Free Agency and Trades Thread: Post deadline wasteland

[scoutsystem]

Had interest in him as a potential C signing, as did many others.

He's a very solid player, and of course it's off to the Hawks

 

[Walshy7]

He's a very solid player, and of course it's off to the Hawks

eh 22 yr old player who only just hit PPG in the DEL? its not the biggest win for the blackhawks. No guarantee he sticks at C either, not sure I would spend an ELC on him we cant fit our own prospects as it is

edit: and did OK in the OHL

 

[scoutsystem]

eh 22 yr old player who only just hit PPG in the DEL? its not the biggest win for the blackhawks. No guarantee he sticks at C either, not sure I would spend an ELC on him we cant fit our own prospects as it is

No not for the leafs you are right there. It was a solid pickup for them though in my opinion, they were somewhat lacking in young prospects

 

[Walshy7]

No not for the leafs you are right there. It was a solid pickup for them though in my opinion, they were somewhat lacking in young prospects

absolutely, the leafs of 2 or 3 years ago would be into a player like this.

Im sorry I think I quoted the wrong person a different poster said he hoped we would sign him

 

[Rare Jewel]

Had interest in him as a potential C signing, as did many others.

I wouldn't have minded him either - but there are other Euro players out there.

 

[hockeynorth]

Johnsson already showing his heart right off the first shift

 

[HoweHullOrr]

I must be missing something. Not much of a cushion especially with the assumptions that Nylander and Marner will only get $6m/year AAV, and that we will banking on Rosen and two other prospects with little or no NHL experience on our blueline. Seems like it wouldn't take much to see that model fall apart?

what about The bonuses that are rolled over from the previous year potentially? right now that could be as much as 3.7 million according to cap geek, you also missed the 1.2 million in retained salary to Kessel and Seattle wont be in the NHL by the 19-20 season so that 85 million number is all speculation.

Ya I knew after I had hit Post Reply that I had missed and not mentioned bonuses. Good catch on the other 2 points as well. No doom & gloom scenario for sure but I'd have to wonder about adding a big ticket forward.

 

[The CyNick]

Isles wanted more than JVR for Hammonic. Who's to say they would not be interested in JVR as a UFA, especially if they fail to sign JT, in which case they will need goals and may want to throw their fans a bone.

They may be interested in him as a FA, but that doesn't mean they would look to trade for him. They would just approach him like everyone else in FA.

 

[Ovate]

I think it's likely that the Leafs sign Roman Polak again in the offseason, not only despite our logjam of bottom pairing defensemen but even because of it.

It forces Carrick/Borgman/Holl/Liljegren to convincingly take his spot in the lineup. Seems like the Babcock way of going about it. Plus we'll have plenty of cap, so the only cost is the contract slot. We could waive him at the beginning of the season if he gets outplayed, and never give him a second thought.

 

[Ovate]

When guessing the size of Marner/Nylander's contracts, keep in mind that the rising cap is going to affect how much they get paid. As well, guys like Pastrnak and Ehlers had each had one good season, but Nylander will have had two, and Marner will most likely have had three. I wouldn't be suprised to see Nylander earn in the 7-7.5M range, and Marner up to 8M (depending on how he plays next year).

 

[SeaOfBlue]

eh 22 yr old player who only just hit PPG in the DEL? its not the biggest win for the blackhawks. No guarantee he sticks at C either, not sure I would spend an ELC on him we cant fit our own prospects as it is

edit: and did OK in the OHL

PPG in the DEL is not bad for a 22 year old, especially when that means being the best young player in the league by a decent amount and one of the top players in the league overall (which does contain a ton of former NHLers no less). Plus he did very well against pretty good competition in the OG. He shouldn't be in the NHL next year probably, but he could turn out much like Aaltonen did.

Doesn't matter too much. Sikura (a Chicago prospect) could still be an option and Jake Evans (MTL prospect) was the guy I thought would have been the best options anyways. I wonder if we could do a Hyman type trade to get their rights early? Both are from Toronto so I doubt they would complain about coming here, and Jake Evans especially seems like the type of center the Leafs would like. Capable defensively and pretty good offensively. However that's not totally different than Toninato and we just let him go as an FA so who knows really.

 

[BlueForever75]

When guessing the size of Marner/Nylander's contracts, keep in mind that the rising cap is going to affect how much they get paid. As well, guys like Pastrnak and Ehlers had each had one good season, but Nylander will have had two, and Marner will most likely have had three. I wouldn't be suprised to see Nylander earn in the 7-7.5M range, and Marner up to 8M (depending on how he plays next year).

At the end of the day Marner and Nylander will be paid what the going rate is to sign a player of their caliber. Cap going up doesn't matter and I do not see how it does. If Pastrnak or Ehlers or Monahann or Gaudrault or others are putting up similar numbers there is no reason to pay them more and these will be the comparable's. Not at all worried.

 

[ToneDog]

I thought Willie was ahead of Marner but have now changed my opinion. Willie, the more prolific goal scorer has put up 14 goals playing with Matthews while Mitch, the playmaker has 19 playing with anybody but Matthews. Willie and Mitch are great but they are not putting up the goals Ehlers (27) and Pasta (27) are and as such $6+M is fair IMO.

 

[BertCorbeau]

I thought Willie was ahead of Marner but have now changed my opinion. Willie, the more prolific goal scorer has put up 14 goals playing with Matthews while Mitch, the playmaker has 19 playing with anybody but Matthews. Willie and Mitch are great but they are not putting up the goals Ehlers (27) and Pasta (27) are and as such $6+M is fair IMO.

Not a fair judgement considering Matthews' has missed 17 games this season. There's also the argument that even when he returned to the line up in early December that he wasn't 100% at the time.

Regardless you're contract comparables are good. Inflation in the cap may see their contracts top out at $6.25/$6.65 AAV though.

 

[MyBudJT]

Not a fair judgement considering Matthews' has missed 17 games this season. There's also the argument that even when he returned to the line up in early December that he wasn't 100% at the time.

Regardless you're contract comparables are good. Inflation in the cap may see their contracts top out at $6.25/$6.65 AAV though.

I'd suggest Nylander's production has been less than both Ehlers and Pastrnak before they signed their contracts... as such, I'd be looking for a 6x6 deal for Nylander.

Marners production is probably warranting more in the 6.5-6.75 range, but he likely won't get re-upped until next year.

 

[Ovate]

At the end of the day Marner and Nylander will be paid what the going rate is to sign a player of their caliber. Cap going up doesn't matter and I do not see how it does. If Pastrnak or Ehlers or Monahann or Gaudrault or others are putting up similar numbers there is no reason to pay them more and these will be the comparable's. Not at all worried.

That's not how it works. A rising cap doesn't mean that all teams have more money to spend, it means that players get higher salaries.

Players of whatever caliber get a certain percentage of cap, rather than a certain dollar amount.

 

[4thline]

That's not how it works. A rising cap doesn't mean that all teams have more money to spend, it means that players get higher salaries.

Players of whatever caliber get a certain percentage of cap, rather than a certain dollar amount.

Yes and no. In a general sense individual salaries due tend to inflate with the cap, but market pressures and some skewed norms can depress salaries and keep that relationship from being linear.

Example- back diving deals (before being outlawed), depressed the cap hits of stars, cascading down the payscale and causing overall salaries to fall out of line % wise with the cap. We're in the middle of the rebound from that now.

 

[BlueForever75]

Why would the Leafs be forced to pay Nylander more then what similar players are being paid???? Makes no sense.

So that means if the cap goes higher again Matthews could get paid more then McDavid??? On what basis. Love the kid, great player....but no McDavid!!!!

I don't buy that players will get paid more because of a cap increase. JVR will get a contract similar to Oshie and for what Marleau signed for. Why??? Because that is the type of player he is.

Both Nylander and Marner will sign for what similar players signed for prior to them. Not a penny more because the cap increases.

 

[showtime8]

Why would the Leafs be forced to pay Nylander more then what similar players are being paid???? Makes no sense.

So that means if the cap goes higher again Matthews could get paid more then McDavid??? On what basis. Love the kid, great player....but no McDavid!!!!

I don't buy that players will get paid more because of a cap increase. JVR will get a contract similar to Oshie and for what Marleau signed for. Why??? Because that is the type of player he is.

Both Nylander and Marner will sign for what similar players signed for prior to them. Not a penny more because the cap increases.

It's the same mentality as housing prices though. If you buy a house this year, 2 years from now the value will have appreciated regardless of the cap or not.

Is Erik Karlsson and Kevin Shattenkirk worth the same amount? Shattenkirk actually makes 50k more than him.

So while it is important to dish out deals similar to others around the league, that shouldn't dictate the end all and be all.

What sort of comparables would the Leafs look at when signing both Nylander and Marner?

 

[realgoodleafs]

I thought Willie was ahead of Marner but have now changed my opinion. Willie, the more prolific goal scorer has put up 14 goals playing with Matthews while Mitch, the playmaker has 19 playing with anybody but Matthews. Willie and Mitch are great but they are not putting up the goals Ehlers (27) and Pasta (27) are and as such $6+M is fair IMO.

We still don't know what Marner will do next year. If he gets 80 points he is going to get paid more than 6 million that is for sure.

 

[Menzinger]

I'd suggest Nylander's production has been less than both Ehlers and Pastrnak before they signed their contracts... as such, I'd be looking for a 6x6 deal for Nylander.

Marners production is probably warranting more in the 6.5-6.75 range, but he likely won't get re-upped until next year.

Though both Elhers and Pasta only had one season each of putting up higher numbers. Nylander will have two seasons scoring like a top 6 winger under his belt.

Though I’d say he’ll get in the 6-7 million range. What will be interesting to see is contract length. Bruins gave Pasta a deal that took him the quickest root to free agency, Elhers still has 1 year of RFa status once his latest contract ends.

 

[nuck]

Though both Elhers and Pasta only had one season each of putting up higher numbers. Nylander will have two seasons scoring like a top 6 winger under his belt.

Though I’d say he’ll get in the 6-7 million range. What will be interesting to see is contract length. Bruins gave Pasta a deal that took him the quickest root to free agency, Elhers still has 1 year of RFa status once his latest contract ends.

Pasta's two year run has been quite a bit better than Willie's, Ehlers, not really, so he is the one they would be negotiating off of. Not a good time to have an off year, which is all I think it was. No way Willie does better than $6.5M, and with 14 goals, where is his leverage?

 

[WTFMAN99]

Pasta's two year run has been quite a bit better than Willie's, Ehlers, not really, so he is the one they would be negotiating off of. Not a good time to have an off year, which is all I think it was. No way Willie does better than $6.5M, and with 14 goals, where is his leverage?

I don't see it. IMO Nylander's direct comparable is going to be Ehlers, not Pastrnak.

7 yrs, 6M per, he can have 6.5M if he goes 8 years.

 

[Menzinger]

Pasta's two year run has been quite a bit better than Willie's, Ehlers, not really, so he is the one they would be negotiating off of. Not a good time to have an off year, which is all I think it was. No way Willie does better than $6.5M, and with 14 goals, where is his leverage?

The key variable here will be length.

Pasta likely took less money than he could have earned because his deal gets him to free agency so quickly. Elhers signed a “mediumish” term deal. Do the Leafs want to lock him up for 7-8 years and up some UFA years , if yes it’ll cost them, if not we will likely see a shorter term (like 5 years).

I’m not expecting this to be a major issue through, both sides likely find a reasonable compromise here.

 

[WTFMAN99]

The key variable here will be length.

Pasta likely took less money than he could have earned because his deal gets him to free agency so quickly. Elhers signed a “mediumish” term deal. Do the Leafs want to lock him up for 7-8 years and up some UFA years , if yes it’ll cost them, if not we will likely see a shorter term (like 5 years).

I’m not expecting this to be a major issue through, both sides likely find a reasonable compromise here.

When they're as young as they are, I don't mind betting long term on them, even if things don't work out, teams are usually willing to gamble on youth. We took a chance on JVR and it worked out alright.