Free Agency XIII | All Pens FA News, Legit FA Rumors, Trade Ideas Here ‎

[mpp9]

Could not disagree more that more skill, of all things, is needed in the bottom six. If anything, there are two too many skill guys potentially there now. Replace Sutter with Stoll or Staal or any other mutant center that can skate and the third line probably improves.

The next issue of concern with the current crop of forwards is a lack of speed as a group. After that, it would be size.

That the third and fourth line aren't fancy enough shouldn't register on anyone's radar as something that could be construed as problematic in the slightest.

I agree. A big fast capable top 6 forward is what we're lacking most. Ideally, that player is Evander Kane.

 

[AjaxTelamon]

Could not disagree more that more skill, of all things, is needed in the bottom six. If anything, there are two too many skill guys potentially there now. Replace Sutter with Stoll or Staal or any other mutant center that can skate and the third line probably improves.

The next issue of concern with the current crop of forwards is a lack of speed as a group. After that, it would be size.

That the third and fourth line aren't fancy enough shouldn't register on anyone's radar as something that could be construed as problematic in the slightest.

I agree 100%. I just don't see a lack of skill to be an issue anywhere in the lineup aside from a top 6 winger. We could greatly benefit from a Ryan. But it is very difficult to acquire those players. So realistically speaking, our best chance at adding legit top 6 skill is going to come from the development of Bennett and Kapanen and/or from overpaying for a Ryan type in FA in maybe two years when the cap opens up for us. We'll need to use the 2009 blueprint again this year, looking for a Guerin-esque pickup at the deadline, or else hoping that Downie and Bennett both have great years and can fill out our top 6.

We could trade a Maatta or a Despres (assuming he plays well) for a good young player with upside, but can we realistically afford to unload either of those guys considering all we have next year in terms of vet D is Letang and Scuderi under contract? I just don't see that as a viable option.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

Still say McGinn or a similar player is all we need if Bennett and Downie have good years. We'll have that playmaking element. We could use another potential longterm LWer with size and a hard shot.

The more I read about what MJ wants to do, the less I worry about adding another high end player. I think having wingers who can cause havoc around the net and create space down low are the most important traits.

You still need skill in order to execute at a high level, and in order to convert when that execution works how it's supposed to. The Kings and Blackhawks execute very well, but it works because they also have the skill to convert those chances.

It also ignores the fact one of the biggest problems with this team recently is that teams could focus in on Crosby and Malkin, double and triple team them, and then dare the rest of the forwards to burn them. Adding more skill immediately acts as a deterrent for that as a strategy.

I'm not saying the team needs 4 all-star wingers who can stickhandle in a phone booth, but I don't agree at all that adding more high end skill isn't paramount. Crosby and Malkin being smothered these past few playoffs is proof enough for me that adding a skill element to their line is still crucial.

 

[billybudd]

Man, Kane does tick a bunch of boxes for this team doesn't he?

 

[Ogrezilla]

Could not disagree more that more skill, of all things, is needed in the bottom six. If anything, there are two too many skill guys potentially there now. Replace Sutter with Stoll or Staal or any other mutant center that can skate and the third line probably improves.

The next issue of concern with the current crop of forwards is a lack of speed as a group. After that, it would be size.

That the third and fourth line aren't fancy enough shouldn't register on anyone's radar as something that could be construed as problematic in the slightest.

Being skilled and being fancy are not the same thing. Downie is currently the most skilled player in our bottom 6, and he is far from fancy. I don't think its a huge problem in the bottom 6, but I can definitely see a line of Spaling-Sutter-Dupuis struggling to score a bit. Spaling going to the net is great, but both Sutter and Dupuis are shoot first offensively. They will look a lot like Sutter, TK and Cooke did. They could really use someone to carry and pass the puck. It doesn't need to be someone fancy, someone like Downie would help quite a bit.

And yes, if you replace Sutter with a better player, the 3rd line gets better. You know Stoll and Staal are both more skilled than Sutter, right?

 

[Ogrezilla]

I agree. A big fast capable top 6 forward is what we're lacking most. Ideally, that player is Evander Kane.

How many big fast capable top 6 forwards are there? How many of them are even remotely available? There's Evander Kane, and then there's...who?

 

[billybudd]

Being skilled and being fancy are not the same thing. Downie is currently the most skilled player in our bottom 6, and he is far from fancy.

And yes, if you replace Sutter with a better player, the 3rd line gets better. Brilliant deduction there. You know Stoll and Staal are both more skilled than Sutter, right?

Downie's competitiveness got him to the show. With his level of skill and Kobasew's level of fire, Downie's in the minors.

And no, Jordan Staal and Jarrett Stoll are not more "skilled" than Sutter. They're better, but it isn't because they have a higher "skill" level. If you set up a cone slalom or a breakaway drill, Sutter would embarrass both of them.

 

[Ogrezilla]

Downie's competitiveness got him to the show. With his level of skill and Kobasew's level of fire, Downie's in the minors.

And no, Jordan Staal and Jarrett Stoll are not more "skilled" than Sutter. They're better, but it isn't because they have a higher "skill" level. If you set up a cone slalom or a breakaway drill, Sutter would embarrass both of them.

I think you are underestimating Downie and Staal quite a bit. Downie is the best passer of anyone in our bottom 6, and its really not that close. And Staal is just a better player than Sutter in almost every way. Maybe Sutter can stickhandle better, but Staal is a better shooter and passer. Stickhandling isn't the only skill that exists.

 

[billybudd]

I love Jordan Staal and don't much like Sutter, but Jordan Staal is not a better shooter than Brandon Sutter. His release takes longer, his shot is less accurate, his shot isn't as hard and, unlike Sutter, he has no backhand to speak of. Staal is also a worse passer (though Sutter isn't anything to write home about).

What Staal IS is something like 60 pounds heavier, perhaps twice as strong and rangier due to the fact that he uses a stick that's enormous for even a 6'5 player. That's why Staal is more effective. None of that has thing one to do with "skill."

 

[AjaxTelamon]

And no, Jordan Staal and Jarrett Stoll are not more "skilled" than Sutter. They're better, but it isn't because they have a higher "skill" level. If you set up a cone slalom or a breakaway drill, Sutter would embarrass both of them.

Yeah I'm with you here. Sutter's skill level is above average for a 3rd line center, and higher in most objective measures than Stoll or Staal. That being said, I'd prefer Stoll or Staal irrespective of cap hits.

I think you are underestimating Downie and Staal quite a bit. Downie is the best passer of anyone in our bottom 6, and its really not that close. And Staal is just a better player than Sutter in almost every way. Maybe Sutter can stickhandle better, but Staal is a better shooter and passer. Stickhandling isn't the only skill that exists.

I do think Downie brings more to the table than his grit and fire, I like his playmaking abilities and think they can help our centers up and down the lineup.

 

[mpp9]

Kane-Crosby-Downie man. Poor man's/Salary cap era's version of Stevens-Lemieux-Tocchet.

 

[66-30-33]

Man, Kane does tick a bunch of boxes for this team doesn't he?

Yes but i think Wheeler would be a better fit with his speed and hands. Kane would be another tough guy for us though and likely be a 30G man on a line with Crosby. Getting Kane would allow Kunitz to play with Malkin and Hornqvist. Kane with Crosby and Downie/BB (they can both switch it up). Wont need to talk about Stewart anymore who's a poor mans Kane?

 

[M0NTY26]

Are we talking about Kane because he hates wpg, or are we talking about him, because there are rumors circulating?

 

[Ogrezilla]

Are we talking about Kane because he hates wpg, or are we talking about him, because there are rumors circulating?

because he hates winnipeg and we need someone exactly like him. I still think its very unlikely to happen.

 

[pensfan71]

So the big Ek has us talking to the Habs bout Sutter....let's ASSUME this is true for discussion's sakes...

What could feasibly be on it way back?

 

[Riptide]

Are we talking about Kane because he hates wpg, or are we talking about him, because there are rumors circulating?

I think they're both the same thing. The only remote reason that Kane might even potentially be available is because of the perceived issues between him and Winnipegs management. The rumors are there due to those perceived issues.

I think any talk of other Jets is a waste of time. Sure I'd like them (along with many other players in the league), but they're not going to be traded. Kane probably won't be either... and if he is, it's not likely to us... but I do think he could be had in the right deal.

 

[Ogrezilla]

So the big Ek has us talking to the Habs bout Sutter....let's ASSUME this is true for discussion's sakes...

What could feasibly be on it way back?

Parenteau?

 

[Riptide]

So the big Ek has us talking to the Habs bout Sutter....let's ASSUME this is true for discussion's sakes...

What could feasibly be on it way back?

From Montreal's POV? One of Prust/Moen and someone like Bournival. Or perhaps PAP or Bourque. There's not a lot of players that make sense. Patches, Gally and Gallagher just aren't going to happen (even with us adding). I see them looking to move someone like PAP or Bourque, or a vet and a younger player.

Someone like PAP might make sense. He has his issues, but he does have some skill. Less of a fan of Bourque.

 

[pensfan71]

Didn't they just add PAP though?

 

[Riptide]

Didn't they just add PAP though?

They wanted to move Briere. Colorado wanted to move PAP, but settled for Briere because his contract is shorter (1yr vs 2).

 

[drpepper]

Again with the obsession with E Kane. The issues between E Kane and WPG seem overstated. And, if in the remote possibility E Kane will be moved, the Jets need top 6 young talent which the Pens don't have unless they gut their prospects and picks. Other teams will be able to offer better packages.

Are there other players who might be available for something that the Pens have and/or could afford?

 

[Waffle Fries]

Why would the Habs possibly want Sutter? They have three centers that are equal or better than him and that's not including Galchenyuk.

 

[Shady Machine]

First of all I don't advocate trading Maatta for Kyle Palmieri. I see him as a guy who's benefitted greatly from playing with lots of good playmakers in ANA and from what I've seen from his highlight reels he projects as a Kunitz-like forward. Nichuskin on the other hand has shown that despite playing with elite playmakers like Seguin he can create space for himself and more importantly, can draw coverage away from stars (this would be HUGE for 87 and 71). He's also an incredible skater, and could thrive in MJ's new system.

I'm using Nichuskin strictly as an example to show we should that we should move one of the top-end talents now. In regards to the 3 high-value young pieces we have on D (Maatta, Pouliot, Despres), obviously, you'd ideally like to move Despres and keep the other 2. However, the value dropoff between Maatta and Despres is big enough IMO to warrant a winger much more worth our while.

I'm not saying it makes sense for the Stars to trade him, but crazier things have happened involving Dallas front office.



When is the last time the Pens had a winger with moves like that?

Damn that kid is fun to watch.

 

[NMK11]

I find it funny when people say Kane would fit well here or checks of boxes well. One of the best young wingers would fit here? Really? Would also fit well on 29 other teams.

 

[Shady Machine]

Kane-Crosby-Downie man. Poor man's/Salary cap era's version of Stevens-Lemieux-Tocchet.

Like really, really poor maybe