Value of: Flyers draft day trades

[captainpaxil]

Then he would be incredibly stupid with a bad agent. He would be turning down a guaranteed $50 or so million for $6 million and risking a career ending injury. I just think most players are smarter than that... or at least their agents are.

I guess for discussion's sake we could break it down into two categories. Offers for an extended Trouba and offers for a one year rental Trouba.

Lets break it down a little differently.
Flyers pp1 ghost pp2 sanheim pk1 provy pk2 gudas Even strength provy ghost sanheim gudas morin myers. The flyers issue is a need for a steady veteran presence who can guide all that youth and talent. Ideally someone who can play top pair minutes and contribute on the pk. The flyers have the cap space and are willing to commit valuable assets to acquire someone for that role.
Trouba may be one of the better available options but alot of the things that pump his value are irrelevant to philly. He wont see pp time over the guys we have and his youth and potential is outshined again by what we already have.

Some are clamoring for karlson and the next best available is trouba but if alex edler hits ufa i think hes the best fit. The other two may be better players but he most suits phillys needs. Sure you look into the others but overcommiting assets to fill holes that aren't there is just poor management.

 

[C0DITH]

WTF has Trouba done to even be compared to Pronger and EK? Nothing. So no, an expiring RFA won't command the same.

Flyers need a Vet dman with skill and leadership, Trouba isn't that. I don't know who they need to be honest, could be someone like Spurgeon (who would probably) cost less than Trouba both acquisition wise, and cap wise.

 

[Snowman]

Lets break it down a little differently.
Flyers pp1 ghost pp2 sanheim pk1 provy pk2 gudas Even strength provy ghost sanheim gudas morin myers. The flyers issue is a need for a steady veteran presence who can guide all that youth and talent. Ideally someone who can play top pair minutes and contribute on the pk. The flyers have the cap space and are willing to commit valuable assets to acquire someone for that role.
Trouba may be one of the better available options but alot of the things that pump his value are irrelevant to philly. He wont see pp time over the guys we have and his youth and potential is outshined again by what we already have.

Some are clamoring for karlson and the next best available is trouba but if alex edler hits ufa i think hes the best fit. The other two may be better players but he most suits phillys needs. Sure you look into the others but overcommiting assets to fill holes that aren't there is just poor management.

I don't disagree at all. Other than Trouba's main value isn't what he did this year points wise. It's that he is a proven, top pairing RHD that plays against the opposition's top players all the time and wins those match ups.

I can certainly understand not wanting to pay the price if you think Trouba is overkill for what you need. On the other hand, just because you think he is overkill is no reason for the Jets to accept less.

It sounds like we're in agreement... Basically anyways.

 

[Dooble08]

Mcdonagh returned a good roster player, a first rounder, a potential 1st rounder, and 2 decent prospects.

Karlsson, who was traded as a one year rental nonetheless, was traded for a 1st and 2nd round pick, conditional 1st and 2nd round picks, 3 immediate roster players, and another prospect.

As for Pronger, I don't know which trade of his you're referring too, but both times he returned an (at the time) average-to-above-average player in Lupul, and at least two 1st rounders.

Unless Philly is planning to bunch together a few high draft picks and a couple of good roster pieces, yeah... it's going to cost a Frost or Farabee

Not a single top prospect in the list though. Most of the players are of the 2nd-3rd line quality for their NHL careers.

Also, the players who are available for trade are not of the quality of Karlsson, Pronger, or McDonagh. None of them returned high draft picks (all in mid to late 20's). None of them returned top prospects. Farabee or Frost won't be available unless a top tier defensemen or center in on the block.

 

[Hockey Stick]

Not a single top prospect in the list though. Most of the players are of the 2nd-3rd line quality for their NHL careers.

Also, the players who are available for trade are not of the quality of Karlsson, Pronger, or McDonagh. None of them returned high draft picks (all in mid to late 20's). None of them returned top prospects. Farabee or Frost won't be available unless a top tier defensemen or center in on the block.

The point that I was trying to make through all of that was that if you're not going to make a Frost or Farabee available, then that's the type of package that you're going to have to pony up for the desired top defenceman

 

[82Ninety42011]

Sorry, he's not being traded as a rental. You're offer would be a start, but would need an add for Trouba with an extension.

How exactly is he not being traded as a rental? He's in his last year next year before UFA why would he agree to an extension just to be traded to weaken the team he's going to? He either stays a Jet with an extension which is doubtful as he has requested out before or leaves without an extension. Sorry but he's not signing just to be moved.

 

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

Trouba is thought to possibly be a flight risk to FL or TB, so if that were true, that would be acquiring as a rental.

More like a flight risk for DET, FL or TB and i doubt TB can afford him and FL is going after Bobrovsky and Panarin this summer.

 

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

The trade would only happen if we did a trade and extend similar to the situation with Mark Stone and Vegas. Other than that, I don't think the Flyers should be interested in a rental.

And why would Trouba agree to an extension with Philly, The most plausible out come would be to either Detroit or Florida with an extension. As those teams are higher on his radar.

 

[Snowman]

How exactly is he not being traded as a rental? He's in his last year next year before UFA why would he agree to an extension just to be traded to weaken the team he's going to? He either stays a Jet with an extension which is doubtful as he has requested out before or leaves without an extension. Sorry but he's not signing just to be moved.

Hmmm. I guess Mark Stone didn't just do exactly the same thing. Strike two.

 

[Starat327]

Hmmm. I guess Mark Stone didn't just do exactly the same thing. Strike two.

To be fair, Mark Stone didnt have rumors about his preferred destination(s) prior to him leaving. Trouba does.

That being said, i could see Trouba signing anywhere on the east coast, where the travel is easier and he could make things work with the fiancee, if thats still his hold up.

 

[Accelleratii]

Can't see Gostisbehere getting moved just yet. While I'm not sold on him, I can appreciate what he does at 4.5 per. A new coach with strong structure could do wonders for a player of Gostisbehere's ilk, too.

I think the 11th OA pick and Voracek are the most likely pieces to be moved.

 

[mercury]

And why would Trouba agree to an extension with Philly, The most plausible out come would be to either Detroit or Florida with an extension. As those teams are higher on his radar.

Maybe he wants a better chance to win.

 

[Snowman]

To be fair, Mark Stone didnt have rumors about his preferred destination(s) prior to him leaving. Trouba does.

That being said, i could see Trouba signing anywhere on the east coast, where the travel is easier and he could make things work with the fiancee, if thats still his hold up.

True. My reply was more to address the other poster's assertion that a pending UFA wouldn't agree to an extension and trade as it would weaken his new team. Which as Stone showed us is completely false.

 

[Starat327]

True. My reply was more to address the other poster's assertion that a pending UFA wouldn't agree to an extension and trade as it would weaken his new team. Which as Stone showed us is completely false.

Oh, for sure. MaxPac did the same thing, Trade and Signs arent nearly as uncommon as people think. But there seems to be a disconnect on "he will sign" vs "maybe hell sign". People need to be clear about that.

Jets may not want to trade him without one so they can max the value on him, but that doesnt mean he will sign wherever hes traded. Conversely, people need to understand that if hes willing to agree to an extension, that raises the price considerably.

 

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

Maybe he wants a better chance to win.

If that were the case, He just stay in Winnipeg then. Sounds like he wants to be near home Detroit. Have to admit though Philly is a lot closer to Detroit then Winnipeg is.

 

[TheKingPin]

Then he would be incredibly stupid with a bad agent. He would be turning down a guaranteed $50 or so million for $6 million and risking a career ending injury. I just think most players are smarter than that... or at least their agents are.

I guess for discussion's sake we could break it down into two categories. Offers for an extended Trouba and offers for a one year rental Trouba.

It’s taking a bet on yourself and your health and the market. I’d only sign a deal now if it’s similar or better than his expected UFA return, like Stone.

 

[82Ninety42011]

Hmmm. I guess Mark Stone didn't just do exactly the same thing. Strike two.

Missed strike 1 but how is Trouba mentioned in same breath as Mark Stone? Stone also was moved as a rental and signed extension with Knights by the way. The deal was agreed to before trade but it's not like Sens had the power to trade him anywhere signed. A signed Mark Stone gets even more if they can move him anywhere. Ghost and the 40th is more then enough for a rental Trouba and pretty close to even a signed one . By the way Im not a Flyers fan but a Canucks. Trouba is a great Dman but he's no clear number 1. Ghost has his limitations but Trouba has his and the 40th pick is nothing to sneeze at.

 

[Snowman]

Missed strike 1 but how is Trouba mentioned in same breath as Mark Stone? Stone also was moved as a rental and signed extension with Knights by the way. The deal was agreed to before trade but it's not like Sens had the power to trade him anywhere signed. A signed Mark Stone gets even more if they can move him anywhere. Ghost and the 40th is more then enough for a rental Trouba and pretty close to even a signed one . By the way Im not a Flyers fan but a Canucks. Trouba is a great Dman but he's no clear number 1. Ghost has his limitations but Trouba has his and the 40th pick is nothing to sneeze at.

Strike 3. Clear top pairing, young RHD's are more valuable than wingers. When you consider that it is the hardest position to fill in hockey, outside of 1C. As we've been saying Ghost is a good start for an extended Trouba, but would need a nice add to be considered.

 

[82Ninety42011]

Strike 3. Clear top pairing, young RHD's are more valuable than wingers. When you consider that it is the hardest position to fill in hockey, outside of 1C. As we've been saying Ghost is a good start for an extended Trouba, but would need a nice add to be considered.

You have your opinion and I have mine good luck trading or hopefully signing him long term cheers. By the way top pairing doesn't mean clear number 1 as I posted.

 

[Snowman]

You have your opinion and I have mine good luck trading or hopefully signing him long term cheers. By the way top pairing doesn't mean clear number 1 as I posted.

You are correct. Trouba would be a clear #1 on most teams.

 

[The Madrigal]

I seriously feel like I just lost a significant amount of brain cells just from reading this thread.

Back to some real grown up discussion. The Flyers do need to a top four D and second line center. They should probably look to add one via trade, and one via free agency. I would think the 11th overall pick would be in play (and potentially with additional pieces for the right guy) for guys like Trouba, Spurgeon, and if a center like RNH or Kadri became available.

Just speculating here but I expect them to end up with Duchene, Hayes, or Nelson in free agency, and to add a D going the trade route.

 

[bernmeister]

More like a flight risk for DET, FL or TB and i doubt TB can afford him and FL is going after Bobrovsky and Panarin this summer.

Yes, but they [fl] don't have to give Trouba a new deal immediately, they just need to cough up enuf to make Jets happy w/offer.
Bobo and Pana only cost $

Bolts I agree, except they have real assets to do a deal for Trouba now.

 

[Flukeshot]

Lets break it down a little differently.
Flyers pp1 ghost pp2 sanheim pk1 provy pk2 gudas Even strength provy ghost sanheim gudas morin myers. The flyers issue is a need for a steady veteran presence who can guide all that youth and talent. Ideally someone who can play top pair minutes and contribute on the pk. The flyers have the cap space and are willing to commit valuable assets to acquire someone for that role.
Trouba may be one of the better available options but alot of the things that pump his value are irrelevant to philly. He wont see pp time over the guys we have and his youth and potential is outshined again by what we already have.

Some are clamoring for karlson and the next best available is trouba but if alex edler hits ufa i think hes the best fit. The other two may be better players but he most suits phillys needs. Sure you look into the others but overcommiting assets to fill holes that aren't there is just poor management.

I really agree with you. While adding a 1st line top calibre D would be great. I just see the need more as a 20min D, veteran calming mentor role. Who can play on the PK1.

 

[dag54]

WTF has Trouba done to even be compared to Pronger and EK? Nothing. So no, an expiring RFA won't command the same.

Flyers need a Vet dman with skill and leadership, Trouba isn't that. I don't know who they need to be honest, could be someone like Spurgeon (who would probably) cost less than Trouba both acquisition wise, and cap wise.

Completely agree. I'd do the 11th OA pick for Spurgeon.

 

[dag54]

Lets break it down a little differently.
Flyers pp1 ghost pp2 sanheim pk1 provy pk2 gudas Even strength provy ghost sanheim gudas morin myers. The flyers issue is a need for a steady veteran presence who can guide all that youth and talent. Ideally someone who can play top pair minutes and contribute on the pk. The flyers have the cap space and are willing to commit valuable assets to acquire someone for that role.
Trouba may be one of the better available options but alot of the things that pump his value are irrelevant to philly. He wont see pp time over the guys we have and his youth and potential is outshined again by what we already have.

Some are clamoring for karlson and the next best available is trouba but if alex edler hits ufa i think hes the best fit. The other two may be better players but he most suits phillys needs. Sure you look into the others but overcommiting assets to fill holes that aren't there is just poor management.

If they decide to go the free agent route for a veteran dman instead of a trade, I wouldn't mind Edler.