Speculation: Friedman speculates the possibility of Crawford being traded

ColdSteel2

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Aug 27, 2010
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There is no (good) plan for Crow’s replacement. Even the biggest Bowman supporters need to accept the fact we botched the goaltending pipeline. We need to do what we did with the defense with the goaltending. Find a way to get Knight and someone else in this draft and acquire an NHL ready goaltending prospect with a lot of upside.
 

ChiHawks10

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Jul 7, 2009
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There is no (good) plan for Crow’s replacement. Even the biggest Bowman supporters need to accept the fact we botched the goaltending pipeline. We need to do what we did with the defense with the goaltending. Find a way to get Knight and someone else in this draft and acquire an NHL ready goaltending prospect with a lot of upside.

Neither Delia or Nalimov are a good plan to you?
 

Hattrick Kane

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Oct 8, 2018
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I think the only way the Hawks trade Crawford is for overpayment anyway. I don't believe they are just trying to ship him out of town for whatever they can get.
With that being said, if some team does get desperate and offers something ridiculous, you take that offer and don’t think twice about it.
 

b1e9a8r5s

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I would rather they address goalie when they have everything else figured out.

Yeah, I think that's right. That being said, I'd probably just hang onto Crow this year, unless someone knocks your socks off. See what the team looks like next year. Heck, I wouldn't rule out bringing Crow back, although I wouldn't commit to that yet.
 

ColdSteel2

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Aug 27, 2010
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Neither Delia or Nalimov are a good plan to you?

I think between the 2, we’ll find our backup. But no, not good enough when we need a top end starter to replace Crow. I like Nalimov a lot more than Delia and think he has a shot to be a starter in this league. I don’t know that he is coming over though. And I prefer to go the traditional route of having the starter in waiting cut his teeth for 2 or 3 seasons as a backup behind the incumbent and we are not set up to do that either.
 

AmericanDream

Thank you Elon!
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I think between the 2, we’ll find our backup. But no, not good enough when we need a top end starter to replace Crow. I like Nalimov a lot more than Delia and think he has a shot to be a starter in this league. I don’t know that he is coming over though. And I prefer to go the traditional route of having the starter in waiting cut his teeth for 2 or 3 seasons as a backup behind the incumbent and we are not set up to do that either.
whoever the Flyers release just go get that guy and problem solved, we have our #1 goalie lol....
 

LordKOTL

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I'm not sure if the Hawks would get a 1st for Crow honestly. That's not a reflection on Crow, but the goalie market itself. I could see it going either way. He'd get more than Jimmy Howard though, that much I'm confident of.
Exactly. Taking Seattle into consideration you have 32 starting goalie slots in the league--64 goalie slots total. The goalie trade market in my observations is always bad and never a seller's market. Yes, teams need starters, but there are almost always teams willing to depart with an "overpaid" goalie because they have a young upstart waiting

i have never heard that term before..... me likes it. :nod:
Remember it when you need a SFW version of "S***Show" :D

Let's think logically about Crow ...

1. The Hawks really have no succession plan for Crow. We're going to to have to pay a lot or use a high draft pick for a goalie next year if Crow is traded. So trading Crow is not as easy from a long term strategic perspective. The Hawks need to have a Plan B.
It's worse than that: goaltenders as a rule develop the slowest. A big issue on D for us right now is we got old worn-out vets and our top D prospects are so green they need mowing--i.e. a few years out at best. Even Joker is a few years out from being a force--if he ever makes it there; and he's further along than Boqvist, Mitchell, & Beaudin. Delia & Nalimov are in all likelihood even further back. Keith & Seabs took years to become forces. Crawford and Anderson: even longer. Thus, the "high draft pick" route is a non-starter IMHO. Odds are strongly against getting an NHL-ready netminder in the top-10 in the draft--much less one that can play behind this team D.

2. Crow only has 1.5 years left on his contract @$6mn per. His contract is not paralyzing for the Hawks. The Hawks have some leverage.
Exactly, but this works both ways per my reply to @b1e9a8r5s : There are teams out there who would look to jettison their starter--like Howard. Crawford could fetch more, but that cuts both ways--the receiving team doesn't have to dish out as much to get Howard, and with good enough defense the difference in assets needed between Howard and Crawford might not be worth it.

3. Crow has a NMC. Although there is only 1.5 years left, he will probably only waive it for a contender. So let's forget about the crappy teams who might have interest.
Speculation and rumor--but at one point one thing mentioned in the media about one of Crawford's NMC clauses was, "only if he's the starter". So, that could further complicate matters. Sure, we never know what a player will waive for--or even if they will. But consideration has to be paid to that fact--Crawford may not waive to go to a contender if he has to play second banana.

4. The return for Crow is volatile. It only takes one team to give up a 1st rounder. That said, who is the opposing GM? Are they desperate to win? Will Crow push them over for a Cup? Does the GM have a track record for trading young asssets? Are their jobs on the line this year? For example, who is Philly's GM and what's his deal?
Again: if a team is a contender would they want to part with (hypothetically) a 1st for Crawford--a late 1st, or possibly a 2nd for Howard? If the team is a contender, you can expect them to have good, if not great defense. Behind that defense is the difference that great. Crawford may steal more games than Howard but a good team would need less games stolen for them.

5. Does the opposing team have cap space? What contract will we have to take back if not? No long term bad contracts.
Exactly. The 'hawks have to be picky about the return for Dr. Craw...or anyone for that matter. If we (hypothetically) find a taker for Seabs that has a similar cap hit, but is only one year less--is it worth it? IMHO they need to be keeping the cap open for guys like Debrincat and (if they develop) Joker, Boqvist, etc.--not kicking the can down the road.

6. Trading Crow in order to secure more lottery balls might be the bigger incentive. Lose for Hughes.
No lottery ball is ever guaranteed. see also: Cam Ward. Se also: Kyle Beach. See also: Jack Skille Our picks have to actually pan out for it to be worth it.

7. Belichick never distinguishes the value of a draft pick by first or second round. He assigns the value by number. The 24th pick is not much different than the 36th pick. If a first round pick is top 10 protected ... it's not hugely different from a 2nd round pick.
Hockey not being football notwithstanding, picks have to pan out as I mentioned. If you take Crawford and trade him for a late 1st, you'll need that quality of player to come back at least for enough time to do damage. In Crawford you got a top-10 goalie...easy. That value has to be equaled or bested in terms of what comes out of it. In recent memory: The jury is out on Joker. El Gato would be decent in terms of acquisition. Schmaltz wouldn't be worth it. Hartman wouldn't be worth it. T²? Maybe but we didn't hang onto him. Hartman wasn't worth it. Danault didn't stay and Clendening IMHO wouldn't be worth it. McNeil wasn't worth it. Have you heard *anything* from Rensfeldt? Kevin Hayes never stuck. Olsen wouldn't be worth it. Beach was higher but arguably the 2nd worst draft pick we've had in recent memory. Lalonde was a bust. Makarov was a bust, Blunden was a bust. Bolland was good for awhile then fell off the face of the earth. Bickell had his moments. Garlock was a nobody.

Those are the picks the 'hawks have done in the realm of a late 1st/early 2nd. IMHO more misses than hits. That has to be taken under consideration: Moving Crawford for a pick that doesn't pan out can be as bad as losing him for nothing in the UFA market. Not every trade-for-a-pick works out to be Dr. Karpotszev for the pick that brought us Hjammer.


8. Is Crow fully healthy? Our defense sucks so I wouldn't take too much stock in his goals against this year.
Crawford is not as sharp this year in a vacuum. Maybe not 2012 bad but not 2015, 2017, and definitely not 2013, 2016 or 2018 good. The team D may suck like MegaMaid™ but it's definitely not like last year where the team D sucked and still Crawford was lights-out. There may be some consideration but on the flipside he's not as sharp as before his concussion.
 

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It’s going to be very difficult for a young defense to learn and grow without stability in net. A tandem of stopgap goalie and Delia/Nalimov next year isn’t going to be enough.
 

LordKOTL

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It’s going to be very difficult for a young defense to learn and grow without stability in net. A tandem of stopgap goalie and Delia/Nalimov next year isn’t going to be enough.

Somehow Keith & Seabrook did it with an oft-injured Khabi, Lalime, and a rotation of Anderson, Boucher, plus a green-as-Delia Anderson, Munro, & Crawford, and eventually an average Neimi and Huet.

It just might take longer than if they had quality in net.

I think Crawford would be the best option there, too. But if the deal is golden...
 
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SotasicA

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Aug 25, 2014
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Thanks for the valuable input. What’s your take on Jimmy Howard?
Has better stats and is on a cheaper, expiring contract. A much safer choice if you want to take a flyer on a goalie. A playoff team might want a backup like him.

As for Howard for the Hawks next summer? No. Hang on to Crow. The devil you know.
 

AmericanDream

Thank you Elon!
Oct 24, 2005
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Has better stats and is on a cheaper, expiring contract. A much safer choice if you want to take a flyer on a goalie. A playoff team might want a backup like him.

As for Howard for the Hawks next summer? No. Hang on to Crow. The devil you know.
so the guy statistically worse than Crow throughout his career, who has won nothing as a pro is the guy to get????
 
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SotasicA

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so the guy statistically worse than Crow throughout his career, who has won nothing as a pro is the guy to get????
No, I don't want him. Never liked him.

To a contender, he hakes more sense as a backup for this coming spring though.
 

piteus

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Dec 20, 2015
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Somehow Keith & Seabrook did it with an oft-injured Khabi, Lalime, and a rotation of Anderson, Boucher, plus a green-as-Delia Anderson, Munro, & Crawford, and eventually an average Neimi and Huet.

It just might take longer than if they had quality in net.

I think Crawford would be the best option there, too. But if the deal is golden...
I agree with you. I'm not jumping up and down to trade Crow UNLESS it's a very good return. His contract is affordable (length and money) and we have no succession plan.

I see a succession plan on our blue line ... and Keith and Seabrook's contracts don't match our rebuilding timeline. Unfrotunately, I just don't see other teams jumping up and down to trade for them.

First things first. Get Ansimov healthy and shop him. He's one contract we can get rid of and perhaps get something in return. I'm going to say Saad played himself off the trading block. He's played well for the Hawks. I still have my questions about Murphy. That said, he'll have to prove his back is okay and be a consistent top 4 DMen to get traded. If Murphy can prove he is a top 4, why trade him though?
 

piteus

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Dec 20, 2015
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he does...that management team wants to make a statement, that would be it...plenty of young assets to get there as well..
Chuck Fletcher was just hired by the Flyers after a decade of heading the Wild. He has time on his side. He won't be making any deals to save his job. That said, they need a goalie. However, I have a feeling Fletcher still has his eyes firmly toward the future.

The Flyers is currently estimated to have $8.1mn of cap space. They are projected to have $32mn of cap space next year (I don't know who they have to re sign). So they have the space to trade for Crow.
 

AmericanDream

Thank you Elon!
Oct 24, 2005
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Chuck Fletcher was just hired by the Flyers after a decade of heading the Wild. He has time on his side. He won't be making any deals to save his job. That said, they need a goalie. However, I have a feeling Fletcher still has his eyes firmly toward the future.

The Flyers is currently estimated to have $8.1mn of cap space. They are projected to have $32mn of cap space next year (I don't know who they have to re sign). So they have the space to trade for Crow.
well the reason why Fletcher is there is because Hextall didn't make those big moves for today/right now...Executive Management was frustrated with Hextall with holding on to the assets he had and not trying to "go in" for the playoffs. I am not saying Fletcher is here to go nuts, but making moves to get the team into the playoffs is priority #1 for this team it seems. A #1 goalie is that pressing need, either Crow or Howard would be the most logical targets for them....
 

piteus

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well the reason why Fletcher is there is because Hextall didn't make those big moves for today/right now...Executive Management was frustrated with Hextall with holding on to the assets he had and not trying to "go in" for the playoffs. I am not saying Fletcher is here to go nuts, but making moves to get the team into the playoffs is priority #1 for this team it seems. A #1 goalie is that pressing need, either Crow or Howard would be the most logical targets for them....
Did Fletcher make big moves with the Wild? Does he have a penchant for the splash transaction?

Good color on Hextall and why the Flyers moved on from him. Apart from a first rounder, are there good prospects that the Flyers are shopping?
 
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Hattrick Kane

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well the reason why Fletcher is there is because Hextall didn't make those big moves for today/right now...Executive Management was frustrated with Hextall with holding on to the assets he had and not trying to "go in" for the playoffs. I am not saying Fletcher is here to go nuts, but making moves to get the team into the playoffs is priority #1 for this team it seems. A #1 goalie is that pressing need, either Crow or Howard would be the most logical targets for them....
Plus there’s no guarantee Hart is ready to go next year. Neuvirth and Elliott are both free agents and I doubt either are retained. Trading for Crawford helps bridge the gap, someone who can be reliable.

I’ll take a first and Myers for him :)
 
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AmericanDream

Thank you Elon!
Oct 24, 2005
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Did Fletcher make big moves with the Wild? Does he have a penchant for the splash transaction?

Good color on Hextall and why the Flyers moved on from him. Apart from a first rounder, are there good prospects that the Flyers are shopping?
Fletcher did make some moves there...I wouldn't call getting Crow or Howard a big splash per se, but I get what you are saying..Fletcher is a guy that does not sit idle, meaning he will make moves, they might not be huge but he does pull the trigger and I would be shocked that he is here to do nothing this deadline...why fire Hextall if Fletcher is going to stand still??
 

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