Johnny Hoxville
The Return of a Legend
It’s to bad Reaves didn’t sign here. He would have single handedly fix any softness issues we have. A clown like Wilson for example looks like a p***y cat next to him.
GDT: Flames (33-13-3) @ Capitals (27-17-6) - Feb 1 | 5PM MST | SNET-W
- Thread starter DCDM
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Peluso and Prout aren't a part of the core and they also are barely NHL players. Maroon is better than both those guys.
Are you kidding me? I'm not even going to bother much with your response. I never said to change the entire team top to bottom. If you don't see our size as a major issue for playoff hockey, we have nothing to discuss.
We had zero answer for Wilson last night. If you think Andersson getting roughed up at the end of the game is cool, go ahead. It was a f***ing embarrassment and I'm sure the players feel the same way
Maybe our players should step up instead? Bennett was a ghost last night, wtf happened to him? We already have guys who can play tough, and they decided to sit back instead. The only player who stepped up was tkachuk. If you think us toughing up is gonna be a difference maker in the playoffs, you are sorely mistaken. Didn't do us any good having ferland and engelland when we got swept by Anaheim anyway, but I guess people still think it's 2003.
Hint hint, Pittsburgh didn't win on toughness. Tampa and Toronto are soft as hell... Chicago was charmin ultra soft. We have more toughness than any of those teams. We lost last night because smith played the puck into oblivion and our guys were rusty, not because Washington laid a few hits.
Anglesmith
Setting up the play?
I think you're overstating things. The problem last night was that we lost. As long as we beat the other team, it's amazing the different perspective that is put on that sort of stuff. Like in the Edmonton game, was it a problem when Kassian attacked Tkachuk? Not at all, it just helped us by putting us on the PP, and we won the game. Would it have been a huge talking point if we'd have lost the game? Absolutely.
The Flames were the frustrated team at the end of last game; frustrated by themselves, by the refereeing, and by the result of the game, and they tried to take out that frustration a bit. Does it matter how that turns out after the game has ended? Not one bit. What matters is that they lost the game, and that puts a negative spin on everything else. If we'd have killed that penalty off and won in OT, everyone is talking about how we were able to overcome some pretty egregious refereeing and gut out a win.
To call it an "embarrassment" that our rookie defenceman got outmuscled by one of the tougher guys in the league is up there with the overstatements of the century. Even if we had John Scott on our team, he's not going to be out there in the final minute trying to tie the game.
Lunatik
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- Oct 12, 2012
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No one is suggesting that we "win on toughness", Pittsburgh's toughness was underrated, as is Tampa's. Chicago was far from soft. Do you ever say anything that is actually accurate or do you just make things up because you think they sound good and hope no one realizes you're blowing smoke up their ass?
What does "adding beef" mean to you then? That's where the conversation started, so I don't know where you are going with the rest of your post, but it was pretty clear what Gnome was implying.
No, it is you that is sorely mistaken if you can't see that a lack of toughness won't help in the playoffs.
The reason the Flames didn't succeed with Ferland and Engelland is because they tried to be tough but ultimately lacked skill and depth. When Engelland is in your top 4 and Ferland in your top 6 because you have nothing else to play there, that's a problem.
So now they've addressed the skill and the depth. Adding toughness back into the lineup (in the form of players that are actually effective, not f***ing Peluso and Prout) is a good thing and not at all a detriment like you're making it out to be.
Chicago was not soft at all. Byfuglien, Shaw, Ladd, Hjalmarsson, Seabrook... just to say the least. Pittsburgh wasn't soft. Toronto got tougher by adding Muzzin. Tampa's not soft. Nashville, Winnipeg, Vegas, even San Jose. They are all bigger teams than the Flames and the biggest risk you can take is to not prepare to face all those teams in the playoffs.
As I've said, adding a guy to our bottom 6 such as maroon won't hurt, but people here are overreacting over one game. And Chicago in 2015 was pretty damn soft compared to teams such as LA (least hits in the NHL) and still won the cup. If we fall early in the playoffs, it will be for a multitude of reasosn, but I sincerely doubt it'll be because we weren't tough enough.
Lunatik
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Adding someone like Thompson or Maroon would be adding beef. As would adding a defenseman like Kronwall.
Bounces R Way
Registered User
I still think toughness is more of an attitude than an attribute in hockey. The Flames played soft yesterday and that's a big reason they lost the game. They were kept to the perimeter in the offensive zone, slowed down by the aggressive checking in the neutral zone, and the Caps forced a lot of turnovers with their physicality in the defensive zone. That was the defending Stanley Cup Champs bringing their playoff game after losing 7 straight. The Flames had one forward credited with more than 2 hits and that was Hathaway. Monahan and Jankowski didn't have one between them. That's 12'4 412 lbs of center that are completely uninvolved physically. I don't care that that's not "their game", the game they're being paid millions to play is hockey and physicality is a component of it.
ugh...Nobody gets it, whatever, I'm out. Hopefully Treliving figures this out or we are playoff doomed. If you think kids like Tkachuk and bennett can handle the heavies we'll have to go through to the cup, you don't have a clue how intimidation in hockey works.
Johnny Hoxville
The Return of a Legend
Tkachuk Norris
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- Jun 22, 2012
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It was one game after ten days off.
Judging by the tone of this thread it sounds like someone shot Harvey the Hound
Judging by the tone of this thread it sounds like someone shot Harvey the Hound
Lunatik
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- Oct 12, 2012
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It's like 2, maybe 3 people disagreeing with you. Saying nobody gets it is insulting to those of us who do and agree.
OvermanKingGainer
#BennettFreed #CurseofTheSpulll #FreeOliver
Reaves would have been out there on a 6 on 5 to protect Gaudreau?
Reaves would have called this blatant interference:
?
I guess I beg to differ.
If you really want toughness out there it needs to be a guy like Bennett out there 6v5 instead of a softy like Monahan. No one remembers the Reaves' they remember the Lindros and Messiers because they actually go out there in key situations.
And saying the team got pushed around is because they lack toughness is an overreaction. They got pushed around because the fix was in. The refs were doing everything to get the Ovi-less Caps their first win in their last eight games and it showed. Those punks got away with everything. Our team pushed back just fine but we were not allowed to breathe on them without phantom calls. They doubled us up on power plays but I sincerely do not agree that they had half the penalties we did.
And finally if they carried more of the play than us, it was not because they were more big and physical - it was because they were more intense, wanted it more (which they should given their losing streak and our winning streak), and because our #3 defenseman was replaced by our ostensibly #6 defenseman in virtually every key situation.
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Qubax
Registered User
So I haven't read this whole thread, but I had a thought on why Smith started last game that I haven't seen anyone propose yet.
It's a fairly simple concept.
At this point, the Flames know what they have in Rittich. At the very least they are more confident in knowing what they have in big save Dave then what they have in Smith. If the Caps game was any playoff game - Rittich would play. But since the Flames are leading the conference, the Caps game wasn't a must win.
I think that the idea was to let Smith get 5 of the next 9-11 games rather then 2 or 3 and in playing about half of those games Treliving would get the opportunity to make the judgement call on if we add another goalie or not.
I think regardless of who we bring in Rittich is still the #1 or #1A, but if Smith had played well against the Caps and continued to win in his 5 starts in 10 games then perhaps the Flames don't trade for a goalie. If Smith predictably sh**s the bed then Treliving can make the decision sooner then later to add a tender.
If you just start Rittich 8 of the 10 games out of the All Star game perhaps you don't wind up knowing what you have in Smith. I know the consensus is he's cooked and we could probably benefit from a depth tender to augment Rittich, but Treliving wants to be certain and not just guess. So the Smith start against the Caps was a means of generating information.
If Smith continues to look meh and give up 3-4 goals including 1 soft one per game then I think we add a Mchellihney type.
It's a fairly simple concept.
At this point, the Flames know what they have in Rittich. At the very least they are more confident in knowing what they have in big save Dave then what they have in Smith. If the Caps game was any playoff game - Rittich would play. But since the Flames are leading the conference, the Caps game wasn't a must win.
I think that the idea was to let Smith get 5 of the next 9-11 games rather then 2 or 3 and in playing about half of those games Treliving would get the opportunity to make the judgement call on if we add another goalie or not.
I think regardless of who we bring in Rittich is still the #1 or #1A, but if Smith had played well against the Caps and continued to win in his 5 starts in 10 games then perhaps the Flames don't trade for a goalie. If Smith predictably sh**s the bed then Treliving can make the decision sooner then later to add a tender.
If you just start Rittich 8 of the 10 games out of the All Star game perhaps you don't wind up knowing what you have in Smith. I know the consensus is he's cooked and we could probably benefit from a depth tender to augment Rittich, but Treliving wants to be certain and not just guess. So the Smith start against the Caps was a means of generating information.
If Smith continues to look meh and give up 3-4 goals including 1 soft one per game then I think we add a Mchellihney type.
SKRusty
Napalm
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Chicago was far from "soft" though were built far differently than LA and Anaheim which were 2 teams built on size and intimidation. Chicago though was still the better team and used their skill wisely.
Monahan was the first player to grab Wilson --- in the scrum --- That said Sean's game is more similar to Sakic or Yzerman not Ryan Kesler. Monahan has been far more physical this year now that he is finally put back together. Jankowski still has it in his head that he is 6'4 170 lb bean-pole in his head and is slowly realizing that he can now start using his size.
***Really don't get the Jankowski haters on this board as between he an Neal last night they had 3-4 posts and then that unreal no look pass that Holtby became all world on. Sam Bennett was horrid***
That said the physicality of last night's game was not the largest factor in the loss. The Flames for their part were rusty all night long. Johnny was not threading passes, Monahan and Lindholm were out of position. Backlund looked greeat one shift then was making AHL like plays the next. Simply put the Flames were out of sync.
To add to that there were at least 4 non-calls for penalties for holding, tripping or interference that were not called against Washington in the first 20 minutes. One of which was a Washington player holding I think it was Bennett as he went behind the net. He was holding Bennett so bad the net came off its moorings. The NHL needs to get its officials to be more consistent in calling the clutch and grab game. When Reirden saw the refs allowing the clutch and grab he told his players to mug the Calgary players in the neutral zone. There were so many neutral zone interference calls last night it was not funny.
OvermanKingGainer
#BennettFreed #CurseofTheSpulll #FreeOliver
[mod] Chicago was dead last in the league in hits most of those years.
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Johnny Hoxville
The Return of a Legend
Reaves would have been out there on a 6 on 5 to protect Gaudreau?
Reaves would have called this blatant interference:
?
I guess I beg to differ.
If you really want toughness out there it needs to be a guy like Bennett out there 6v5 instead of a softy like Monahan. No one remembers the Reaves' they remember the Lindros and Messiers because they actually go out there in key situations.
And saying the team got pushed around is because they lack toughness is an overreaction. They got pushed around because the fix was in. The refs were doing everything to get the Ovi-less Caps their first win in their last eight games and it showed. Those punks got away with everything. Our team pushed back just fine but we were not allowed to breathe on them without phantom calls. They doubled us up on power plays but I sincerely do not agree that they had half the penalties we did.
And finally if they carried more of the play than us, it was not because they were more big and physical - it was because they were more intense, wanted it more (which they should given their losing streak and our winning streak), and because our #3 defenseman was replaced by our ostensibly #6 defenseman in virtually every key situation.
It’s moreso that a guy like Reaves sets the tone in game. I don’t need to explain this any further to you, you know what enforcers do. Having a guy like Reaves in the lineup would keep the other team honest.
I do totally agree though it would be great to add another skilled player that is physical that we can throw out in key situations. Reaves isn’t that guy, but his presence would be felt even when he’s on bench.
Guys I want to add would be Virtanen, N. Ritchie or Crouse.
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