Flyers' overrated young blueliners

[BAM]

Ghost and Provorov are top pairing guys. Sanheim is shaping up to be and looks fantastic in the NHL. Myers is well on track to be the same. The only one who's disappointed is Morin, and that's pretty much entirely down to injury.

Ghost is not a top pairing guy, he's a middle pairing D-man that makes his killing on the pp. He's exactly like Shattenkirk, Gardiner. Guys that don't face top pairing QoC but can rack up points against inferior competition.

 

[Curufinwe]

Ghost played on the top pairing most of last season.

 

[winnipegger]

That's funny coing from a fan of a Winnipeg team that had one playoff appearance and zero playoff wins from 11-12 till 16-17.

Wasn't insulting your team cutie I was saying that given how good the talent level is it is surprising they aren't better.

 

[Curufinwe]

Wasn't insulting your team cutie I was saying that given how good the talent level is it is surprising they aren't better.

Overall talent level isn't enough if you have a broken PK, and/or sub-par goalies. There's a reason the Jets only became a really good team last year when Hellebuyck had a breakout season.

 

[snipes]

Lol Provy is a future perennial Norris candidate.

Take a lap.

 

[freakydallas13]

Some hot takes flying itt, but I have to say, the entire team looks like garbage right now, and a lot of the blame falls at the feet of the coaching staff. Hak is awful, and Lappy has been even worse as the PK coach.

 

[Connor McConnor]

Either OP doesn't watch the Flyers enough or he doesn't know hockey enough. It's as simple as that. To say Provorov is overrated is absurd, and Sanheim is also going to be very good. Last time I checked, throwing a 20 year old defenceman into the fire at 22+ min a night with terrible goaltending isn't the best recipe for success. He would easily in my mind have closer to 50+ points if he didn't have Ghost ahead of him on the PP. Check his 5 on 5 numbers last year. Again, I hate when I have to educate people who post something so ignorant they don't deserve to be enlightened. It might be hopeless at this point.

 

[YEM]

That's funny coming from a fan of a Winnipeg team that had one playoff appearance and zero playoff wins from 11-12 till 16-17. Surely you have some familiarity with the concept of a bubble team?

why so salty and defensive?
he asked an innocuous question
apologies @winnipegger for the manners of some of our flyers fans

 

[Atas2000]

Ghost is not a top pairing guy, he's a middle pairing D-man that makes his killing on the pp. He's exactly like Shattenkirk, Gardiner. Guys that don't face top pairing QoC but can rack up points against inferior competition.

How many Flyers games have you watched?

 

[The List Of Jericho]

Yeah, they were totally crazy for saying the 65 point defenseman with a career PPG of .676 is better than the 52 point career high defenseman with a career PPG of 0.466.

If only defenceman were graded on offense alone, how are those D skills?

 

[bukwas]

Meh. Every team has a portion of it's fans that overrate prospects, roster players and so on.
I look for the posters who have the fanaticism under control. They're out there, they just generally make less noise.

 

[TomasHertlsRooster]

If only defenceman were graded on offense alone, how are those D skills?

Rielly’s? Pretty f***ing terrible.

 

[The List Of Jericho]

Rielly’s? Pretty ****ing terrible.

Can’t take your opinion seriously, just look at your profile tag line. Rielly has to carry Ron freakin Hainsey, considering that alone he’s above average on D.

 

[mja]

The Ghost can't play D fake news needs to die but it never will.

 

[Syckle78]

That'll never stop until the fans of every team stop comparing themselves to the leafs.

That's certainly one delusional way to look at it.

 

[Rich Nixon]

Can’t take your opinion seriously, just look at your profile tag line. Rielly has to carry Ron freakin Hainsey, considering that alone he’s above average on D.

...and Ghost spent a lot of his career carrying terrible partners like MacDonald as well. You guys are arguing the exact same thing: That a good offensive defenseman is underrated defensively. Which is true in both cases. This is an inane conversation. You could swap out either name in either of your arguments and be right.

Though Ghost is, in fact, the better player. Not by a ton, but he is.

 

[joe dirte]

...and Ghost spent a lot of his career carrying terrible partners like MacDonald as well. You guys are arguing the exact same thing: That a good offensive defenseman is underrated defensively. Which is true in both cases. This is an inane conversation. You could swap out either name in either of your arguments and be right.

Though Ghost is, in fact, the better player. Not by a ton, but he is.

than Rielly?

No. Not remotely close.

 

[Rich Nixon]

than Rielly?

No. Not remotely close.

Morgan Rielly is a fantastic hockey player that any team would be lucky to have. He's terrific, smart and physically capable and great with his hands. He gets a lot of crap because he has high point totals and he's a Leaf from people who don't watch him. He's absolutely great.

Ghost gets similar flack for the team he plays for and his output, plus the fact he doesn't have nearly the size that Rielly or really any other NHL defenseman have. But he is the better player. I watch huge gobs of hockey every year, and I like to look at things as unbiasedly as I possibly can, and I will tell you that I don't think there's a similar weapon in the league outside of Karlsson. Gostisbehere is one of the best skaters in the league, possesses incredible creativity and a freakishly hard shot for his size/strength (thanks, probably, to light stick flex).

He can handle any pass within 10 feet of him: over his head he jumps to catch, well wide he'll slide and cut it off like a shortstop. There's probably 20 Flyers goals per year that he gets no assist on, but were only possible due to his blue line keeps, and untold numbers of goals against prevented because he keeps the puck from going the other way with opposing forwards charging. The guy's just a pure athlete in every sense. There's no one better at that in the league. The Flyers' good first PP unit is only possible because when someone down low gets in trouble with the puck, they can just throw it somewhere in his general direction and have an instant reset. Not Klingberg, Rielly, Subban, anyone in the league can tame an errant pass up there the way that kid does. Might seem minor, but in terms of a powerplay or preventing transition offense it's incredibly useful.

He's not as good at defending in-zone as Rielly, but far better against the rush (think stick-work, speed, smart dives). And he provides skills that only maybe a handful of other defensemen in the league can even fathom. Rielly is a really, really good 2-way D-man, but Ghost is a very rare breed in this league. Give him a system that isn't so blase and terrible (think of him playing Laviolette hockey) and he'll rip your eyes out of your face with what he's capable of. Just a machine.

It's OK, it's not a slight to anyone.

 

[Pip]

Maybe the OP shouldn’t start threads about topics that he (or she) is clueless about.

 

[mja]

Rielly is a really, really good 2-way D-man, but Ghost is a very rare breed in this league. Give him a system that isn't so blase and terrible (think Laviolette hockey) and he'll rip your eyes out of your face with what he's capable of.

Laviolette would be perfect for this team. Unlike when we fired him, we now have the horses on the back end to run his system. I'd kill to see what he'd do with Ghost, Sanheim, Myers, & to a lesser extent Provorov. It'd just be go-go-go and it'd be entertaining as f*** to watch.

 

[Laveuglette]

Give them a decent goalie and they'll look much better.

 

[flyersfan018]

I don't think anyone's calling him a bust; just overrated, as he had substantial hype in junior.

The dude has played FIFTY EIGHT regular season games. This board can be so embarrassing sometimes.

 

[Tripod]

Overrated???

Ghost: 2nd in Calder voting. 1st in PP points last year, 17th in ES points. Played on 1st pairing.

Provy: #1 Dman, 1st in goals last year, 8th in ES points.

Sanheim: 5 points in 9 games this year. Playing very well

Hagg: 4th in the league in hits last year as a rookie. 1st this year. Has 5 points in 9 games.

Morin: lost pretty much 1.5 years due to injury.
Myers: 6'5 RHD. still marinating in AHL...2nd year
Friedman: still marinating in AHL...2nd year
Hogberg: playing in SHL...20 years old
Bernhardt: playing in SHL...20 years old
Kalynuk: 6 points in 4 games in College
Ginning: playing in SHL...18 years old
Wylie: 10 points in 11 games....18 years old

So so far, Provy and Ghost absolutely have panned out. Sanheim is just touching the surface on his ability. Hagg gets overused by Hakstol but has played better this year.

So none have busted, 1 got injured, 4 are playing like #1, #2, #3/4, #5/6. And the rest are still in the pipeline. They are not overrated, they just have not all arrived yet and are not finished products.

Considering the Flyers RARELY drafted and developed any Dmen over the last 15 years, this is a resounding success. Just think, Sbisa was the best Dman drafted the last 15 years until these kids arrived. The BEST.

 

[1865]

Ghost is not a top pairing guy, he's a middle pairing D-man that makes his killing on the pp. He's exactly like Shattenkirk, Gardiner. Guys that don't face top pairing QoC but can rack up points against inferior competition.

Shayne Gostisbehere is a legitimate top pairing defenseman and if you don't believe that then you just don't watch him enough.

He's adequate defensively, elite in transition and is one of the league's premier offensive defensemen. He's one of the best #2s in the league.

 

[Sam Spade]

Provorov will win a Norris one day, or finish top three a few times, he is that good.