Flames 'New' Arena II - 'No it's yours, I insist'

[Lunatik]

As a citizen of Klagenfurt, who´s city was "fortunate" enough to host the European Championship of Football in 2008 (Austria and Switzerland) I am proud of your election results. Your major is gonna get you (taxpaxers) a good deal, that won´t damage your cities finances. To me as a neutral spectator all CSEC did sounded like a plot to get themselves a candidate (Smith or whatever his name was) that would have offered them a deal in their benefit and to your loss. Due to bad politcians Klagenfurt (and the state aswell) has amassed debt, that most likely won´t even by paid off by my death (and I am currently 19 years old, so there´s some time left hopefully ).

If you think that the Flames are going to move, you´re delusional. No other city would show such support for a hockey team as you guys and no other city would be able to populate an arena as well as you guys.
If Houston/Seattle will get a team it would most likely be through expansion in 2 years, before the current cba expires. And my personal guess is that the owner of the Astros is going to spent 500-700mill to get the 32nd team in the league, so both conferences could finally be balanced.
So don´t be scared, I am atleast 90% sure, that a new arena deal will get struck before the 2019 offseason.

(sorry for grammatical errors, its 3 am here --- and to the mods: if its to political (even tho i´m not involved in your politics, please edit and don´t delete, thanks )

It's not about support to the Flames and the league. It's about revenue. The longer the Flames are in the Saddledome, the further down the list they will drop in terms of revenue. The Flames TV deal is not that impressive, without a larger lower bowl and a new level of suites they can't gain the additional revenues to bring them back into the top 10 in revenue.

That said, I wouldn't be shocked if both Nenshi and the Flames became more reasonable now that the election is over.

 

[Otzelor]

It's not about support to the Flames and the league. It's about revenue. The longer the Flames are in the Saddledome, the further down the list they will drop in terms of revenue. The Flames TV deal is not that impressive, without a larger lower bowl and a new level of suites they can't gain the additional revenues to bring them back into the top 10 in revenue.

That said, I wouldn't be shocked if both Nenshi and the Flames became more reasonable now that the election is over.

I have heard about that and I fully acknowledge that aswell, but the are somewhere in the mid (#10-#20) of the revenue sharing list, so its not the end of the world. I also understand that my city is way smaller than Calgary (population and budget wise), but still: with the proposal the Flames had offered (http://calgary.ctvnews.ca/city-responds-to-flames-side-of-the-arena-proposal-1.3601259) you guys would have paid the largest part of the arena and not recieve anything back. And that´s not how a ambassador of the population should be.

My best guess would be that the council insreases their offer and that the Flames will agree under better conditions.

 

[Tkachuk Norris]

That is his own personal twitter, his opinion. Blaming the Flames for that is rather unfair.

He's the head of Flames Media relations.
Hes actually paid his salary and is well aware that what you say online will come back and haunt you.
This isn't some random schlub off the street

 

[Lunatik]

He's the head of Flames Media relations.
Hes actually paid his salary and is well aware that what you say online will come back and haunt you.
This isn't some random schlub off the street

Yeah COME BACK ON HIM, they have no control over what he says on him personal account. They could choose to reprimand him if that is their policy and he will face backlash from the social justice keyboard warriors, but blaming the team for what he said is just as stupid as what he said.

 

[InfinityIggy]

Yeah COME BACK ON HIM, they have no control over what he says on him personal account. They could choose to reprimand him if that is their policy and he will face backlash from the social justice keyboard warriors, but blaming the team for what he said is just as stupid as what he said.

You're really going to frame anyone who had a problem with what he said as an SJW? K.

 

[Anglesmith]

For what it's worth, the Flames released a statement saying he's allowed to say stuff like that if he wants, but that it shouldn't be tied into the Flames.

 

[djpatm]

That said, I wouldn't be shocked if both Nenshi and the Flames became more reasonable now that the election is over.

I'd be absolutely floored if CSE came back to the table. They went all in on getting Nenshi out.

 

[Mobiandi]

I'd be absolutely floored if CSE came back to the table. They went all in on getting Nenshi out.

Yeah, I expect things to be quiet on the arena front for the next year or so

 

[Anglesmith]

In reality, there wasn't really an ultimatum. The Flames clearly timed this big kerfuffle with the election, and there's no reason for things to pick up right now, immediately afterwards.

The building is old and they would increase their profits by building a new one, yes, but that's been the case for years, and it just conveniently came to a head before the election. I don't think the situation is that urgent.

That said, I expect them to talk later this year, but I don't think the negotiations will be in the media anymore.

 

[InfinityIggy]

I don't think the situation is that urgent.

I think you make a really key point. It's only recently that this was played into an 'urgent' issue. A return to things being quiet for a while makes a lot of sense.

 

[Swarez]

Why shouldn't it be tied to the flames? This isn't some intern. It's a senior manager running a department. Those are the people who dictate how the flames are run.

When I came up the ranks higher I went more we know our behaviour 24/7 was important. Never do something that will hurt the company publically. This guy did. He may not like it, but at certain levels you must know your words have weight in the community. Yea you don't like Nenshi, great many don't. Your words will come off as the flames words. That person is in corp communication and doesn't realize that? Flames should tank the dude and get a better mouth peice.

 

[Anglesmith]

I mean, fundamentally, at the very least it looks bad to have someone as a director of communications who doesn't seem to know how to communicate appropriately.

 

[Lunatik]

I mean, fundamentally, at the very least it looks bad to have someone as a director of communications who doesn't seem to know how to communicate appropriately.

Its not exactly inappropriate to say someone is worse than a president though. Its all your interpretation based on how you feel about Trump

 

[InfinityIggy]

Its not exactly inappropriate to say someone is worse than a president though. Its all your interpretation based on how you feel about Trump

The examples I could use.. yikes.

 

[Anglesmith]

The examples I could use.. yikes.

Godwin's Law?

 

[InfinityIggy]

Godwin's Law?

Pretty much.

 

[Lunatik]

Pretty much.

As much as I hate Nenshi, I wouldn't go as far as comparing him to Hitler

 

[hockeywiz542]

 

[Lunatik]

Considering it appears nothing has changed at all, this isn't exactly shocking.

 

[herashak]

Aka not optimistic he can get away with paying 25% of the arena while jacking up the prices and not paying property tax

 

[flames12]

Why can't the City of Calgary just buy the Flames? The City and than purchase a New Arena, I'm in favour of something like CalgaryNext if the City did purchase the flames. I don't like the idea of public money going to a private corporation.

Calgary Next 1.8 million
Buying the Flames 500 million
Total Purchase 2.3 billion

I'd like to hear peoples opinion of this.

 

[Baxterman]

The city isn't getting the Flames for $500 million.

Also the debt they would have to take on to buy them and build the arena would seem to be crippling but I will leave that to people who know more about that kind of stuff than I do. But I can't imagine a city can take on 2.5-3 billion dollars of debt that easily.

 

[Flameshomer]

Well, from what I know Calgary does have a reserve fund that they had been building up for some time while Oil prices were still high. That could be gone now, but it did exist at one point. So they wouldn't have to borrow ALL of the money. But then the problem becomes who is going to lend it to them? No way the province loans them money to buy a sports franchise, and that's normally how they get money at a preferred interest rate. They could potentially borrow and then put up the project itself or even the team as collatoral?

Either way I don't think it will ever happen- the NHL board of governers wouldn't allow it. More likely that a green bay situation arises, but I also think the league would want to avoid that.

I have yet to read a rational argument why the flames won't bargain with the city on their proposed deal and instead seem to have poison pilled the whole east village concept from the beginning. My hunch is that they're holding out for Calgary Next talk because the real money is in developing the surroundings, an option that doesn't exist in the EV. Just a hunch though. Otherwise, based on the financials calculated by forbes and my best guess, the calgary proposal as it stands would increase their take home revenue.

 

[Ace Rimmer]

The city isn't getting the Flames for $500 million.

No, but it'd be in the ballpark (probably worth close to $600 million CDN with a new arena deal)

As a taxpayer, I want to say "no damn way" should the City be putting out that kind of money on ownership of a sports team. As a rational thinker, however, if that can be another source of revenue for the City, then I'm intrigued. Not really the traditional role of a non-socialist government to operate a business entity.

I'd like the Flames to continue pursuing the Calgary NEXT (West Village) option for both the Flames and Stampeders (and possible Olympic bid) as I think that has greater benefits and greater potential overall. Victoria Park didn't redevelop with the introduction of the Corral or Saddledome; why will the next version attract redevelopment as a standalone facility? If the Flames are given the land (which is polluted as hell) and the option to develop around it (and market the shit out of it) there's a better likelihood that it would succeed.

 

[Baxterman]

No, but it'd be in the ballpark (probably worth close to $600 million CDN with a new arena deal)

As a taxpayer, I want to say "no damn way" should the City be putting out that kind of money on ownership of a sports team. As a rational thinker, however, if that can be another source of revenue for the City, then I'm intrigued. Not really the traditional role of a non-socialist government to operate a business entity.

I'd like the Flames to continue pursuing the Calgary NEXT (West Village) option for both the Flames and Stampeders (and possible Olympic bid) as I think that has greater benefits and greater potential overall. Victoria Park didn't redevelop with the introduction of the Corral or Saddledome; why will the next version attract redevelopment as a standalone facility? If the Flames are given the land (which is polluted as hell) and the option to develop around it (and market the **** out of it) there's a better likelihood that it would succeed.

I don't think these owners are in a rush to sell and if they were there would be a number of bidders so the team is likely to go for a premium price. I am not sure the city can justify paying a premium price like a private rich dude can.

I think they would be looking at $700 million+ (I heard that this the rumoured number for Seattle expansion fee) at least for the team. I also am not sure they could get the financing or afford the rates that they could get.