I wish I had your optimism. What pipeline? And even if I am wrong what are the chances the Flyers play the prospects? You don't sign Yandle and Thompson if you are planning on giving the prospects a real chance. In every deal he does he pays a premium. It's a sad time to be a Flyers fan.....
Fire(d) Fletcher
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What youre seeing isnt 'optimism' its... something else.
deadhead
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Signing veterans to minimum salary deals doesn't block prospects since those contracts can be easily buried or the player waived (and at minimum salary there will be takers).
deadhead
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Imagine intentionally sticking your head in the sand this much.
Imagine constantly turning molehills into mountains.
We've already seen shitty vets block able prospects. Weve already seen this organization consistently choose shittier players over better ones. I have no interest in re-hashing all these arguments with you when you consistently default to "this is what the coach/GM said, so they must be right".
deadhead
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Who exactly was blocked? This is more myth than reality.
NAK? As we've seen, inconsistent in the AHL, inconsistent in the NHL. Was sent down for Bunnaman and Twarynski, both of whom got shots at winning a 4th line job. So did Vorobyev - all failed.
Sanheim? Wasn't NHL ready as a rookie, played much better after he returned from the AHL, sheltered with Gudas.
Myers?
Farabee?
Provorov?
Hagg?
TK?
Where's the list of prospects blocked in Philly who went on to greater things like Sharp, Seidenberg and Williams?
This is what I mean by "myth,"
NAK? As we've seen, inconsistent in the AHL, inconsistent in the NHL. Was sent down for Bunnaman and Twarynski, both of whom got shots at winning a 4th line job. So did Vorobyev - all failed.
Sanheim? Wasn't NHL ready as a rookie, played much better after he returned from the AHL, sheltered with Gudas.
Myers?
Farabee?
Provorov?
Hagg?
TK?
Where's the list of prospects blocked in Philly who went on to greater things like Sharp, Seidenberg and Williams?
This is what I mean by "myth,"
Beef Invictus
Revolutionary Positivity
Was sent down for Stewart. Let's not lie about what happened.
Oh, and all of them outplayed Stewart. Had Stewart played at an AHL instead of ECHL level then he stays on the roster all year, because that's how the Flyers work. Inferior veterans are always gifted chances at the expense of youth, who exist not to be developed but to be backups to veterans. If they happen to force their way into the roster because they play at a level impossible to ignore that's a nice bonus, but certainly not the team's development goal.
We've watched this for many years. It is nakedly obvious.
Like I said, I'm not going to go through all this again in detail because you default back to " he wasn't ready as deemed by management" as some sort of blanket excuse.
Morin outplayed Hagg years ago, they sent Morin down and kept Hagg.
Sanheim out played Hagg, they sent Sanheim down. 17 AHL games magically made him NHL ready, I presume?
Friedman outplayed Hagg, and was the correct handedness of AVs preferred system- if you can call it that - and they still sent him down and waived him.
Ghost out played Hagg at every step. He was even our best defender last year according to your own self admitted way of evaluating defensemen.
Stewart should have never been on the roster. Give his limited icetime to someone who may actually have something to show.
Frost outplayed Thompson, and no, it doesn't matter that Frost was sent down before his acquisition- all that proves is that they were terrible at talent evaluation earlier than they even needed to be..
I can literally do this all day. Unfortunately, I prefer to have hockey conversations with those who don't blindly follow management decisions as "what's best", so you'll have to settle for the above.
Beef Invictus
Revolutionary Positivity
Management has been so successful for so long I can see why you'd assume all their evaluations are flawless
These chuckleheads really think this team is well ran.
A lot of ‘your opinion’ on who played better than who - apparently the team disagrees - or they’re looking for a specific skill set they felt Haag possessed more than the others
As has been stated endlessly - Ghost was turned down by every team in the league in trades, then turned down for free by every team in the league, then turned down for free by Seattle, then turned down by every team in the league again for anything short of giving up draft picks to go along with him - at some point - it isn’t the Flyers mgmt stating this - its the entire league that thinks there’s a problem with him
Frost isn’t here to be a penalty killing 4th line center who brings a physical edge (admittedly Thompson isn’t terribly physical either) - so not sure why Thompson is holding Frost back in your mind - Frost is a scoring center - he’s competing for the 1-3 center spots - not with Thompson - seems the team has left the 3C spot open for him if he can take it
Fletcher apparently felt the team needed more experienced players to guide the current group of young players - when the defense lost Niskanen they fell apart and it looks like Braun wasn’t enough to help them grow - so he’s investing not just in experienced players - but players that can help the young defense group grow and learn
Thompson also helps keep Giroux and other players off the PK
Do I love all the moves? No - but it appears he’s addressing the youth of the team by bringing in new leaders to mentor them (I believe most had assistant captain experience and are known for great work ethic), and he’s changing the culture of the locker room
There’s only so many roster spots on the Flyers and Phantoms to fill with players - pick the best that match what you want and you use the rest to improve the team through trades - if Frost, York, etc are good enough - they’ll play over the older players (some of whom have short / inexpensive contracts anyway)
Will it work? No idea - but will be interesting to watch this year…
deadhead
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You're the one who can't keep his facts straight. By TOI:
1st game: bottom four - Twarynski, Bunnaman, Raffl, Pitlick
2nd game: bottom four - Twarynski, Pitlick, Raffl, Bunnaman
3rd game: bottom four - Pitlick, Twarynski, Raffl, Bunnaman
4th game: bottom four - Raffl, Pitlick, Stewart, Twarynski
5th game: bottom four - Raffl, Pitlick, Bunnaman, Twarynski
6th game: bottom four - Pitlick, Raffl, Stewart, Twarynski - back from long road trip
7th game: bottom four - Farabee, JVR, Raffl, Vorobyev, Stewart [Pitlick injured]
8th game: bottom four - TK, Raffl, Vorobyev, Stewart
9th game: bottom four - Farabee, Vorobyev, Stewart, Laughton
10th game: bottom four - Pitlick, Raffl, Vorobyev, Stewart
11th game: bottom four - Farabee, Pitlick, Stewart, Vorobyev
12th game: bottom four - Lindblom, Twarynski, Stewart, Rubtsov
13th game: bottom four - Raffl, Pitlick, Twarynski, Rubtsov
after that Stewart played 7 games primarily as an injury fill in as the 12th forward.
Twarynski, not Stewart, blocked NAK.
Farabee was called up before NAK, as was Vorobyev and Rubtsov.
- Sep 28, 2014
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Unfortunately, 5 of our 6 came between 2010 and 2012. I never thought i'd live through 9 going on 10 years of 1 playoff series win as a Flyers fan.
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Beef Invictus
Revolutionary Positivity
They needed a place to put Stewart. That place was the slot NAK had earned by outplaying Stewart.
Fletcher was on a quest to have Stewart on the team. He went out of his way to shoehorn him in, when there was no reason to bring in that group of crap to begin with.
Once again: the prospects exist to be backups to the trash veterans. Not to be developed into depth roster roles.
Audible Velvet
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And the seasons, they go round and round
And the painted ponies go up and down
We're captive on the carousel of time
We can't return, we can only look
Behind from where we came
And go round and round and round in the circle game
And the painted ponies go up and down
We're captive on the carousel of time
We can't return, we can only look
Behind from where we came
And go round and round and round in the circle game
deadhead
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They were not going to put NAK in the pressbox, which was Stewart's slot. Teams prefer veterans there, and the kids in the AHL, refining their game, if they can't win a starting job.
Twarynski had outplayed NAK in TC, as had Farabee.
They also gave Bunnaman, Vorobyev and Frost a shot at the 4C/3C spot, all failed.
What stands out the last two years is how aggressive the Flyers have been in giving young players shots at winning jobs.
Frost was handed a starting job last year, got hurt.
Allison and Laczynski after a AHL cameo were both put in the starting lineup.
Bunnaman got 18 more games to win a starting spot.
Friedman is the only "prospect" who never got an extensive stretch to show he belonged, and it's pretty evident there were something going on behind the scene - normally players don't take runs at former teammates when they part amicably.
Twarynski had outplayed NAK in TC, as had Farabee.
They also gave Bunnaman, Vorobyev and Frost a shot at the 4C/3C spot, all failed.
What stands out the last two years is how aggressive the Flyers have been in giving young players shots at winning jobs.
Frost was handed a starting job last year, got hurt.
Allison and Laczynski after a AHL cameo were both put in the starting lineup.
Bunnaman got 18 more games to win a starting spot.
Friedman is the only "prospect" who never got an extensive stretch to show he belonged, and it's pretty evident there were something going on behind the scene - normally players don't take runs at former teammates when they part amicably.
Flyerfan4life
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The guy in the press box always plays, therefore you want the guy in the press box to be of some quality; NAK should have gotten that spot. They wanted Stewart there because they wanted him to play. They thought he was good enough to play. They missed very badly, and Fletcher even admitted it eventually.
Stewart got the spot despite NAK being better because they are biased towards veterans and against any youth that don't absolutely blow the doors off or play like washed up veterans.
The Flyers are not run on merit.
deadhead
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No you don't. LHV is a 2 hour drive from the rink, if you need a replacement for more than a couple games you call a kid up, otherwise you want to avoid yo-yo'ing prospects, having them get limited PT and miss a lot of practice time.
Six rookies got more PT than Stewart and Andreoff in 2019-2020, so much for "blocking" players.
Yes, they're biased against prospects getting 6-8 minutes a night b/c they're not good enough to play serious minutes on a playoff contender when they could be playing 15-18 minutes a night in LHV. That's why young players need to take advantage of their opportunity to play in the NHL and show they belong - compare Frost's 20 game cameo with Allison's 14 games.
Beef Invictus
Revolutionary Positivity
Easy solution, don't yoyo NAK. Keep him there. The press box guys play routinely. He would have played. No need to send him down, it's not like there's anything left for him to develop in the NHL anyway. Just give him that Stewart spot instead of crowbarring Stewart in. This isnt hard. Stewart was the first choice backup guaranteed to play despite being the worst of the bunch. It was an error made due to bias, devoid of merit.
The only reason Stewart ended up buried is because he was so incredibly bad. If he plays at even a slightly higher level, theyd have happily kept him and played him over better players. We've seen it before.
You're bending over backwards to defend a move that Fletcher said was a mistake. You're disagreeing with Fletcher in your quest to defend everything he does.
If NAK was drafted by Tampa he'd absolutely have 300 NHL games by now. This organization is a joke.
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