G Dustin Wolf (2019, 214th, CGY)

[Double Dion]

Really like the pick. This is where you roll the dice on goaltending.

 

[OldScool]

One thing I think the NHL scouts get wrong all the time is the over emphasis of height. I get it - the trend of the tall goalie is still "in" but data supports otherwise. A ton of scouts dont understand the goalie position and just see size and draft the taller goalies just because of their height. Height should be a characteristic for a goalie but pretty low down on the priority list. Look at the last 20 years of Vezina winners and their height:

6'3

6'1

5'11

6'2

6'1

6'2

5'11

6'2

5'11

6'1

6'2

6'2

6'3

6'2 6'2 [TBODY] [/TBODY]

6'2

6'5

6'2

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

The sweetspot is 6'2 or so...not 6'8 like some scouts think it is.

 

[ProspectsFanatic]

One thing I think the NHL scouts get wrong all the time is the over emphasis of height. I get it - the trend of the tall goalie is still "in" but data supports otherwise. A ton of scouts dont understand the goalie position and just see size and draft the taller goalies just because of their height. Height should be a characteristic for a goalie but pretty low down on the priority list. Look at the last 20 years of Vezina winners and their height:

6'3

6'1

5'11

6'2

6'1

6'2

5'11

6'2

5'11

6'1

6'2

6'2

6'3

6'2 6'2 [TBODY] [/TBODY]

6'2

6'5

6'2

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

The sweetspot is 6'2 or so...not 6'8 like some scouts think it is.

You forgot to factor the pool of players by height. There are multiple times more 6'2 person in the world than 6'7. There is a disproportionate amount of very tall goalie in the NHL.

 

[OldScool]

From gooddeedseats:

List of Starting NHL Goaltender Heights

Goalie	Height	Team
Casey DeSmith	6'0"	Pittsburgh Penguins
Carter Hutton	6'1"	Buffalo Sabres
Jimmy Howard	6'1"	Detroit Red Wings
Jonathan Quick	6'1"	Los Angeles Kings
Henrik Lundqvist	6'1"	New York Rangers
John Gibson	6'2"	Anaheim Ducks
Curtis McElhinney	6'2"	Carolina Hurricanes
Corey Crawford	6'2"	Chicago Blackhawks
Semyon Varlamov	6'2"	Colorado Avalanche
Sergei Bobrovsky	6'2"	Columbus Blue Jackets
Thomas Greiss	6'2"	New York Islanders
Craig Anderson	6'2"	Ottawa Senators
Brian Elliott	6'2"	Philadelphia Flyers
Jake Allen	6'2"	St. Louis Blues
Marc-Andre Fleury	6'2"	Vegas Golden Knights
Braden Holtby	6'2"	Washington Capitals
Roberto Luongo	6'3"	Florida Panthers
Tuukka Rask	6'3"	Boston Bruins
Carey Price	6'3"	Montreal Canadiens
Keith Kinkaid	6'3"	New Jersey Devils
Louis Domingue	6'3"	Tampa Bay Lightning
Mike Smith	6'4"	Calgary Flames
Cam Talbot	6'4"	Edmonton Oilers
Martin Jones	6'4"	San Jose Sharks
Frederik Andersen	6'4"	Toronto Maple Leafs
Connor Hellebuyck	6'4"	Winnipeg Jets
Pekka Rinne	6'5"	Nashville Predators
Adin Hill	6'6''	Arizona Coyotes
Devan Dubnyk	6'6"	Minnesota Wild
Jacob Markstrom	6'6"	Vancouver Canucks
Ben Bishop	6'7"	Dallas Stars

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

 

[Jormungandr]

Starting NHL goalies?

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

How tall is Saros? Shestyorkin? Hart? Sorokin?

 

[greasysnapper]

How tall is Saros? Shestyorkin? Hart? Sorokin?

Saros is a small boy. The other 3 are bigger.


This is the Doug Flutie debate all over again. I think there are small goalies who could get it done, but I think especially on the PP when teams can set up big bodies in front of the net, it's a disadvantage, and teams will continue to devalue and not want the smaller goalies.

Here's the thing though, Wolf has more deficiencies than just his height. He is far from a good goalie. There's a reason why someone like Saros was taken in the 4th, whereas Wolf was taken in the 7th.

 

[HarrySPlinkett]

Saros is a small boy. The other 3 are bigger.


This is the Doug Flutie debate all over again. I think there are small goalies who could get it done, but I think especially on the PP when teams can set up big bodies in front of the net, it's a disadvantage, and teams will continue to devalue and not want the smaller goalies.

Here's the thing though, Wolf has more deficiencies than just his height. He is far from a good goalie. There's a reason why someone like Saros was taken in the 4th, whereas Wolf was taken in the 7th.

Dude, did he bang your mom ? Give it a rest.

 

[OldScool]

My point is that were some less proficient goalies taken ahead of Wolf simply because they are taller...no other reason. Its funny that speed/skating/skill has become the mantra of pro hockey yet NHL teams still just pick goalies on height rather than side to side speed and skating ability. Side to side speed, agility, rebound control, angle of attack, ability to read shot/play, should be the determining factors for picking a goalie and sadly they are still lower in the priority list than height but I think that will change as NHL becomes faster and more skilled. Goalies need to more flexible, faster, more agile than just sitting in a spot and taking up space. Show me one bit of data/evidence/metric that shows that Sogaard is a better goalie than Wolf yet Sogaard goes #37th while Wolf barely gets drafted. Sogaard got drafted because he is 6'7" and if you look at the franchise that drafted him they are arguably the worst in the NHL for drafting and it supports my theory that some NHL teams that no very little about goaltending draft goalies purely based on how tall they all. Toss a 6'11 kid on skates and toss him in net and he gets drafted nowadays.

 

[Newfoundland]

Best pick in the draft. How did this guy go in the 7th if Knight went 14th overall?

 

[OldScool]

Best pick in the draft. How did this guy go in the 7th if Knight went 14th overall?

This is why...

|----------------------------------------------------------------------------|

or 4" difference in height.

 

[ChurchOfAlfie]

My point is that were some less proficient goalies taken ahead of Wolf simply because they are taller...no other reason. Its funny that speed/skating/skill has become the mantra of pro hockey yet NHL teams still just pick goalies on height rather than side to side speed and skating ability. Side to side speed, agility, rebound control, angle of attack, ability to read shot/play, should be the determining factors for picking a goalie and sadly they are still lower in the priority list than height but I think that will change as NHL becomes faster and more skilled. Goalies need to more flexible, faster, more agile than just sitting in a spot and taking up space. Show me one bit of data/evidence/metric that shows that Sogaard is a better goalie than Wolf yet Sogaard goes #37th while Wolf barely gets drafted. Sogaard got drafted because he is 6'7" and if you look at the franchise that drafted him they are arguably the worst in the NHL for drafting and it supports my theory that some NHL teams that no very little about goaltending draft goalies purely based on how tall they all. Toss a 6'11 kid on skates and toss him in net and he gets drafted nowadays.

Are you saying Ottawa is the worst drafting team in the NHL? Dude...

 

[OldScool]

Are you saying Ottawa is the worst drafting team in the NHL? Dude...

Its Ottawa.

 

[ChurchOfAlfie]

Its Ottawa.

Yeah. The one thing they consistently do well is draft.

 

[Brodeur]

Decent amount of Everett fans made the drive up to Vancouver for the draft. Had a nice conversation with one family who knew Dustin.

Sitting there at the draft, it's easy to forget who's been taken if you didn't bring a list. When Wolf got taken, there was a loud eruption from the Everett group. Probably a big relief for him as there were only a few more picks in the draft.

 

[Bevans]

My point is that were some less proficient goalies taken ahead of Wolf simply because they are taller...no other reason. Its funny that speed/skating/skill has become the mantra of pro hockey yet NHL teams still just pick goalies on height rather than side to side speed and skating ability. Side to side speed, agility, rebound control, angle of attack, ability to read shot/play, should be the determining factors for picking a goalie and sadly they are still lower in the priority list than height but I think that will change as NHL becomes faster and more skilled. Goalies need to more flexible, faster, more agile than just sitting in a spot and taking up space. Show me one bit of data/evidence/metric that shows that Sogaard is a better goalie than Wolf yet Sogaard goes #37th while Wolf barely gets drafted. Sogaard got drafted because he is 6'7" and if you look at the franchise that drafted him they are arguably the worst in the NHL for drafting and it supports my theory that some NHL teams that no very little about goaltending draft goalies purely based on how tall they all. Toss a 6'11 kid on skates and toss him in net and he gets drafted nowadays.

Brutal take on Ottawa. Literally all they have is drafting.

 

[DFF]

Saros is a small boy. The other 3 are bigger.


This is the Doug Flutie debate all over again. I think there are small goalies who could get it done, but I think especially on the PP when teams can set up big bodies in front of the net, it's a disadvantage, and teams will continue to devalue and not want the smaller goalies.

Here's the thing though, Wolf has more deficiencies than just his height. He is far from a good goalie. There's a reason why someone like Saros was taken in the 4th, whereas Wolf was taken in the 7th.

Can you be specific what are the deficiencies? Show some examples
Keep saying he is no good does not make it so.

I am a flames fan but I have no opinion on wolf. Just want to know the truth.

 

[TheGoldenJet]

Can you be specific what are the deficiencies? Show some examples
Keep saying he is no good does not make it so.

I am a flames fan but I have no opinion on wolf. Just want to know the truth.

Truth is he is a damn good goaltender and would have been drafted in the top 2 rounds of he was even one inch taller.

 

[greasysnapper]

Can you be specific what are the deficiencies? Show some examples
Keep saying he is no good does not make it so.

I am a flames fan but I have no opinion on wolf. Just want to know the truth.

I'm not going through neulion and screenshotting/clipping individual moments to show specific examples, but I'll give you some snippets of my notes that have spans 30+ direct viewings (with checklists) and a number of tertiary viewings, and a 19 page word doc since 2017.

"QRS"

"Very quick, quickest lateral goalie I've seen this year--proved through onioning.3"

"Solid reflexes, when he gets caught out of position, he's able to recover and set during bouts of little traffic."

"Good alignment. Squares himself to the shooter well."

"One bad habit he has is he overuses his quick glove, will move across the body to catch puck, but has found success doing this."

"Feigns left side weakness, luring shooters to test him. Interesting."

"Great push going post to post, lots of explosiveness in his legs, gives him decent lateral coverage on the lower half of the net despite size."



All great right?



"BC particularly up high on the blocker side is weak. Let in 2 straight soft goals due to time and space on the powerplay."

"Beat high."

"Met dad today, good family, nice man. Not tall, 5'9? Glasses/will bring up nonchalantly next time"

"Noticed he cheats when he drops down. Will try and give glove side."

"Poor hold in scrums. Short rebound on easy save resulted in goal. Was basically pushed in with a stick."

"Beat on wraparound. Just out muscled."

"RC wasn't as good as I've seen from him. Particularly on his right side. Made absolutely grade a save, that quickly resulted in goal."

"Gave up over 10 juicy rebounds. So many were directed right back to the shooter. Poor RC tonight"

"Below average RC but makes up for it with his quickness."



TLDR: Great plus quickness, average to below average rebound control, poor scrum coverage, poor net coverage.

 

[DFF]

I'm not going through neulion and screenshotting/clipping individual moments to show specific examples, but I'll give you some snippets of my notes that have spans 30+ direct viewings (with checklists) and a number of tertiary viewings, and a 19 page word doc since 2017.

"QRS"

"Very quick, quickest lateral goalie I've seen this year--proved through onioning.3"

"Solid reflexes, when he gets caught out of position, he's able to recover and set during bouts of little traffic."

"Good alignment. Squares himself to the shooter well."

"One bad habit he has is he overuses his quick glove, will move across the body to catch puck, but has found success doing this."

"Feigns left side weakness, luring shooters to test him. Interesting."

"Great push going post to post, lots of explosiveness in his legs, gives him decent lateral coverage on the lower half of the net despite size."



All great right?



"BC particularly up high on the blocker side is weak. Let in 2 straight soft goals due to time and space on the powerplay."

"Beat high."

"Met dad today, good family, nice man. Not tall, 5'9? Glasses/will bring up nonchalantly next time"

"Noticed he cheats when he drops down. Will try and give glove side."

"Poor hold in scrums. Short rebound on easy save resulted in goal. Was basically pushed in with a stick."

"Beat on wraparound. Just out muscled."

"RC wasn't as good as I've seen from him. Particularly on his right side. Made absolutely grade a save, that quickly resulted in goal."

"Gave up over 10 juicy rebounds. So many were directed right back to the shooter. Poor RC tonight"

"Below average RC but makes up for it with his quickness."



TLDR: Great plus quickness, average to below average rebound control, poor scrum coverage, poor net coverage.

Ok sound like he has some rebound and positioning issues...but those things can be corrected?

Definitely not enough to not spend a pick on him to me

 

[greasysnapper]

Ok sound like he has some rebound and positioning issues...but those things can be corrected?

Definitely not enough to not spend a pick on him to me

A lot of things can be worked on, but you can say that about 100 goalies. Every day players can get better. It's about who can get to the top of that mountain. The biggest issues for me are net coverage, particularly BCUC, rebounds, his blocker, and core strength. I'm also slightly concerned with tracking later on in his career. I think it was enough to not spend a pick on, especially with the calibre of goaltending that never got drafted. You're better off waiting to see if these issues can be corrected than wasting the pick. Truthfully, I'd rather have Basran or Maier or Gauthier than Wolf to just give an example.

 

[DFF]

A lot of things can be worked on, but you can say that about 100 goalies. Every day players can get better. It's about who can get to the top of that mountain. The biggest issues for me are net coverage, particularly BCUC, rebounds, his blocker, and core strength. I'm also slightly concerned with tracking later on in his career. I think it was enough to not spend a pick on, especially with the calibre of goaltending that never got drafted. You're better off waiting to see if these issues can be corrected than wasting the pick. Truthfully, I'd rather have Basran or Maier or Gauthier than Wolf to just give an example.

Fair enough but remember it's a 7th rounder

 

[greasysnapper]

Terrible rebound control in today's game, and he was a lot slower than I've seen him.

 

[lakai17]

From gooddeedseats:

List of Starting NHL Goaltender Heights

Goalie	Height	Team
Casey DeSmith	6'0"	Pittsburgh Penguins
Carter Hutton	6'1"	Buffalo Sabres
Jimmy Howard	6'1"	Detroit Red Wings
Jonathan Quick	6'1"	Los Angeles Kings
Henrik Lundqvist	6'1"	New York Rangers
John Gibson	6'2"	Anaheim Ducks
Curtis McElhinney	6'2"	Carolina Hurricanes
Corey Crawford	6'2"	Chicago Blackhawks
Semyon Varlamov	6'2"	Colorado Avalanche
Sergei Bobrovsky	6'2"	Columbus Blue Jackets
Thomas Greiss	6'2"	New York Islanders
Craig Anderson	6'2"	Ottawa Senators
Brian Elliott	6'2"	Philadelphia Flyers
Jake Allen	6'2"	St. Louis Blues
Marc-Andre Fleury	6'2"	Vegas Golden Knights
Braden Holtby	6'2"	Washington Capitals
Roberto Luongo	6'3"	Florida Panthers
Tuukka Rask	6'3"	Boston Bruins
Carey Price	6'3"	Montreal Canadiens
Keith Kinkaid	6'3"	New Jersey Devils
Louis Domingue	6'3"	Tampa Bay Lightning
Mike Smith	6'4"	Calgary Flames
Cam Talbot	6'4"	Edmonton Oilers
Martin Jones	6'4"	San Jose Sharks
Frederik Andersen	6'4"	Toronto Maple Leafs
Connor Hellebuyck	6'4"	Winnipeg Jets
Pekka Rinne	6'5"	Nashville Predators
Adin Hill	6'6''	Arizona Coyotes
Devan Dubnyk	6'6"	Minnesota Wild
Jacob Markstrom	6'6"	Vancouver Canucks
Ben Bishop	6'7"	Dallas Stars

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Luongo is retired ...now add backup goalies and if possible add ahl starters...

 

[TheKingSlayer]

Luongo is retired ...now add backup goalies and if possible add ahl starters...

If you want to know the sweetspot for an NHL starting goalie, your criteria should not include AHL starting goalies, or even back-ups for that matter. I'd include any goalie who plays 30+ games consistently. Anyone else clearly cannot cut it as a starter for whatever reason.