting of the 2015 draft class | 11/23/18 6PM

[Jakey53]

I know a few people have said this already, but John Maclean seriously needs to go, like tomorrow. You can tell when he talks to Tocc on camera sometimes too, that Tocc is like “Wtf is this guy even saying right now?” Beyond that...if Chayka hasn’t already been making a buttload of phone calls to other GM’s then he should be tomorrow morning. I don’t think you need to classify it as hitting the panic button, but it’s just being proactive. Even as wide open as the pacific is right now, this group clearly is not going to have what it takes to get it done.
Perlini...buh-bye. Fischer...buh-bye. Panik...buh-bye. Strome honestly I don’t think has been bad with what he’s been given and I’d give him more time and more opportunity before making a decision on him. Gotta have a shakeup waaaay before the deadline though...waiting until the deadline is a big mistake if you ask me.
Another thing people have already mentioned that is 100% true...our drafting is haunting the **** out of us. The fact that we could have had Marner/Aho or Rantanen/Aho instead of Strome/Fischer makes me want to puke all over myself.

We have no one to trade. This is what we will have this year. This team is not as bad as what they are showing, so let's cool our jets and see what kind of character this team has. Hind sight is 20/20, an d every team could look back at the drafts and say "what if".

 

[Jakey53]

I was at the game. It was brutal to watch. Soft as daisies this team. It's like watching a girls team play men.
I've said it many times. Chyka likes the analytics but it doesn't measure the intangibles. We have most of our forwards being soft tissue paper types. They simply don't have that compete level.
Crouse didn't play bad. He's willing to mix it up. Richardson and Cousins can too .
If we don't have the puck we are helpless. We are not a counter attack team. All that speed is negated. If the puck goes into the corner most of these guys pee their shorts.
The strome report? He started the game off with two great passes . He finished with a goal. He can play at this level. I watched him carefully out their and his speed is right there with Stepan. He has no acceleration at all. No quickness but his overall skating is probably slightly below average. But he has that ability to see the ice well and belongs at this level.
Overall though this team will not be making the playoffs. You might blame toc but you cant fake toughness in hockey. Give him a different roster and maybe.

Yes, it was very brutal to watch. I agree, this team is soft but Crouse, Fischer and Bush can mix it up when needed. Things just snowballed last night after we made a few terrible mistakes. That pass from OEL to Compher was a thing of beauty, to bad it was to the wrong team. Keller looked like he had cement in his skates on that play, but kidding aside, if he was that tired he should be on the bench. That first goal Raanta should have had, terrible goal. Not blaming Raanta for the loss but he was definitely rusty. Strome had a nice goal, going to the net and a nice second effort. We know he can do it, just has to do it on a more consistent level. Baby steps. Colorado is a real good team and if you make mistakes you will pay, and we did. Onward and upward.

 

[Foggy1097]

We have no one to trade. This is what we will have this year. This team is not as bad as what they are showing, so let's cool our jets and see what kind of character this team has. Hind sight is 20/20, an d every team could look back at the drafts and say "what if".

This team showed exactly what kind of character they have last night. They got their starting goalie back and hung him out to dry. They played a team on the last game of a road trip with their backup goalie and showed no urgency. Our captain and best player coughed the puck up multiple times and looked like he didn’t care either way if they won or lost when he was on the ice. The entire group got their ass kicked in the first period and responded with a collective, “meh.” I honestly thought there was more character and heart in that room but they aren’t showing it lately.

 

[The Feckless Puck]

Before everyone goes crazy talking about how we should have drafted X or Y and going all hindsighty on us, consider this: who is to say that any of these "greener grass" guys would have been the players they are if they had come here?

There is a general malaise in Arizona that has only been overcome in two, maybe three seasons tops. The difference between those years and all the others, to me, is that there were some mature character guys like Ray Whitney, Adrian Aucoin, and Shane Doan in the room to keep things on the right track. What do we have now? The oldest team members we have are Goligoski and Richardson at 33 and 34 years old, respectively. Our captain is a millennial underwear salesman. The only guy I can think of on the team with the type of leadership qualities I respected back in 2011-2012 is Hjalmarsson, and he can't lead this group alone.

I don't know if it's the ability to hang out by the pool in November or what, but I don't see our group as "hungry" in any, way, shape, or form. The "collective 'meh'" @Foggy1097 just referenced could probably be the team's rallying cry. And as long as that's true, not even an arena in the players' backyard is going to motivate them to any level of success.

 

[Foggy1097]

I have always downplayed the “general malaise” narrative that seems to come with playing in Arizona, but I’m really starting to think there might be something to it. It seems to just slowly but surely sink it’s way in to the player’s psyches unless they really have some inner fire and motivation to get out there and get after it every game. It’s like they get accustomed to living the Scottsdale life and realize that they don’t have a care in the world (which they don’t) and seem to be telling themselves, “Well even if our team sucks and we can’t win at least we live in Scottsdale...who’s up for a swim and a cocktail?” When it really gets down to it they just need to show the organization and the fans that they really do care about delivering a consistent winning product here, and if they don’t then we’ll keep trying to find people that do. It’s easy to talk about it with a camera on you but you have to actually go show it with your effort and your focus on the ice.

 

[CNYCrunchfan1]

You guys sound like Coyote fans every year...its going to come, its going to get better, they just need this or that. Coyote excuses is what this organization lives in. You know what a winning team does? Stop making excuses. The mentality of this organization and its fans is terrible. They have been trained to accept defeat. Get freaking pissed! Someone get pissed! Chayka is too sheepish...give me an old time guy that hates losing with a passion.

 

[Bonsai Tree]

Before everyone goes crazy talking about how we should have drafted X or Y and going all hindsighty on us, consider this: who is to say that any of these "greener grass" guys would have been the players they are if they had come here?

There is a general malaise in Arizona that has only been overcome in two, maybe three seasons tops. The difference between those years and all the others, to me, is that there were some mature character guys like Ray Whitney, Adrian Aucoin, and Shane Doan in the room to keep things on the right track. What do we have now? The oldest team members we have are Goligoski and Richardson at 33 and 34 years old, respectively. Our captain is a millennial underwear salesman. The only guy I can think of on the team with the type of leadership qualities I respected back in 2011-2012 is Hjalmarsson, and he can't lead this group alone.

I don't know if it's the ability to hang out by the pool in November or what, but I don't see our group as "hungry" in any, way, shape, or form. The "collective 'meh'" @Foggy1097 just referenced could probably be the team's rallying cry. And as long as that's true, not even an arena in the players' backyard is going to motivate them to any level of success.

I don't buy it. I don't buy a malaise that persists over multiple ownership groups, multiple GMs, multiple coaches and multiple players. I don't buy this "cursed earth" philosophy. Our "malaise" is nothing more than the result of bad decisions on all levels which over the years have taken their toll. Poor player talent assessment and acquisition. Poor coaching, poor on ice play either due to player ineffectiveness or indifference.

 

[Heldig]

Swinging and missing with the majority of the first round picks has cemented the franchise in mediocrity. The only way out of this in the short term is to buy talent. Too bad the team cant afford it.

 

[justin323032]

Hate to out myself, but I can't help but relive the nightmare of my USC Trojans - granted the yotes don't have that much baseline talent. Thing is, Clay Helton is the softest coach in the NCAA, and the players adapt to that. We have the same mentality in our locker room, and it starts from the top. During a press conference you might see Toc get agitated, at best, but never too angry. Perhaps that's a good thing to some, but our veterans are poor leaders (because they're soft!) and our youth isn't developing. There was one point in last night game where the Avs just passed the back along the boards like 4 times, then had a shot from the point. Meanwhile their forward was just posted up in front of ranta, and OEL refused to even touch the dude. He ended up getting a good screen on rants and almost had a goal from a nothing play.

 

[Coyotedroppings]

Holy shit boys, we actually started the game well, it wasn't until our dreaded pp that things went horribly wrong and I do mean HORRIBLE. We actually played a mostly solid game after, as well, against a very good team.
Look, I despised the breakdowns and honestly felt more like leaving, than staying, but this tear everything down mentality is just a waste of bandwidth.
Make a statement - shit can MacLean and see if anything improves, it can't get much worse. The pp is our biggest issue, get it in track, our confidence will improve, we'll see better 5v5 and start drawing more penalties as a result.

 

[lanky]

The pp is our biggest issue

It isn't. We're a better pp team relative to the rest of the league than we are 5v5.

Whoever is responsible for even strength scoring is a bigger problem than our PP coach (which also is a problem).

 

[Mosby]

Who'd make a good MacLean replacmeent? (I know, literally anyone). I'm just scrolling through NHL.com PP stats trying to figure out what PP coach is available. Who is the Allen of powerplays?

 

[Summer Rose]

Who'd make a good MacLean replacmeent? (I know, literally anyone). I'm just scrolling through NHL.com PP stats trying to figure out what PP coach is available. Who is the Allen of powerplays?

My grandfather could do it and he passed in 1993.

 

[SniperHF]

It isn't. We're a better pp team relative to the rest of the league than we are 5v5.

It's not the biggest issue true. But it might be the biggest issue we can actually improve on midseason. I don't see any hope of improving our game 5 on 5 during the year.

We were the 2nd worst 5 on 5 team in terms of GF last year, If the new faces were going to address that it would have probably happened already. We're still 2nd worst.

 

[Coyotedroppings]

It isn't. We're a better pp team relative to the rest of the league than we are 5v5.

Whoever is responsible for even strength scoring is a bigger problem than our PP coach (which also is a problem).

I understand the statistical sentiment, but disagree. Read the rest of my post - fix the pp and I believe the rest will fall into place.

 

[Coyotedroppings]

Who'd make a good MacLean replacmeent? (I know, literally anyone). I'm just scrolling through NHL.com PP stats trying to figure out what PP coach is available. Who is the Allen of powerplays?

I think you could go outside the box on this one, way outside. I just want the wake up call sent.

 

[SniperHF]

I think you could go outside the box on this one, way outside. I just want the wake up call sent.

That is kind of an odd thing about the franchises coaching choices (both good and bad) since Chayka has been GM. All 3 here and the two sets in Tuscon have been very conventional wisdom type picks. League is faster - try and play like the Pens. Looking for credentials, get Tocchet coming off a team that won the cup twice. Maybe it's just a function of price/availability but even among the candidates in the mix none of them really stood out as a bold choice other than Eakins and that was for all the wrong reasons. Some of the other names for the HC position when they were searching maybe but they never seemed to be in serious consideration.

 

[cobra427]

It’s still a game of mistakes and goal tending. We can’t make the kind of mistakes we made last game with sub par goal tending and expect to win. Yes, the PP needs to be better. Our best scorers in OEL and Keller need to be better too. All the other young players are a work in progress. If Raanta and our D stay healthy, we can make it through until we figure out how to score.

Look at Colorado from 2 years ago, they turned the corner. That can be us, we just have to be patient, there aren’t any quick fixes. Tinkering with the roster is ok, major changes or selling off young guys is not. We made enough changes, time to let the roster play out now. Keep in mind we are top 3 in GAA and first in the PK. You guys are too doom and gloom after a few losses or tough stretch.

 

[azcanuck]

It’s still a game of mistakes and goal tending. We can’t make the kind of mistakes we made last game with sub par goal tending and expect to win. Yes, the PP needs to be better. Our best scorers in OEL and Keller need to be better too. All the other young players are a work in progress. If Raanta and our D stay healthy, we can make it through until we figure out how to score.

Look at Colorado from 2 years ago, they turned the corner. That can be us, we just have to be patient, there aren’t any quick fixes. Tinkering with the roster is ok, major changes or selling off young guys is not. We made enough changes, time to let the roster play out now. Keep in mind we are top 3 in GAA and first in the PK. You guys are too doom and gloom after a few losses or tough stretch.

Colorado has a superstar in McKinnon. We don't have any close to that. They also have a few other guys that we are not close to having. Maybe OEL is our "superstar" but our forwards development is a bit disappointing. However there will be growth there for sure.
But most Stanley cup teams have a superstar. Look at the turnaround in Buffalo. they have Eichel. and Dahlin will be great.
We lost out on some lottery picks that really hurt.

 

[RemoAZ]

Colorado has a superstar in McKinnon. We don't have any close to that. They also have a few other guys that we are not close to having. Maybe OEL is our "superstar" but our forwards development is a bit disappointing. However there will be growth there for sure.
But most Stanley cup teams have a superstar. Look at the turnaround in Buffalo. they have Eichel. and Dahlin will be great.
We lost out on some lottery picks that really hurt.

And made our odds worse every year we were horrible because our sorry ass coach continually made winning meaningless games the top priority.

 

[Jakey53]

And made our odds worse every year we were horrible because our sorry ass coach continually made winning meaningless games the top priority.

Coaches are hired to win games and they could care less about the draft.