Friedman: NHL and NHLPA "quietly renegotiating CBA" (upd: neither party opts out for 2020)

[Bookie21]

Is there a reason why the PA couldn’t negotiate to play in the Olympics for an extended CBA? I don’t see how the owners didn’t just make out like bandits.

The owners offered Olympic participation to the players for an extended CBA a while back .........the players balked. Now they've extended it, and got nothing in return. Good job Fehr.....or is it that the players don't want Olympic participation?

 

[gstommylee]

The owners offered Olympic participation to the players for an extended CBA a while back .........the players balked. Now they've extended it, and got nothing in return. Good job Fehr.....or is it that the players don't want Olympic participation?

It was never extended fall of 2022 was always when the CBA was gonna expire September 2019 was when they could have opted out early thus the CBA would have ended by next september.

 

[ES]

NHL's offer was to extend current CBA to 2025 and presumably that would have removed NHLPA's recent opt-out as well.

 

[gstommylee]

NHL's offer was to extend current CBA to 2025 and presumably that would have removed NHLPA's recent opt-out as well.

Nothing has been agreed to as of yet.

 

[LadyStanley]

Um..that's FORMER owner, but still governor of the Boston Bruins, Pierre.

 

[gstommylee]

Um..that's FORMER owner, but still governor of the Boston Bruins, Pierre.

Doesn't Jacobs have like a small % if the team still?

 

[LadyStanley]

Doesn't Jacobs have like a small % if the team still?

Nope. Still getting income from team/company, but no NHL ownership.

 

[oknazevad]

I thought he retained 1%, the minimum needed to continue as a governor, as a team's governor must be at least a part owner.

 

[LadyStanley]

I thought he retained 1%, the minimum needed to continue as a governor, as a team's governor must be at least a part owner.

I don't believe that's a NHL rule. (Probably in the constitution/bylaws somewhere. Thought I had copy of NHL constitution; turns out its the NHLPA constitution.)

Do you have a reference on that?

 

[SK13]

The owners offered Olympic participation to the players for an extended CBA a while back .........the players balked. Now they've extended it, and got nothing in return. Good job Fehr.....or is it that the players don't want Olympic participation?

The NHL was always going to China because they want to sell merch to a billion Chinese over the next handful of decades. The NHL may undersell their desire to go to China and may make a league driven World Cup as part of a new CBA to ensure participation every 4 years, but Donald Fehr and co. will have never looked at Olympic participation as a real concession for the league to make in 2022.

 

[Tom ServoMST3K]

Is there a reason why the PA couldn’t negotiate to play in the Olympics for an extended CBA? I don’t see how the owners didn’t just make out like bandits.

Because Olympics is a red herring issue.

The PA knows the NHL is going to China, and participation in olympics that aren't china or North America are more about the IIHF and IOC than the NHL.

 

[Ted Hoffman]

Because Olympics is a red herring issue.

The PA knows the NHL is going to China, and participation in olympics that aren't china or North America are more about the IIHF and IOC than the NHL.

While I do agree that the NHL is probably going to China (for purely marketing purposes; editorial comment on the efficacy of that omitted), I don't know that the support for it among the Board of Governors is as strong as one might think. Some of the same concerns from '18 and prior also apply to '22 and none of them have been addressed.

 

[MNNumbers]

While I do agree that the NHL is probably going to China (for purely marketing purposes; editorial comment on the efficacy of that omitted), I don't know that the support for it among the Board of Governors is as strong as one might think. Some of the same concerns from '18 and prior also apply to '22 and none of them have been addressed.

I completely agree with this. Future hopeful marketing is the only reason to go.

All the things about the IOC, and how it monopolizes everything including images from the Games mean there is little incentive.

North American games would be different.

 

[Tom ServoMST3K]

While I do agree that the NHL is probably going to China (for purely marketing purposes; editorial comment on the efficacy of that omitted), I don't know that the support for it among the Board of Governors is as strong as one might think. Some of the same concerns from '18 and prior also apply to '22 and none of them have been addressed.

the PA advocates for that for publicity purposes only, IMO.

They know Olympics participation would happen if the IOC and IIHF actually worked with the NHL.

the public, and a bunch of hockey journalists blame the NHL more than anyone else for some reason.

 

[Tawnos]

the PA advocates for that for publicity purposes only, IMO.

They know Olympics participation would happen if the IOC and IIHF actually worked with the NHL.

the public, and a bunch of hockey journalists blame the NHL more than anyone else for some reason.

I've never gotten much of a sense of "blame" from any corners beyond the NHL being who ultimately made the decision.

 

[LadyStanley]

Hmmm

 

[Llama19]

Salary cap economics squeezing out NHL's middle class

www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nhl/2019/09/19/salary-cap-economics-squeezing-out-nhls-middle-class/40171571/

 

[Ted Hoffman]

Salary cap economics squeezing out NHL's middle class

www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nhl/2019/09/19/salary-cap-economics-squeezing-out-nhls-middle-class/40171571/

I wish I could go dig out all the posts where I and a few others mentioned that the NHLPA, if guys were left to their own selfish choices, would create a salary structure that did exactly this - which is exactly what we've seen happen in the NFL and NBA.

That it's happening is not a surprise. What is a surprise is how long it took to finally take place in earnest.

 

[Ted Hoffman]

Maybe it was posted and I missed it, or maybe it wasn't posted. Frank Seravalli has an article talking about how to get all the RFAs signed without them missing training camp and/or the regular season.

https://www.tsn.ca/one-potential-rfas-solution-move-up-deadline-1.1368213

I'm not opposed to moving up current the December 1 date to October 1, September 15, whatever, especially given comments from voices quoted in the article. I don't know that it will push any of the signings to get done earlier - you'll just have them now go down to the deadline of whatever new date is chosen - but at least we'll get finality earlier. I was trying to come up with some way of triggering an automatic contract + guarantee of arbitration for RFAs coming off their ELC who don't have a deal done by a certain point, but I don't have perfect language on it and I'm still thinking through all the potential issues that might be raised (and how to minimize those).

[This entire "let's string out the contract negotiation and signing process of one of our really good players who happens to be RFA and not arbitration-eligible" thing falls under my ever-expanding comment, "why do supposedly easy things have to be made so goddamn difficult?" If the number on August 15 is what it's going to be on September 15, September 30, November 15, and November 30 at 11:59pm Eastern, why the hell can't two sides just get a deal done early and move on instead of figuratively stonewalling over $5?]

 

[Ted Hoffman]

I've never gotten much of a sense of "blame" from any corners beyond the NHL being who ultimately made the decision.

The players and IIHF blame the owners for not letting the players go.

The owners blame the IIHF for not providing protection for the owners if [when] the players get hurt and for providing little to nothing in the way of financial gain when the players do let go to play. (At least proportionate to the percentage of NHL players who comprise the Olympic rosters.)

 

[MNNumbers]

And the owners blame the Z

The players and IIHF blame the owners for not letting the players go.

The owners blame the IIHF for not providing protection for the owners if [when] the players get hurt and for providing little to nothing in the way of financial gain when the players do let go to play. (At least proportionate to the percentage of NHL players who comprise the Olympic rosters.)

And the owners blame the IOC because the NHL is not allowed to use any Olympic footage of anyone, including their own players, for make purposes, without paying through the nose for the privilege.

 

[LadyStanley]

31 Thoughts: Byfuglien decision will have major ripple effect - Sportsnet.ca

From Thursday. Some negotiating wiips.

Friedman has some speculation the NHL and NHLPA might set salary limits well in advance based on normal growth. Perhaps $83.5m for 20-21 and $85.5m for 21-22. As a partial way of controlling escrow.

 

[oknazevad]

I don't believe that's a NHL rule. (Probably in the constitution/bylaws somewhere. Thought I had copy of NHL constitution; turns out its the NHLPA constitution.)

Do you have a reference on that?

I do know that the story about him passing ownership to his kids did say he retained a small nominal percentage. Beyond that may just be my inference. But that he still has 1% has been stated.

 

[Ted Hoffman]

31 Thoughts: Byfuglien decision will have major ripple effect - Sportsnet.ca

From Thursday. Some negotiating wiips.

Friedman has some speculation the NHL and NHLPA might set salary limits well in advance based on normal growth. Perhaps $83.5m for 20-21 and $85.5m for 21-22. As a partial way of controlling escrow.

The lower assumption for growth for 2019-20 was designed to partially control escrow. They're going to .... what, estimate projected growth at near zero and just take the actual growth as the counter-balance to escrow?

I swear, it's like they are trying to come up with incredibly contrived solutions to a problem. I'm really surprised they haven't invented a "problem" that needs a "solution" that really just creates more problems that need solved and get ignored until someone finally screams over it.

 

[LadyStanley]

https://www.espn.com/nhl/story/_/id/27687452/knights-schmidt-seeking-revision-ped-testing

VGK's Schmidt (suspended for 20 games due to PED testing at a level so low it couldn't provide any performance enhancement) is working with NHLPA to review testing standards as part of CBA negotiations.