GDT: Free Agency interview period

[Shaman464]

Holland would be a complete idiot to sign Vanek. He should be fired if he signs him for more than 1 year. And he should be fired into the sun if there's a NTC/NMC tied to any contract he gives out tomorrow. Vanek has hit diminishing returns for trades, and whatever he returns won't be worth what little he provides does to Detroit's draft position.

 

[ShanahanMan]

Holland would be a complete idiot to sign Vanek. He should be fired if he signs him for more than 1 year. And he should be fired into the sun if there's a NTC/NMC tied to any contract he gives out tomorrow. Vanek has hit diminishing returns for trades, and whatever he returns won't be worth what little he provides does to Detroit's draft position.

Not only will he sign Vanek, he'll sign Filppula and Orpik.....probably all to multi year NTC deals. It's totally his MO. He's just in love with seasoned vets in their twilight years.

 

[kliq]

I feel like people are going to have to post "trigger warning" before every move Holland makes tomorrow. Countdown to the meltdowns.

 

[InjuredChoker]

But he hasn't won anything. So is he the billy bean of basketball?

kind of.. it's a bit more complicated because of (soft) cap vs no cap, roster size and how big impact one player can make etc. morey had a medicore team and wasn't allowed to rebuild. so he acquired (stole) james harden from OKC thunder for what was essentially three 1st round picks and a good player. harden won the MVP this past year. last year around this time he made ton of trades what seemed meaningless but then he flipped those assets he acquired along with a 1st rounder for chris paul (top 10-15 player). they were leading GS warriors (who won the title in '15, '17 and '18) in WCF 3-2 but paul got injured and then they lost the final two.. rockets missed 27 consecutive 3 point shots in game 7, lol.

fwiw, sam hinkie, who used to work under morey in houston became philly 76ers GM and executed the most blatant tank in pro sports history (with support of the ownership). they were brutal for 4 years. it was worse than the sabres tank 4-5 yrs ago. NBA basically forced hinkie out 2 years ago.

i'd say yzerman is pretty good comp. they inherited very different situations as GMs but both are smart and though they have made mistakes, they usually make the right call and despite not winning it all, they are considered among the best GMs in the game.

 

[Lil Sebastian Cossa]

Absolutely. The notion that Helm and Holland might no longer be BFFs if nobody takes him on waivers is part of why this front office isn't the long term answer in the first place.

Sometimes I don’t understand the mental gymnastics that are done to hate on this front office. Every NHL franchise tends to avoid waiving players who aren’t dime a dozen fourth liners and bottom pairing D making league minimum unless they’re so bad at hockey or in the locker room that they actively hurt the team. Not the “hurt the team” you ascribe to Darren Helm but like wreck the team nonsense like the alleged Hoffman situation.

It’s fine if you hate the front office. Just don’t use stuff that quite literally all franchises avoid as a reason.

 

[KJoe88]

Not only will he sign Vanek, he'll sign Filppula and Orpik.....probably all to multi year NTC deals. It's totally his MO. He's just in love with seasoned vets in their twilight years.

Wow.

If I’ve ever read an overreaction post.

 

[Pavels Dog]

I called it. I so called it. They're trying to weasel out of the rebuild now that they've got a little bit of talent.

Sigh. Aren't we over this? They are NOT going to sit in the media and say "we plan on being really bad. It's going to be ugly. Anyone who watches will be disgusted and bored. Not trying to win, we want to lose. Our young talent is bad, and we won't sign any veterans to help out.".

Signing Vanek and Green to short-term deals is NOT trying to "weasel out of a rebuild". Inserting Zadina, Rasmussen and Hronek into the lineup is NOT trying to weasel out of a rebuild, even though it likely hurts our draft position and it would be better to fill those spots with veterans.

If they trade some prospects and draft picks for established players, if they hand out some 5+ year contracts to players who are 27-32 year old, if they try some desperate attempt at getting Tavares... these things could be seen as trying to end the rebuild. Not f*cking signing Tomas f*cking Vanek.

Today is going to be ugly on this board. Ken Holland signs 14th forward to 1-year deal? "I KNEW IT HE DOESN'T WANT TO REBUILD ALL THE KIDS ARE BLOCKED".

 

[jkutswings]

Sometimes I don’t understand the mental gymnastics that are done to hate on this front office. Every NHL franchise tends to avoid waiving players who aren’t dime a dozen fourth liners and bottom pairing D making league minimum unless they’re so bad at hockey or in the locker room that they actively hurt the team. Not the “hurt the team” you ascribe to Darren Helm but like wreck the team nonsense like the alleged Hoffman situation.

It’s fine if you hate the front office. Just don’t use stuff that quite literally all franchises avoid as a reason.

If all franchises did the annual routine of hyping youth, then overloading on washed up vets, I could see your point. But when other teams avoid using waivers, it's because they don't have this many guys on bad deals, where it would benefit the team to just free a roster spot and associated cap room.

Helm definitely isn't the worst guy they have. But if waivers could alleviate one of the plethora of anchors they have on the books, why not use it?

 

[Pavels Dog]

If all franchises did the annual routine of hyping youth, then overloading on washed up vets, I could see your point. But when other teams avoid using waivers, it's because they don't have this many guys on bad deals, where it would benefit the team to just free a roster spot and associated cap room.

Helm definitely isn't the worst guy they have. But if waivers could alleviate one of the plethora of anchors they have on the books, why not use it?

they will, when they need it.

Right now people are assuming multiple things:

- Every rumored signing will happen
- Every kid will come into camp and look great, outplaying every depth veteran
- There won't be roster spots for all of them
- No one will be traded/waived to make room
- The veterans will be somehow worse than our prospects, but at the same time so good that they hurt our draft position, some kind of paradox that I have yet to understand

 

[TheMule93]

 

[ChadS]

I know they were looking for a #3 goalie, but Säteri should be good enough to be a backup. Getting ready for a Bernier & Säteri duo?

 

[WingNut]

Only way I am cool with Vanek is if they trade Gus. If they move Gus and AA for say Faulk an for then sign Vanek I would be a fan...but doubt that happens.

 

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

I know they were looking for a #3 goalie, but Säteri should be good enough to be a backup. Getting ready for a Bernier & Säteri duo?

Yep hopefully that means Jimmy is being dealt, Hopefully Lou has interest in him for the Isles.

 

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

Only way I am cool with Vanek is if they trade Gus. If they move Gus and AA for say Faulk an for then sign Vanek I would be a fan...but doubt that happens.

I would love a Nyquist+AA for Faulk get er done Kenny.

 

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

So the best we can hope for, Is another 3rd rounder at the 2019 TDL?

 

[TheRatPoisoner]

So the best we can hope for, Is another 3rd rounder at the 2019 TDL?

Would rater that than what the Nucks got for him the most recent TDL

 

[Snuggs]

Yep hopefully that means Jimmy is being dealt, Hopefully Lou has interest in him for the Isles.

Sateri has some upside imo. He improved his game in the KHL greatly from his early days in the AHL. I think he could legitmately hang as a teams main back up goalie. The last three years he regualarly held somewhere betweeen a .920-.930 save % average. Pretty good imo.

This would be a really good signing/move if they traded Howard and let Brenier and Sateri play it out. IDK what we could get for Howard though, I'd take a 3rd/4th rounder.

 

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

Sateri has some upside imo. He improved his game in the KHL greatly from his early days in the AHL. I think he could legitmately hang as a teams main back up goalie. The last three years he regualarly held somewhere betweeen a .920-.930 save % average. Pretty good imo.

This would be a really good signing/move if they traded Howard and let Brenier and Sateri play it out. IDK what we could get for Howard though, I'd take a 3rd/4th rounder.

Yeah with no retention on Howard a 3rd/4th rounder is pretty fair i would imagine.

 

[Frk It]

Sigh. Aren't we over this? They are NOT going to sit in the media and say "we plan on being really bad. It's going to be ugly. Anyone who watches will be disgusted and bored. Not trying to win, we want to lose. Our young talent is bad, and we won't sign any veterans to help out.".

Signing Vanek and Green to short-term deals is NOT trying to "weasel out of a rebuild". Inserting Zadina, Rasmussen and Hronek into the lineup is NOT trying to weasel out of a rebuild, even though it likely hurts our draft position and it would be better to fill those spots with veterans.

If they trade some prospects and draft picks for established players, if they hand out some 5+ year contracts to players who are 27-32 year old, if they try some desperate attempt at getting Tavares... these things could be seen as trying to end the rebuild. Not f*cking signing Tomas f*cking Vanek.

Today is going to be ugly on this board. Ken Holland signs 14th forward to 1-year deal? "I KNEW IT HE DOESN'T WANT TO REBUILD ALL THE KIDS ARE BLOCKED".

How many 30+ year olds on your team does it take to disqualify you from acting liked a re-building team?

 

[Pavels Dog]

How many 30+ year olds on your team does it take to disqualify you from acting liked a re-building team?

Leafs stacked their roster with a lot of old, garbage players the year they drafted Matthews. Marner and Nylander were both good enough to be in the NHL, as were Brown and others. There's a reason they had record breaking rookie numbers the year they made the playoffs. It was because they were holding kids back a little. There's no rule about the number of youngsters you should have on a roster in order to be rebuilding.

 

[Mister Ed]

Apparently Filppula has moved on to other teams, won't be signing in DET.

 

[Oddbob]

I know they were looking for a #3 goalie, but Säteri should be good enough to be a backup. Getting ready for a Bernier & Säteri duo?

Oh great, I was hoping Larkin was going to get some much needed minutes in net, then they add a guy!

 

[Frk It]

Leafs stacked their roster with a lot of old, garbage players the year they drafted Matthews. Marner and Nylander were both good enough to be in the NHL, as were Brown and others. There's a reason they had record breaking rookie numbers the year they made the playoffs. It was because they were holding kids back a little. There's no rule about the number of youngsters you should have on a roster in order to be rebuilding.

I would like to see some more wiggle room for Hronek/Zadina/Cholowski to make the team than what we currently have.

I know depth was a good thing when we were a playoff team, and we survived a lot of injuries because of it.

But I don’t get know why we are still loading up the roster like this, especially when it involves a good chunk of guys who are 30+. I understand having some “vet presence”, but I thought we were already at the quota there.

 

[Zetterberg4Captain]

Leafs stacked their roster with a lot of old, garbage players the year they drafted Matthews. Marner and Nylander were both good enough to be in the NHL, as were Brown and others. There's a reason they had record breaking rookie numbers the year they made the playoffs. It was because they were holding kids back a little. There's no rule about the number of youngsters you should have on a roster in order to be rebuilding.

thats because they DIDNT already have "old garbage players,"

thats the difference, we already do

if you want to compare, please make sure the rosters are 100% the same dynamic and makeup first

see this is the problem, some posters chose to ignore the fact the DRW have a ton of veteran leadership that are all almost exclusively hometown drafted/developed players. We dont need anymore to help teach anybody anything. we need to in fact create roster spots for young players to mix in with those already here vets, not create obstacles or barriers

 

[Pavels Dog]

I would like to see some more wiggle room for Hronek/Zadina/Cholowski to make the team than what we currently have.

I know depth was a good thing when we were a playoff team, and we survived a lot of injuries because of it.

But I don’t get know why we are still loading up the roster like this, especially when it involves a good chunk of guys who are 30+. I understand having some “vet presence”, but I thought we were already at the quota there.

I'll reserve judgement on how much room we need until seeing if kids are ready. We essentially have room for 2 youngsters day 1 the way things stand right now. Rasmussen/Zadina+Hronek/Hicketts would be my guess. ANY trade or injury opens up room for another kid. Any kid that comes in and has a Larkin-esque camp can steal someone's job. It's just not Holland's MO to assume every kid is going to be ready.

thats because they DIDNT already have "old garbage players,"

thats the difference, we already do

if you want to compare, please make sure the rosters are 100% the same dynamic and makeup first

see this is the problem, some posters chose to ignore the fact the DRW have a ton of veteran leadership that are all almost exclusively hometown drafted/developed players. We dont need anymore to help teach anybody anything. we need to in fact create roster spots for young players to mix in with those already here vets, not create obstacles or barriers

But they did have "old garbage players". They were the worst team in the league because of it. They knew their youngsters were better but chose to be patient with the rebuild and have another bad year to land Matthews. Why do we need to create roster spots for young players? And how many do we need to create? 2? 3? 5? 10? So we can bring in talented kids and get another 10 points in the standings and get a worse draft pick?