Rumor: Flames in the market for a defenceman

[Fig]

Total retention can go up to 75%—50% by the initial team and 50% of 50% by the second team.

We’ve seen at least a couple cases of player trades where salary was retained twice for more then a total of 50% in Rob Scuderi and Devan Dubnyk.

Ah, I learn something new then.

https://thehockeywriters.com/nhl-retained-salary-trades/

The example used was Dubnyk. Interesting. I didn't know you could exceed 50% of the total salary via two teams.

Neat.

What's crazy is that based on this article it seems like in theory a player could be salary retained 100% of the entire salary via two teams because the salary retention of the original team doesn't affect the latter team. That's weird and crazy.

But the Flames ownership still doesn't allow salary retention.

 

[ManofSteel55]

Yes. They add an extra year at 4 million in cap. They also give up a totally solid mid six forward in exchange for a pylon.

An extra year but no extra cap space today and that will be an important part of any deal at this time. Russell isn't a pylon either, overpaid, sure. Bad player, no.

 

[DFF]

An extra year but no extra cap space today and that will be an important part of any deal at this time. Russell isn't a pylon either, overpaid, sure. Bad player, no.

Other than shot blocking, rest of his game is pretty bad

Flames do not need an overpaid dman on the bench anyway

 

[DFF]

Should've signed Oscar Fantenberg, you know, the depth defenceman we gave up a 4th rounder for at the deadline? Or Brett Kulak, you know, the 5/6 guy we gifted Montreal for free?

They can find something similar on waver

 

[ManofSteel55]

Other than shot blocking, rest of his game is pretty bad

Flames do not need an overpaid dman on the bench anyway

Bland maybe, but not bad. He is still an adequate 5. He's just paid like a 3/4.

 

[Elysian]

Take Julius Honka.

Pretty please?

 

[bernmeister]

Total retention can go up to 75%—50% by the initial team and 50% of 50% by the second team.

We’ve seen at least a couple cases of player trades where salary was retained twice for more then a total of 50% in Rob Scuderi and Devan Dubnyk.

thank you
you have taught us well, Obi Wan.
_________

so again, Smith 4.35 at half = 2.17+ for Flames
get emergency use
upgrade
can recover some cap sending to minors at that point.
can pay small amount to ship him off at 2.17
or lesser amount to ship him off at 1.08+

So Brendan Smith
minimally functional bottom D, possible 4th line depth
does provide grit/enforcer

NY just wants cap space, mins for emerging LDs.
conditional 7th

do you have a better option?

 

[crackdown44]

thank you
you have taught us well, Obi Wan.
_________

so again, Smith 4.35 at half = 2.17+ for Flames
get emergency use
upgrade
can recover some cap sending to minors at that point.
can pay small amount to ship him off at 2.17
or lesser amount to ship him off at 1.08+

So Brendan Smith
minimally functional bottom D, possible 4th line depth
does provide grit/enforcer

NY just wants cap space, mins for emerging LDs.
conditional 7th

do you have a better option?

Yeah a better option is literally any depth D available in free agency for like 700k lol

Calgary needs cap space more than NYR to sign Tkachuk. They’re not going to trade for Brendan Smith

 

[InfinityIggy]

thank you
you have taught us well, Obi Wan.
_________

so again, Smith 4.35 at half = 2.17+ for Flames
get emergency use
upgrade
can recover some cap sending to minors at that point.
can pay small amount to ship him off at 2.17
or lesser amount to ship him off at 1.08+

So Brendan Smith
minimally functional bottom D, possible 4th line depth
does provide grit/enforcer

NY just wants cap space, mins for emerging LDs.
conditional 7th

do you have a better option?

We don't want Smith at any price because he is awful.

 

[blankall]

An extra year but no extra cap space today and that will be an important part of any deal at this time. Russell isn't a pylon either, overpaid, sure. Bad player, no.

The Flames need to shed cap and only need a #6 dman, of which many are available as cheap UFAs.

There's zero chance that they take on Russell for two years. That move would also force them to move one of Brodie or Hamonic to be cap compliant... So they'd be a much worse team.

Frolik will be traded for free or a cheap #6 dman. Then they may sign a #6 for cheap depending on needs after training camp. Do you honestly think the Flames can't find a trade that will actually free to cap space? Their only option is to take back a worse player at the same cap hit but with more term?

Zero chance that take on 2 years of Russell. They couldn't do that even if they wanted to. Cap don't allow it.

 

[blankall]

thank you
you have taught us well, Obi Wan.
_________

so again, Smith 4.35 at half = 2.17+ for Flames
get emergency use
upgrade
can recover some cap sending to minors at that point.
can pay small amount to ship him off at 2.17
or lesser amount to ship him off at 1.08+

So Brendan Smith
minimally functional bottom D, possible 4th line depth
does provide grit/enforcer

NY just wants cap space, mins for emerging LDs.
conditional 7th

do you have a better option?

Yes sign a UFA dman for cheaper or just go with what they have and use Kylington as the #6. Both much better options in terms of players and cap.

 

[Nanuuk]

I think the Flames will most likely sign a player or players to a PTO and then go from there.

 

[JPeeper]

Should've signed Oscar Fantenberg, you know, the depth defenceman we gave up a 4th rounder for at the deadline? Or Brett Kulak, you know, the 5/6 guy we gifted Montreal for free?

No we shouldn't have.

We don't need 4 #7 d-men. We already have 2 in Yelesin and Davidson. Kulak would never have made the Flames last year and he wouldn't this year either.

Flames will no doubt sign some bum on a PTO, Ollie will completely outplay him and the Flames organization will finally stop signing old useless bums like Prout, Grossman, Bartkowski, etc.

Even with the Vali injury we still have 6 legit NHL d-men with Ollie on the team. You don't need to sign 9 depth guys because you fear your player is going to get injured training. It was a freak incident what happened to Vali.

 

[Zhamnov5GoalGame]

Like many of the other teams waiting on key RFA's with limited cap space (or cap issues) you'd have to think the teams hands are tied until Tkachuk is sorted out. Likely a late D add once he signs.

Could end up being a great deal if a UFA is desperate without an offer or PTO.
There's likely a few teams hoping to get a steal of a deal on a vet for near league minimum in September.

 

[ManofSteel55]

The Flames need to shed cap and only need a #6 dman, of which many are available as cheap UFAs.

There's zero chance that they take on Russell for two years. That move would also force them to move one of Brodie or Hamonic to be cap compliant... So they'd be a much worse team.

Frolik will be traded for free or a cheap #6 dman. Then they may sign a #6 for cheap depending on needs after training camp. Do you honestly think the Flames can't find a trade that will actually free to cap space? Their only option is to take back a worse player at the same cap hit but with more term?

Zero chance that take on 2 years of Russell. They couldn't do that even if they wanted to. Cap don't allow it.

That's why I also listed Benning as available for a pick. Or Frolik for Benning and Gagner. You can dump Gagner in the AHL for your cap space. Assuming that Ken Holland's plan for Gagner isn't to dump him in the minors for space and sign someone cheaper.

 

[crackdown44]

Like many of the other teams waiting on key RFA's with limited cap space (or cap issues) you'd have to think the teams hands are tied until Tkachuk is sorted out. Likely a late D add once he signs.

Could end up being a great deal if a UFA is desperate without an offer or PTO.
There's likely a few teams hoping to get a steal of a deal on a vet for near league minimum in September.

Yeah pretty much this or grab a guy off waivers during training camp. Lots of options and there’s no reason to give up assets

A trade only makes sense if it lets us shed salary

 

[Rubi]

The only problem the Flames have with regards to their defense is deciding who's going to be the #7 d-man that gets to eat popcorn in the press box for the majority of the season. The decision that Treliving has to make is whether it will be someone who they currently have under contract and would normally start the season playing in the AHL (ie. Flames bring in Brandon Davidson on one-year, two-way deal - Sportsnet.ca) or find a veteran UFA warm body d-man that will happily collect a minimum paycheck to watch most of the games from the stands.

As far as the other 6 defensemen, it's an almost 100% guarantee that the Flames start the season with the following defense pairings:

Giordano-Brodie
Hanifin-Hamonic
Kylington-Andersson

The above pairings helped the Flames win the Western Conference Championship and a 2nd place finish in the league last season.
To everyone who's worried about the Flames defense because of the injury to Valimaki... don't. The Flames don't need your expensive cast-offs/salary dumps or lopsided trades. They will be just fine with Kylington & Andersson on the 3rd defense pairing.... just as they were for a significant portion of last season.

P.S. I predict the Oliver Kylington will score at least 10 goals and 15 assists and will be above 50 in CF% this season.

 

[Lunatik]

Should've signed Oscar Fantenberg, you know, the depth defenceman we gave up a 4th rounder for at the deadline? Or Brett Kulak, you know, the 5/6 guy we gifted Montreal for free?

Because Treliving has the ability to see into the future?

 

[Lunatik]

That's why I also listed Benning as available for a pick. Or Frolik for Benning and Gagner. You can dump Gagner in the AHL for your cap space. Assuming that Ken Holland's plan for Gagner isn't to dump him in the minors for space and sign someone cheaper.

That is an even worse idea.

 

[joe dirte]

What's old, is new again... Sign Phaneuf at league minimum, and perhaps he can fill in until such time as Valimaki is back, then you can send him to the minors. Ducks, runs for cover.

Ducks run for cover? Wouldn't that be any fans with seats behind the nets that should run for cover, with that bloody point shot of his?

 

[Fogelhund]

Ducks run for cover? Wouldn't that be any fans with seats behind the nets that should run for cover, with that bloody point shot of his?

Or any forward on his team.

 

[Johnny Hoxville]

When the Flames have barely any cap space, why does that make people think they would take your bad contract off of your hands? In what universe does that make sense?

 

[blankall]

That's why I also listed Benning as available for a pick. Or Frolik for Benning and Gagner. You can dump Gagner in the AHL for your cap space. Assuming that Ken Holland's plan for Gagner isn't to dump him in the minors for space and sign someone cheaper.

You don't know how the cap works. You can't just bury a player in the minors to free up cap.

The Flames aren't giving to picks for Benning. They can get a cheaper player to fill a similar role for free.

 

[Ledge And Dairy]

An extra year but no extra cap space today and that will be an important part of any deal at this time. Russell isn't a pylon either, overpaid, sure. Bad player, no.

Ok, so who exactly does he replace on our left side? Not Gio, not Hanifin, not Kylington, and not Valimaki next year when we are still stuck with his crappy contract and Vali is healthy. Now lets assume he can play the off side. who does he replace? Not Brodie, not Hammer, and not Andersson. Oof looks like a bad match. Flames aren't paying 4M for a player that won't get more than 30 starts. we already got rid of Neal because of that

 

[Laus723]

Kinda surprised Pysyk hasn’t been moved yet, pretty sure he’s available.