OT: Fitness and Nutrition XI

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Kriss E

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Big difference between a topical corticosteroids etc for recovery or an ailment as opposed to the PED's that healthy people take looking for a cheat method of gaining superiority. Most people associate PED's as anabolic steroids,HGH,blood doping etc. Those are the ones banned for obvious reasons. The pro athletes and Olympic athletes I have know have never admitted or knowingly taken anything,myself included aside from cold medicine when under the weather and you see the results.

PED's for a ''quality of life'' for those that need them,fine,but a healthy individual just trying to juice up,shame.
The point was, steroids are good. They're not bad. It's not heroin, crack or cocaine, and yet they fall under the same category as Amphetamines, a schedule III drug substance. That's f***ing bonkers.
Steroids/PEDs are no more dangerous than alcohol, they're probably way less actually.

I don't have an issue with them, I think they should be legal actually but controlled.

As for you linking USADA...I mean..that would be like asking the DEA about legalizing drugs. It would kill them. USADA has 20M in revenues yearly, it's in their best interest to keep demonizing these drugs.
Not exactly a neutral observer here.

There is only one instance that I can agree they should be banned, that's in fighting because you're physically harming an opponent. Taking stuff deemed illegal so you can be more dangerous in the ring/cage is a big problem.
But taking this so you can go cycling like a crazy person for days on end, or to hit a baseball out of a park, man, go right ahead. What Armstrong did was phenomenal, and it's actually healthier to be on roids than off doing the Tour de France. I much rather see an exciting race between Mcgwire and Sosa ending with 70 home runs than see guys barely crack 50.
 
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Mrb1p

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The point was, steroids are good. They're not bad. It's not heroin, crack or cocaine, and yet they fall under the same category as Amphetamines, a schedule III drug substance. That's f***ing bonkers.
Steroids/PEDs are no more dangerous than alcohol, they're probably way less actually.

I don't have an issue with them, I think they should be legal actually but controlled.

As for you linking USADA...I mean..that would be like asking the DEA about legalizing drugs. It would kill them. USADA has 20M in revenues yearly, it's in their best interest to keep demonizing these drugs.
Not exactly a neutral observer here.

There is only one instance that I can agree they should be banned, that's in fighting because you're physically harming an opponent. Taking stuff deemed illegal so you can be more dangerous in the ring/cage is a big problem.
But taking this so you can go cycling like a crazy person for days on end, or to hit a baseball out of a park, man, go right ahead. What Armstrong did was phenomenal, and it's actually healthier to be on roids than off doing the Tour de France. I much rather see an exciting race between Mcgwire and Sosa ending with 70 home runs than see guys barely crack 50.

I dont exactly disagree with this but really, at that point whats the difference ? I don't think a punch to the nogging really changes much there... Unless there's some kind of research that has been done to show its more dangerous, but I think the research actually shows the brain is a lot more fragile than people thought, and that at some point, it doesn't even matter.

I enjoy a good bout, but fight sports are Pejorative Slured all over the board.

Also that would open up the contact sports egg, which isn't really different than the fight sports when you think of it.
 

Kriss E

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I dont exactly disagree with this but really, at that point whats the difference ? I don't think a punch to the nogging really changes much there... Unless there's some kind of research that has been done to show its more dangerous, but I think the research actually shows the brain is a lot more fragile than people thought, and that at some point, it doesn't even matter.

I enjoy a good bout, but fight sports are Pejorative Slured all over the board.

Also that would open up the contact sports egg, which isn't really different than the fight sports when you think of it.

The argument is the fighter is better, ie more dangerous, when on PEDs. I guess an example of this are the Pride fighters who'd look much better in Japan where usage was borderline encouraged, and then come to the UFC but look like crap. You can also look at Vitor Belfort on TRT vs not.

It's not about punch power level going from 850 to 1200, just that when it comes to causing physical harm, it simply doesn't feel right.
 

angusyoung

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The point was, steroids are good. They're not bad. It's not heroin, crack or cocaine, and yet they fall under the same category as Amphetamines, a schedule III drug substance. That's f***ing bonkers.
Steroids/PEDs are no more dangerous than alcohol, they're probably way less actually.

I don't have an issue with them, I think they should be legal actually but controlled.

As for you linking USADA...I mean..that would be like asking the DEA about legalizing drugs. It would kill them. USADA has 20M in revenues yearly, it's in their best interest to keep demonizing these drugs.
Not exactly a neutral observer here.

There is only one instance that I can agree they should be banned, that's in fighting because you're physically harming an opponent. Taking stuff deemed illegal so you can be more dangerous in the ring/cage is a big problem.
But taking this so you can go cycling like a crazy person for days on end, or to hit a baseball out of a park, man, go right ahead. What Armstrong did was phenomenal, and it's actually healthier to be on roids than off doing the Tour de France. I much rather see an exciting race between Mcgwire and Sosa ending with 70 home runs than see guys barely crack 50.

I get your stance,but I still find that it is cheating to use science,drugs etc to improve ones physical ability.
If one player does it,all should have to do it to equal the playing field. That again is not fair as why should a person have to put questionable outside influences in to his or her body. Why don't they allow corking of the bat in baseball or hockey goalies with over-sized equipment? no one is at risk whatsoever.
 

Kriss E

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I get your stance,but I still find that it is cheating to use science,drugs etc to improve ones physical ability.
If one player does it,all should have to do it to equal the playing field. That again is not fair as why should a person have to put questionable outside influences in to his or her body. Why don't they allow corking of the bat in baseball or hockey goalies with over-sized equipment? no one is at risk whatsoever.

Meh. What if it's a cortisone shot? Why's that not considered cheating? It improves your physicality by reducing pain levels that would hurt your performance.
Steroids help you recover quicker so you can train harder, but it's not like it'll turn them from Bruce Banner to Hulk.
Ya, let them all do it. If I had a doctor keep track of my vitals and guiding me through it like athletes can have, I'd be on it right now. All it does is make me better, why the hell wouldn't I want this.

Equipment is different.
 
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angusyoung

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Meh. What if it's a cortisone shot? Why's that not considered cheating? It improves your physicality by reducing pain levels that would hurt your performance.
Steroids help you recover quicker so you can train harder, but it's not like it'll turn them from Bruce Banner to Hulk.
Ya, let them all do it. If I had a doctor keep track of my vitals and guiding me through it like athletes can have, I'd be on it right now. All it does is make me better, why the hell wouldn't I want this.

Equipment is different.

Cortisone is used in the treatment of injury. Use of steroids to treat injury etc,sure, if it's purpose is to heal in that manner.

A lot of people believe in clean living,no drugs,no nothing not to mention people of faith and religion.

In which sense would steroids make you better? to do what?

Why is equipment different,it enhances performance.
 

Kriss E

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Cortisone is used in the treatment of injury. Use of steroids to treat injury etc,sure, if it's purpose is to heal in that manner.

A lot of people believe in clean living,no drugs,no nothing not to mention people of faith and religion.
Why is it okay to use it for injuries? It's not natural either way. It's a drug.
Whoever doesn't want to take them don't have to. It's not like a regular joe is going to take roids and jump up the ladder to become a top world athlete.

In which sense would steroids make you better? to do what?
Well if they don't make you better than who cares?
Why is equipment different,it enhances performance.
Because it's not internal, but hey, I don't particularly care about those rules either. You're allowed to wear gloves for improved grip in baseball, batters can even apply pine tar, but pitchers can't...Pretty silly.
I don't mind if they allowed curves to be rounded more on hockey sticks, or if pads were a bit bigger, Halak isn't going to become Hasek thanks to that. Then again, there's a limit, looking like a tank a la Garth Snow is just ridiculous.
 

angusyoung

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Why is it okay to use it for injuries? It's not natural either way. It's a drug.
Whoever doesn't want to take them don't have to. It's not like a regular joe is going to take roids and jump up the ladder to become a top world athlete.


Well if they don't make you better than who cares?

Because it's not internal, but hey, I don't particularly care about those rules either. You're allowed to wear gloves for improved grip in baseball, batters can even apply pine tar, but pitchers can't...Pretty silly.
I don't mind if they allowed curves to be rounded more on hockey sticks, or if pads were a bit bigger, Halak isn't going to become Hasek thanks to that. Then again, there's a limit, looking like a tank a la Garth Snow is just ridiculous.

What else you want to do with injuries and illness,just leave them to rot. Drugs etc are fine for treatment and quality of life of individuals that need them,not for healthy individuals looking for an edge up.

It was pertaining to pro athletes and Olympic athletes,who cares about joe smuck. I could care less what an individual does to themselves as long as they are not hurting anybody else.

Well if you don't feel ''right'' maybe some form of a medical examination is required as to why.

You'll have to pardon my departure as I have to prep for a potentially lucrative golf outing and I still have some beer and bumps to take care of.
 
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Kriss E

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What else you want to do with injuries and illness,just leave them to rot. Drugs etc are fine for treatment and quality of life of individuals that need them,not for healthy individuals looking for an edge up.
Cortisone doesn't heal the injury. It's a booster mate, it removes pain.

It was pertaining to pro athletes and Olympic athletes,who cares about joe smuck. I could care less what an individual does to themselves as long as they are not hurting anybody else.

Well if you don't feel ''right'' maybe some form of a medical examination is required as to why.

You'll have to pardon my departure as I have to prep for a potentially lucrative golf outing and I still have some beer and bumps to take care of.
Who cares about any of them really...
I don't watch sport to see greatness, as I said, I'll watch Mcgwire vs Sosa juiced up going for 70 home runs while you watch the guys hitting 40ish ''clean''.
I want to see the Lance Armstrong, Ben Johnson, Andreea Raducan, Marion Jones, and the likes. I really don't give a crap if they're on PEDs or not.
 

Kriss E

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May 3, 2007
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Jeddah
I didnt eat much and I did do some cardio (Mostly the NSFW kind, but I also ran and did some bicycle.)

I don't feel weak or anything though, in fact I feel much better than during my peak week just last week.

Even if you fasted for a week...that's almost 20lbs mate. A lot of it must have been water I guess.
 

Kriss E

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Shabs

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Any advice re. a program to grow
my chest? It's been slow going for me it seems.
 

DAChampion

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Any advice re. a program to grow
my chest? It's been slow going for me it seems.

It all depends of the level you're at and how long you've been training for.

Progressive overload is the key though. On which variable depends highly of your training age and actual level.
 
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HabsTown

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Thanks! Definitely not going near 315 at my current weight though hehe (178).

I know of a guy who has crazy strength. Like legit crazy strength. Repped 315 x 5 at 175 pounds on the bench. Deadlifts 500 pretty easily too (sumo).

That just boggles my mind.

After years of training, you could. Obviously genetics play a role. Keep grinding.

At my leanest, years ago, I was 165 pounds 8-9% BF (legit BF%, shredded).

I was benching 275-280 for 8-10 reps + Deadlifting 475+ for 6-8 reps. People were starring before each set, good old time haha. I was working out at CEPSUM (UdeM gym) which is a pretty big gym.

I’ve lost almost a whole year of training with COVID, that sucks so bad...can’t do it at home.
 

Shabs

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It all depends of the level you're at and how long you've been training for.

Progressive overload is the key though. On which variable depends highly of your training age and actual level.
Let's say middle-age, beginner - intermediate
 

Shabs

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Nov 16, 2017
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Incline work is the king of all chest growers.

Source i have chesticles.
Any recommendation re. Best press and what degree of incline ? What I've been doing for the past 6 month seems to be going slow
 
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