Speculation: Front Office

[66-30-33]

FWIW Gonchar was let go because he wouldn't switch to a full time coach apparently. I get why they let go of him if he wasn't willing to move to Pittsburgh and become a full time coach.

Where is he living again? I guess he will be a full time coach there.

edit- Fisher Island Florida?

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

Terrible article...so JR says JJ maybe isn't as good as he thought, but not AS BAD as others say. Real vote of confidence for JJ right there. Then lists a bunch of conditions that have to be met for him to be an effective 3rd pair D. Real vote of confidence there. Why are people dumping on JR? What am I missing? Those are some of the most cringe backhanded compliments you can make about someone..

I think until JR actually does something about Johnson, he's going to get backlash. Talk is cheap until he fixes this mess he created for no reason.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

I think until JR actually does something about Johnson, he's going to get backlash. Talk is cheap until he fixes this mess he created for no reason.

I genuinely don't think JR sees JJ as the problem the rest of the hockey world does. I don't think this is an act to get his trade value up. I don't think this is a GM not wanting to throw one of his guys under the bus. I think this is honestly how JR and Sully (maybe more so than JR) feel about JJ; solid, defensive stalwart that gets a bad rap for no reason.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

I genuinely don't think JR sees JJ as the problem the rest of the hockey world does. I don't think this is an act to get his trade value up. I don't think this is a GM not wanting to throw one of his guys under the bus. I think this is honestly how JR and Sully (maybe more so than JR) feel about JJ; solid, defensive stalwart that gets a bad rap for no reason.

If that's the case, then that's a condemnation of their ability to assess hockey players. And if that's the case, Lemieux and Burkle need to step in ASAP like they finally did when they shitcanned those two idiots Shero and Bylsma.

You simply can't have two people running this team who think Johnson is anything less than a liability out there.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

If that's the case, then that's a condemnation of their ability to assess hockey players. And if that's the case, Lemieux and Burkle need to step in ASAP like they finally did when they shitcanned those two idiots Shero and Bylsma.

You simply can't have two people running this team who think Johnson is anything less than a liability out there.

I've been saying for a while now that this team's current situation feels eerily similar to the situation we were in as the clock struck midnight on the Shero/Bylsma era. Totally directionless GMing and coaching. A solid enough core with no bottom-6 and a mess on the blueline. The difference now, sadly, is that the core is 33/34 as opposed to 27/28.

In order for this team to pull another 180 like we did back then, and to do it in time to get another shot at a Cup before Geno and Letang are done in 2 years, we need to completely clean out the FO and coaching staff. That's step one. No progress will be made until JR and Sully are gone.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

I've been saying for a while now that this team's current situation feels eerily similar to the situation we were in as the clock struck midnight on the Shero/Bylsma era. Totally directionless GMing and coaching. A solid enough core with no bottom-6 and a mess on the blueline. The difference now, sadly, is that the core is 33/34 as opposed to 27/28.

And the difference is we're only 3 years removed from back to back Cups to earn them a lot more rope than they deserve, as opposed to being a good 6 years removed from the '09 Cup back then.

In other words, don't expect Burkle and Lemieux to step in for at least another 3 or 4 seasons of watching this team look like a paper tiger.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

And the difference is we're only 3 years removed from back to back Cups to earn them a lot more rope than they deserve, as opposed to being a good 6 years removed from the '09 Cup back then.

In other words, don't expect Burkle and Lemieux to step in for at least another 3 or 4 seasons of watching this team look like a paper tiger.

I'm not sure either of the owners really care too much any more, to be honest. Hasn't Mario all but cashed out? Burkle never struck me as a guy who was very in tune or involved with the hockey stuff.

Either way, I fully expect us to waste another year before JR and Sully are both gone this time next year. I'm not even sure Sully will make it to January.

Even if these guys pull their heads out of their asses and are able to pull the 180 needed, it's gonna take a solid calendar year of roster building to sort things out and get us back to even being competitive. That means we have, realistically, one final shot at a Cup before Geno and Letang are outta here. And that's assuming all the moves we need to make go well, which obviously isn't always the case, *ahem* 3C/Bonino *ahem*.

I'm on team Big Sell™ to be honest. I'd rather rip the band-aid off quickly and get to rebuilding than to watch these dummies continue to captain the ship on its 3-year, steady, downward trend.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

I'm not sure either of the owners really care too much any more, to be honest. Hasn't Mario all but cashed out? Burkle never struck me as a guy who was very in tune or involved with the hockey stuff.

Either way, I fully expect us to waste another year before JR and Sully are both gone this time next year. I'm not even sure Sully will make it to January.

Even if these guys pull their heads out of their asses and are able to pull the 180 needed, it's gonna take a solid calendar year of roster building to sort things out and get us back to even being competitive. That means we have, realistically, one final shot at a Cup before Geno and Letang are outta here. And that's assuming all the moves we need to make go well, which obviously isn't always the case, *ahem* 3C/Bonino *ahem*.

I'm on team Big Sell™ to be honest. I'd rather rip the band-aid off quickly and get to rebuilding than to watch these dummies continue to captain the ship on its 3-year, steady, downward trend.

You'd have to sell Sid, Geno and Letang on a mini rebuild though. At their ages, I don't know if they'd be for it. And honestly I'm not sure JR's got his finger on the pulse of what this team needs to do to re-tool. And I definitely don't think Sullivan's the guy to do it.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

You'd have to sell Sid, Geno and Letang on a mini rebuild though. At their ages, I don't know if they'd be for it. And honestly I'm not sure JR's got his finger on the pulse of what this team needs to do to re-tool. And I definitely don't think Sullivan's the guy to do it.

I think Sid'll be fine with whatever. He knows he's a Penguin for life, and he wants it that way imo. One of the things he's idolized Yzerman for is the whole "one team for an entire career" thing. Geno will probably be open to chasing one last Cup, though I don't think he's necessarily about to demand a trade. I don't think Letang's even close to either of them in the untouchable regard though, nor should he be. Reports are he expects to be dealt this off-season, and while I won't believe it until I see it, I wouldn't be surprised at all.

From what people have said, JR probably wants even less to do with a rebuild than anyone in the organization. He'll probably retire next summer after another embarrassing loss in the 1st round or we miss the playoffs entirely.

I don't think Sully survives the season as the Penguins' coach. I don't think JR is in charge of another draft after this one, there'll be a "mutual parting of ways" next off-season.

 

[Peat]

And the difference is we're only 3 years removed from back to back Cups to earn them a lot more rope than they deserve, as opposed to being a good 6 years removed from the '09 Cup back then.

In other words, don't expect Burkle and Lemieux to step in for at least another 3 or 4 seasons of watching this team look like a paper tiger.

Pinch of salt, as I've only seen Kingerski report this, but apparently the assistants coaches' sacking was a direct result of a call from ownership and they're aware they let Bylsma ride two years too long. Guess we'll see if there's any truth to that this season.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

Pinch of salt, as I've only seen Kingerski report this, but apparently the assistants coaches' sacking was a direct result of a call from ownership and they're aware they let Bylsma ride two years too long. Guess we'll see if there's any truth to that this season.

Unless there's a borderline miraculous turnaround from the steady, downward trend this team's been going on for several years now, I don't expect Sully to finish the season behind the bench, and I don't think JR is going to be the GM by the time the next draft rolls around--as both sides will agree to mutually part ways, in a nice way of firing the guy.

They should've just gotten it over with instead of gambling another of the precious few years we have left with the big three.

 

[Peat]

Unless there's a borderline miraculous turnaround from the steady, downward trend this team's been going on for several years now, I don't expect Sully to finish the season behind the bench, and I don't think JR is going to be the GM by the time the next draft rolls around--as both sides will agree to mutually part ways, in a nice way of firing the guy.

They should've just gotten it over with instead of gambling another of the precious few years we have left with the big three.

Not so sure on that myself. As long as the stars haven't quit on him - and I know it looks like they just did, but thought the same vs NYI and they didn't next regular season - I think there's a strong chance he'll have a good enough regular season to keep his job. Wait and see on moves but the team should be stronger than last year providing Jarry doesn't regress, his message seems to get through better in the regular season and the trend is actually up in terms of regular season performance, not down.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

Not so sure on that myself. As long as the stars haven't quit on him - and I know it looks like they just did, but thought the same vs NYI and they didn't next regular season - I think there's a strong chance he'll have a good enough regular season to keep his job. Wait and see on moves but the team should be stronger than last year providing Jarry doesn't regress, his message seems to get through better in the regular season and the trend is actually up in terms of regular season performance, not down.

I just think at the slightest hint of anything going south, Sully gets the hook. Like a 3 or 4 game skid will probably be enough, imo.

 

[Peat]

I just think at the slightest hint of anything going south, Sully gets the hook. Like a 3 or 4 game skid will probably be enough, imo.

If his job is that unsafe, they should just fire him now. Since they didn't, I'm dubious that it is.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

If his job is that unsafe, they should just fire him now. Since they didn't, I'm dubious that it is.

I think the firing of the entire staff sans Sully is essentially a warning shot across the bow that if he stumbles with the staff of his choosing, he'll be fired. Maybe I'm too hopeful, but I wouldn't be surprised at all if he's fired a month or two into next season--whenever that may be.

 

[Peat]

I think the firing of the entire staff sans Sully is essentially a warning shot across the bow that if he stumbles with the staff of his choosing, he'll be fired. Maybe I'm too hopeful, but I wouldn't be surprised at all if he's fired a month or two into next season--whenever that may be.

Not sure it's Sully's choice of staff for what it's worth - I suspect that if it was Sullivan's choice he'd have kept what he had, and when Yohe asked Rutherford who'd be appointing the new assistant coaches, Rutherford dodged the question.

It's definitely a warning shot across the bow but I think it'd take a more sustained run than you're saying to sink him - I think he'd need a whole bad month. Could be wrong though.

 

[EightyOne]

My conspiracy theory is that ownership wants to see what even happens. Will the season start again? What will it entail? What happens at draft? Who is injured?

No reason rushing into a new contract with a new coach if hockey might be in limbo again. Or the team construction is still a damn mess anyway.

 

[Pens x]

No reason rushing into a new contract with a new coach if hockey might be in limbo again. Or the team construction is still a damn mess anyway.

The good coaching candidates will get picked over, that’s the issue. I don’t know how the Caps cab keep Reieden.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Where is he living again? I guess he will be a full time coach there.

edit- Fisher Island Florida?

His family lives in Dallas and apparently loves it.

 

[Pittsburgh1776]

The Penguins aren’t going to rebuild while Crosby and Malkin are on this team and playing at the level they still are, and Crosby definitely wouldn’t be ok with that. Isn’t that about as pie in the sky as you can get? That’s why Rutherford’s using terms like ‘re-tool.’ Sullivan’s not going to be fired after a 3 game skid, that’s also completely unrealistic? The thread seems to be turning into another mutually-affirming echo chamber.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

Pinch of salt, as I've only seen Kingerski report this, but apparently the assistants coaches' sacking was a direct result of a call from ownership and they're aware they let Bylsma ride two years too long. Guess we'll see if there's any truth to that this season.

I mean, that might be the case, but it seems kind of weird. If ownership is calling for heads, I'd think they'd look at heads belonging to those who play a more prominent role in the club's fortunes (ie. head coach or GM). Not sure how often a team is held back entirely because of its assistants and not the two guys with more control over the roster.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

I mean, that might be the case, but it seems kind of weird. If ownership is calling for heads, I'd think they'd look at heads belonging to those who play a more prominent role in the club's fortunes (ie. head coach or GM). Not sure how often a team is held back entirely because of its assistants and not the two guys with more control over the roster.

"Well they would have probably won the Stanley Cup that year but the assistant coaches just weren't quite right" is definitely a sentence I've not heard before.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

"Well they would have probably won the Stanley Cup that year but the assistant coaches just weren't quite right" is definitely a sentence I've not heard before.

Exactly. I can't recall a time an analyst or commentator will talk about how a team is great top to bottom EXCEPT for that pesky assistant coach who is causing all those first round exits.

"Great core, great depth, great coach, great GM. But this team will never get over the hump if they don't dump their assistant coach!"

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

Exactly. I can't recall a time an analyst or commentator will talk about how a team is great top to bottom EXCEPT for that pesky assistant coach who is causing all those first round exits.

"Great core, great depth, great coach, great GM. But this team will never get over the hump if they don't dump their assistant coach!"

People can twist, dodge and rationalize all they want but this is simply the team kicking the can down the road.

The assistants are just the coach's droogies, basically. It all goes back to him. This is the team not wanting to make a tough decision while still being all serious-faced and calling it a tough decision.

But again it doesn't much matter to me at this point. Too late in the game to get all bent outta shape, ya know?

 

[Peat]

I mean, that might be the case, but it seems kind of weird. If ownership is calling for heads, I'd think they'd look at heads belonging to those who play a more prominent role in the club's fortunes (ie. head coach or GM). Not sure how often a team is held back entirely because of its assistants and not the two guys with more control over the roster.

It's kind of weird in that I can't say I know of many other circs like this, but at the same time, it's not all that different to the strategy most here want - keep the most important guys with the best track records because they've got faith in them, but move around the guys around them so they have better support. Not saying that is what happened, or that I agree with any such judgments, but the basic principle is roughly the same.